Author Topic: Russia vs Ukraine war  (Read 19792 times)

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Offline Black Dog

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #60 on: February 25, 2022, 01:51:41 pm »
It’s exactly what you did.  Ukraine offering non-aligned status is a legitimate way to possibly end the conflict.

It's not cheering on a war to point out that the solution isn't going to work, you piece of garbage. The "potential peaceful solution" has already been rejected by the Russian imperialists because they aren't interested in simply keeping Ukraine out of NATO. You should try listening to what these people are actually saying.



Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #61 on: February 25, 2022, 01:56:13 pm »
It's not cheering on a war to point out that the solution isn't going to work, you piece of garbage. The "potential peaceful solution" has already been rejected by the Russian imperialists because they aren't interested in simply keeping Ukraine out of NATO. You should try listening to what these people are actually saying.
How do you know it’s not going to work?  It might, or it might not.  It’s worked for other countries.  Sometimes I think you just try to be difficult.

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #62 on: February 25, 2022, 02:06:20 pm »
Finland and Sweden also have non-aligned status.

The difference is that a sovereign country shouldn’t have to make that decision under threat of invasion?

Are you really that dumb that you don’t understand, or do you take the view that Russia had a right to demand that sort of thing?
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Offline Black Dog

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #63 on: February 25, 2022, 02:11:32 pm »
How do you know it’s not going to work?  It might, or it might not.  It’s worked for other countries.  Sometimes I think you just try to be difficult.

"But Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Zelensky “is simply lying” when he offers to discuss non-aligned status for Ukraine. Lavrov said Zelensky “missed the opportunity” to discuss a neutral status for Ukraine in NATO when Russian President Vladimir Putin proposed it."

link

Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #64 on: February 25, 2022, 02:18:17 pm »
"But Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Zelensky “is simply lying” when he offers to discuss non-aligned status for Ukraine. Lavrov said Zelensky “missed the opportunity” to discuss a neutral status for Ukraine in NATO when Russian President Vladimir Putin proposed it."

link
There’s been differing reports.  They had agreed to peace talks.

That agreement came in response to Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s offer earlier in the day to discuss non-aligned status for Ukraine.
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-business-europe-united-nations-kyiv-6ccba0905f1871992b93712d3585f548

Offline Black Dog

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #65 on: February 25, 2022, 02:26:30 pm »
There’s been differing reports.  They had agreed to peace talks.

That agreement came in response to Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s offer earlier in the day to discuss non-aligned status for Ukraine.
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-business-europe-united-nations-kyiv-6ccba0905f1871992b93712d3585f548

Same thread: "The Kremlin accepted Kyiv’s offer to hold talks, but it appeared to be an effort to squeeze concessions out of Ukraine’s embattled president instead of a gesture toward a diplomatic solution."

Anyway I don't think the NATO stuff was every anything but pretext when you consider his speech the other day in which he claimed Ukraine as part of historic Russia. Now that they've invaded, they won't stop until they've replaced Zelensky and replaced him with a pro-Kremlin puppet.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2022, 02:31:05 pm by Black Dog »

Offline wilber

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #66 on: February 25, 2022, 02:31:06 pm »
It’s exactly what you did.  Ukraine offering non-aligned status is a legitimate way to possibly end the conflict.

Nothing at the point of a gun after an unprovoked attack is legitimate.
I suppose you also approve of confessions obtained by torture.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC
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Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #67 on: February 25, 2022, 02:34:48 pm »
Nothing at the point of a gun after an unprovoked attack is legitimate.
I suppose you also approve of confessions obtained by torture.
It’s legitimate in that it could lead to a peaceful solution.  Yes, sometimes, depending on the circumstances.
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Offline wilber

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #68 on: February 25, 2022, 02:36:50 pm »
Putin now calling Zelensky a Nazi.

A Jewish Nazi, how novel.
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Offline wilber

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #69 on: February 25, 2022, 02:38:15 pm »
It’s legitimate in that it could lead to a peaceful solution.  Yes, sometimes, depending on the circumstances.

Ok Ivan.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC
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Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #70 on: February 25, 2022, 02:47:16 pm »
Ok Ivan.
Weren’t you the one complaining about name calling etc?

Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #71 on: February 25, 2022, 02:49:10 pm »
Putin objecting to NATO at his border is a legitimate concern, whether people like it or not.

Offline wilber

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #72 on: February 25, 2022, 02:54:17 pm »
Putin objecting to NATO at his border is a legitimate concern, whether people like it or not.

It is a legitimate concern but his territorial aggression toward Ukraine in the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine also makes a good case for Ukraine wanting to join NATO. Ukraine has never presented a threat to Russia. Putin is a real threat to the sovereignty of many former Soviet republics.
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Offline wilber

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #73 on: February 25, 2022, 02:56:25 pm »
Weren’t you the one complaining about name calling etc?

Point taken. I just don't know how any sane person could think this would be a negotiation.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC
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Online Spike The Hike Shady

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Re: Russia vs Ukraine war
« Reply #74 on: February 25, 2022, 03:00:14 pm »
It is a legitimate concern but his territorial aggression toward Ukraine in the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine also makes a good case for Ukraine wanting to join NATO. Ukraine has never presented a threat to Russia. Putin is a real threat to the sovereignty of many former Soviet republics.
Yes, Ukraine has never posed a threat, but NATO has, in Putin’s opinion.  He’s watch as NATO has expanded and moved closer and closer to his borders, all while Russia has not been aggressive.  That changed in 2014.  NATO was created to counter the Soviet Union.  The Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, yet NATO remained in place and expanded significantly even when Russia was insignificant.
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