Author Topic: The UN Needs To Go  (Read 331 times)

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Offline the_squid

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2019, 02:27:56 pm »
Waldo.  Health isn't included - like mosquito nets.  Is that because it's a sister organization?

“Halting the spread of epidemics”

Offline waldo

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2019, 05:44:30 pm »
Waldo.  Health isn't included - like mosquito nets.  Is that because it's a sister organization?

following up on member squid's correct attachment; and yes, WHO - World Health Organization: "The World Health Organization is a specialized agency of the United Nations that is concerned with international public health."

67. Halting the Spread of Epidemics

The World Health Organization helped to stop the spread of severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS). In March 2003, it issued a global alert and emergency travel advisory, and its leadership helped to stop this new disease, which had the potential to become a worldwide epidemic. WHO investigates over 200 disease outbreaks each year, 15 to 20 of which require an international response. Some of the more prominent diseases for which WHO is leading the global response include Ebola, meningitis, yellow fever, cholera and influenza, including avian influenza.

as an aside, the list wasn't intended to be all-encompassing; it derives from the UN's 2015 70th anniversary: 70 Ways the UN Makes A Difference
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Offline segnosaur

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2019, 10:46:44 am »
Agreed there is a lot of things wrong with the UN, but don't discount the vast amount of good things they do. From international standardization, and cooperation on things like air travel, shipping, and more recently road vehicles. They are involved in many humanitarian efforts like peacekeeping, disaster relief and health care. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
There may have been some good things that have been done under the banner of the U.N. I guess to me the question is, would the stuff still have gotten done had the U.N. not existed.

Yes, there have been several successful U.N. peacekeeping missions... but if the U.N. didn't exist, its possible that other organizations would step up to fulfill the mission. For example, peacekeeping in Somalia was largely done by the African Union (they were acting with the permission of the U.N. security council, but it was still largely an A.U. mission.)

And yes, there have been U.N. humanitarian missions. But plenty of international aid gets provided directly by donor countries, and without U.N., donor countries could increase the amount of direct aid.

Something like the World Health Organization does good work, but they could possibly be established as an independent organization (with a membership that reflects the current U.N.)

Offline MH

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2019, 11:02:07 am »
Any other organization is sink to the same factors and pressures.

Offline segnosaur

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2019, 11:39:29 am »
Any other organization is sink to the same factors and pressures.
Maybe, maybe not.

If (for example) the U.N. was broken up into independent organizations (such as the World Health Organization, the Civil Aviation Organization, etc.) then member states could contribute to their upkeep. (And there would likely be widespread support for them, since their activities are largely non-political, and there haven't been any major scandals, at least that I'm aware of.)

Organizations that are more scandal-prone, or more political in nature (such as UNESCO) might be forced to clean up their acts, since they wouldn't be under the U.N. banner.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2019, 01:18:36 pm »
I guess to me the question is, would the stuff still have gotten done had the U.N. not existed.

Some of the stuff perhaps, but what you are really suggesting is a "free enterprise" model. We know they do some things well, but they tend to be very focused and leave huge wholes in coverage.

Offline Granny

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2019, 06:32:48 pm »
The UN Conventions are a huge achievement, aspirational documents perhaps, but international touchstones and principles nonetheless.

AN OVERVIEW OF RELEVANT CONVENTIONS & TREATIES RELATED TO CANADA  AND THE UNITED NATIONS
https://ccla.org/canada-the-un/
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« Last Edit: July 09, 2019, 06:59:42 pm by Granny »

Offline MH

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2019, 09:16:19 pm »
Aaand Scheer says he will continue to pursue a security council seat  ;D

Offline wilber

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2019, 09:33:25 pm »
Aaand Scheer says he will continue to pursue a security council seat  ;D

Why?
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC

Offline Granny

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2019, 10:04:31 pm »
Why?

Because his backers make money from wars.
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Offline eyeball

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2019, 12:17:24 am »
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/geoffrey-clarfield-the-united-nations-is-losing-staggering-sums-to-corruption-mismanagement-and-bad-decision-making


This is one (another) reason why I no longer care for Canada cozying up to the UN, nor going along with its "recommendations" for countries. In 2015 when Saudi Arabia was chosen to head the Human Rights panel and in 2017 again when it was chosen for the Women's Rights Commission - what a joke.  They no longer have any true concern for the countries they advise, it's just another old, rich, men-with-little-dingdongs club.

It no longer is doing what its supposed to be doing and I think it needs to go.
Before we fulfill those lucrative LAV contracts we have with with-the little-Saudi-dingdongs or after?
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Offline waldo

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #26 on: July 10, 2019, 12:53:17 am »
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/geoffrey-clarfield-the-united-nations-is-losing-staggering-sums-to-corruption-mismanagement-and-bad-decision-making
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It no longer is doing what its supposed to be doing and I think it needs to go.

your linked-to author is executive director of Mozuud, a Canadian non-profit organization that openly advocates on behalf of Israel. Look no further than ... by the by, since 1968, Israel has violated 32 UN resolutions that included condemnation or criticism of the Israeli governments' policies and actions. Is this what's called missing/pertinent perspective on the author/linked article?
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Offline MH

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #27 on: July 10, 2019, 07:20:29 am »
I'm going to optimistically say that the seat brings 'influence'.

But Scheer has a significant but small cadre of UN conspiracy people voting for him.

Offline eyeball

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Re: The UN Needs To Go
« Reply #28 on: July 10, 2019, 04:14:43 pm »
There may have been some good things that have been done under the banner of the U.N. I guess to me the question is, would the stuff still have gotten done had the U.N. not existed.

Yes, there have been several successful U.N. peacekeeping missions... but if the U.N. didn't exist, its possible that other organizations would step up to fulfill the mission. For example, peacekeeping in Somalia was largely done by the African Union (they were acting with the permission of the U.N. security council, but it was still largely an A.U. mission.)

And yes, there have been U.N. humanitarian missions. But plenty of international aid gets provided directly by donor countries, and without U.N., donor countries could increase the amount of direct aid.

Something like the World Health Organization does good work, but they could possibly be established as an independent organization (with a membership that reflects the current U.N.)
Anything is possible I suppose except the idea that Earth's nations should or even could unite seems virtually and increasingly verboten. Enough people simply hate and or fear the idea for it to ever get the traction it needs.  I suppose it's possible that a group of morally grounded nations with measurably verifiable integrity might coalesce around a civilized set of principled values but not these days, not even close.

I'm reminded of the question Dr. Ellie Arroway wanted to ask advanced aliens in the movie Contact - "How did you do it, how did your species survive it's adolescence?"
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