Author Topic: Socialism  (Read 394 times)

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Offline SuperColinBlow

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2017, 01:27:47 am »
What amuses me is the increasing number of American liberals who use the incredibly silly term "Democratic Socialism".
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Offline MH

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2017, 09:07:14 am »
What amuses me is the increasing number of American liberals who use the incredibly silly term "Democratic Socialism".

I'm assuming that this language is used to mark distance between Socialism as practiced in the USSR.  There is such a thing as Democratic Socialism, although it's a qualitative spectrum between Democratic Socialism, and Democratic Liberalism.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2017, 12:11:54 pm »
What amuses me is the increasing number of American liberals who use the incredibly silly term "Democratic Socialism".

Are they socialists? Or are they just slightly more liberal than usual?
Bernie was an avowed Socialist, but not really. His schtick seemed to be a page borrowed from Trudeau's playbook: Offer them whatever they want, without regard to what it costs or whether I can do it.
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Offline cybercoma

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2017, 09:42:44 pm »
There's social democrats, democratic socialists, socialists, communists, then Marxist-Leninists. These are all different things.

Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2017, 10:06:08 pm »
You need to define what you mean by "socialism". We can't have a free market society worth living in without some elements of "socialism". So the question is not socialism vs capitalism but how do we balance the conflicting requirements.

This.
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Offline wilber

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2017, 05:05:18 pm »
At what point does one become a socialist? At what point does one become a capitalist? I dunno, depends on who you ask I guess.
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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2017, 08:06:14 pm »
At what point does one become a socialist? At what point does one become a capitalist? I dunno, depends on who you ask I guess.

Yeah it's weird.  There's a very broad range for each.  Unless you're a hardcore laissez faire capitalist or a commie, you're very probably a mix of both.  That's why broad ideological generations in economics is dumb.  "Markets are good, government is bad" & vice versa is overly simplistic & naive.
I can tell how good of a person you are by how you treat the people you disagree with.
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Offline MH

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #22 on: September 14, 2017, 05:49:01 am »
Yeah it's weird.  There's a very broad range for each.  Unless you're a hardcore laissez faire capitalist or a commie, you're very probably a mix of both.  That's why broad ideological generations in economics is dumb.  "Markets are good, government is bad" & vice versa is overly simplistic & naive.

That.

On my Facebook feed, a centrist Conservative has become the defacto person whose wall is used for sober political discussion.  His mantra is "we basically agree on what kind of government we want, it's a matter of where we negotiate to put the financial sliders"

Offline MH

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2018, 04:57:06 pm »
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ev8gyz/its-no-accident-americans-are-still-broke-in-a-booming-economy

This is from July but still seems appropriate.  The next crash is going to hurt bad...
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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #24 on: October 04, 2018, 07:00:04 pm »
If you're a worker and think giant corporations make huge profits you're not sharing in with this booming economy, then there's this thing called the stock market where you can buy small pieces of these giant corporations and share in all the profits they do.  If you bought an ETF into the US S&P 500 5 years ago you would have doubled your money.

Most people are too stupid though.  Instead of buying an old used car (cars are a horrible investment) and buying an ETF or GIC with the money they save, they go buy ie: a car they can't really afford, which means wealth-sucking car payments every month so you can look cool.  I don't know how many people I know who make very modest salaries but drive a Mercedes or Audi etc.  TFSAs and RRSPs are there but many people don't use them.  But they'll use one of the big 5 banks, which give you horrible interest, compared to an online bank that can give you up to 2% interest on your savings...which people don't have anyways because they're maxing out their credit cards to go travel once or twice a year, which my parents never ever did when i was growing up but they did end up paying off their mortgage quite quickly.

Many Canadians are taking advantage of this hot market though, because housing prices have skyrocketed, meaning anyone owning a home in the last 5-10 yrs in a decent market, especially the "hardest places to live" like Vancity and TO has made a shit-ton of money.  As for young people, well, interest rates have been ridiculously low the last 10 years, so what's your excuse?
« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 07:03:35 pm by Poonlight Graham »
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Offline MH

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2018, 07:08:48 pm »
If you're a worker and think giant corporations make huge profits you're not sharing in with this booming economy, then there's this thing called the stock market where you can buy small pieces of these giant corporations and share in all the profits they do.  If you bought an ETF into the US S&P 500 5 years ago you would have doubled your money.

Good advice, Monopoly man.  How many houses should I buy for Park Place ?

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Most people are too stupid though.  Instead of buying an old used car (cars are a horrible investment) and buying an ETF or GIC with the money they save, they go buy ie: a car they can't really afford, which means wealth-sucking car payments every month so you can look cool.  I don't know how many people I know who make very modest salaries but drive a Mercedes or Audi etc.  TFSAs and RRSPs are there but many people don't use them.  But they'll use one of the big 5 banks, which give you horrible interest, compared to an online bank that can give you up to 2% interest on your savings...which people don't have anyways because they're maxing out their credit cards to go travel once or twice a year, which my parents never ever did when i was growing up but they did end up paying off their mortgage quite quickly.

Most people are stupid, so they shouldn't have the choice to trade away their health or basic rights for bad decisions.

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Many Canadians are taking advantage of this hot market though, because housing prices have skyrocketed, meaning anyone owning a home in the last 5-10 yrs in a decent market, especially the "hardest places to live" like Vancity and TO has made a shit-ton of money.  As for young people, well, interest rates have been ridiculously low the last 10 years, so what's your excuse?

Let's see.  I put my young wife through 5 years of University, survived my entire industry being outsourced and paid tens of thousands for IVF to have a kid.

Money well spent.  How are these Toronto millionaires going to cash out, exactly ?  Unless they move to Elliot Lake.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Socialism
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2018, 07:26:46 pm »
made a shit-ton of money

You don't make a cent until you sell, and if you have to buy into the same market you generally end up behind.