Author Topic: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)  (Read 17907 times)

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Offline waldo

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #840 on: April 10, 2020, 01:59:59 am »
the daily Trump COVID-19 taskforce briefings have devolved into, for the most part, Trump campaign style rally's... to the point where networks stopped showing them in their entirety. CNN was most particular in how it adopted coverage and, for all of Trump's pointed attacks against CNN as "fake news" (even these last weeks and within the briefings themselves), there has been a Trump/Pence reaction:

Pence's office blocks public health officials from appearing on CNN

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Vice President Mike Pence's office has declined to allow the nation's top health officials to appear on CNN in recent days and discuss the coronavirus pandemic killing thousands of Americans, in an attempt to pressure the network into carrying the White House's lengthy daily briefings in full.

Pence's office, which is responsible for booking the officials on networks during the pandemic, said it will only allow experts such as Dr. Deborah Birx or Dr. Anthony Fauci to appear on CNN if the network televises the portion of the White House briefings that includes the vice president and other coronavirus task force members.
CNN often only broadcasts President Donald Trump's question and answer session, which sometimes includes the health care officials, live on-air.

After Trump leaves the podium, CNN frequently cuts out of the White House briefing to discuss and fact-check what the President had said. A CNN executive said that the network usually returns to such programming because of the extensive length of the full briefing that includes Pence, which can run in excess of two hours.

cause... having the top medical experts address the public and take pointed questions from CNN personnel is the last thing the American public needs!

Offline Shady

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #841 on: April 10, 2020, 09:10:52 am »
China's efforts to cover up the SARS outbreak even after Dec 31 when it was clear they knew what they had on their hands are unforgivable.

Wuhan is a city of apparently 11 million, it's an international business hub, it's a tourist destination for Yangtze River cruises apparently. Countless people would have come and gone from Wuhan during December.

If you don't recognize that their efforts to cover up the virus outbreak during that time are betrayal of their responsibility to not just their own citizens but to the rest of the world as well, then you need a kind of help I just can't give you.

As for John McCallum... if you don't like being compared to John McCallum, stop acting like John McCallum.

As for scumbag lawyering... if you don't like the accusation of scumbag lawyering, then stop lawyering for scumbags.  I'm completely baffled by your determination to make excuses for Chinese animal traffickers and "traditional Chinese medicine" practitioners.


 -k
Yes, for some reason some people have taken to defending Chinaís irresponsible behaviour.  China at best was grossly irresponsible, and at worst purposely deceitful.  They tried to cover their mess up as long as they could, until it wasnít possible anymore.  The data they initially released indicted an outbreak something similar to SARS, when it was much much worse.  As a result, other countries, particularly in Europe were caught completely unprepared.  Itís time that countries banded together and cancel some of their debt that China holds.  Itís the only way to ensure that China takes the right steps in the future.  As this is the third pandemic to arise in China in recent times.  Enough is enough.
Anti-herd is the new anti-vaxx.  Sweden did it right.

Offline Shady

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #842 on: April 10, 2020, 09:17:00 am »
the waldo suggests member kimmy exercise caution in blindly accepting ALL statements critical of China - given the voracious appetite Trumpites have in deflecting Trump failures/incompetence toward China... in influencing the narrative cast by compliant media towards China failures (instead of Trump failures), thinking persons should be very diligent in source selection. As an example re-quoted above, I've already challenged you (several times with re-posts) to present a reputable sourced timeline that draws distinction between what China did (or didn't do) in terms of domestic versus international obligations... where I, in particular ask you to relate your implied missing international obligations.

for reference: China locked down the city of Wuhan (11 million people) on January 23rd... the same day other cities within the province of Hubei were also locked down (impacting upon a total population of 57 million people).

one of Trump's latest go-to azz-coverings is to repeatedly state he was first to impose a travel ban from China. Point in fact, Italy imposed a ban on flights from China on 31 January... the U.S. followed 4 days later; most pointedly, Italy enacted a full ban, while the U.S. policy was only a restriction, with wide exemptions. Just yesterday scientists have advised the source origin of the virus impacting upon the U.S. northeast coastal states was from Europe, not China.

I have no like... or dislike for either. I'm quite content to emphasize your repeated usage of the tags... particularly as you think them pertinent!  ;D I expect by your nattering repeat references to Huawei, you're so troubled by McCallum's foot-in-mouth (non-diplomatic) comments about the U.S. extradition request against Meng Wanzhou... I personally think he was right in his statements concerning her case to fight extradition. Not for this thread, but if you feel emboldened, McCallum's arguments to fight the extradition are public knowledge... make sure you take those on, hey! And also make sure you speak to the UK decision to align with Huawei's 5G - I mean, clearly you're troubled with the company!  ;D

as for your repeated want to label me as 'scumbag lawyering', I've not said word one... NOT WORD ONE... in favour of, as you say, "Chinese animal traffickers and traditional Chinese medicine practitioners". Clearly your peanutBrain infers my challenge to your unsubstantiated certainty that the origin point/source is the Wuhan market, is me advocating! Get a grip, member kimmy - get a grip!
Stop carrying water for an authoritarian government.  And stop disseminating Chinese government propaganda.  Stop letting your dislike for Trump cloud your ability to think logically.  Pretend Trump doesnít even exist when you evaluate China.  Pretend Obama is president if you have to.  Just because one holds China rightly accountable for their actions doesnít mean that they love Trump.  You can both criticize Trump, and criticize China at the same time.  Itís not an either or.
Anti-herd is the new anti-vaxx.  Sweden did it right.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #843 on: April 10, 2020, 10:09:01 am »
Stop carrying water for an authoritarian government.  And stop disseminating Chinese government propaganda.  Stop letting your dislike for Trump cloud your ability to think logically.  Pretend Trump doesnít even exist when you evaluate China.  Pretend Obama is president if you have to.  Just because one holds China rightly accountable for their actions doesnít mean that they love Trump.  You can both criticize Trump, and criticize China at the same time.  Itís not an either or.

ya ya, says the Trump proponent - you! The waldo has never said China is above criticism; however, some members on this board aspire to fact-based testimony... should be a refreshing difficult change for you! My exercise caution stands - none of which is your described, "carrying water or disseminating propaganda"! Perhaps you could take up the challenge member kimmy has (repeatedly) ignored; but note, your sources will be heavily scrutinized as to their legitimacy.

the waldo suggests member kimmy exercise caution in blindly accepting ALL statements critical of China - given the voracious appetite Trumpites have in deflecting Trump failures/incompetence toward China... in influencing the narrative cast by compliant media towards China failures (instead of Trump failures), thinking persons should be very diligent in source selection. As an example re-quoted above, I've already challenged you (several times with re-posts) to present a reputable sourced timeline that draws distinction between what China did (or didn't do) in terms of domestic versus international obligations... where I, in particular ask you to relate your implied missing international obligations.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #844 on: April 10, 2020, 10:19:26 am »
member Shady - this thread includes several references to Trump/admin (and MAGAites) purposely labeling the COVID-19 virus as "the Chinese virus... as the Wuhan virus" - to the point Trump had to, repeatedly, give notice to "coincident" attacks (verbal and physical) on Chinese/Asian Americans. Will member Shady continue in that vein?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XizsaCNaHc

Offline eyeball

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #845 on: April 10, 2020, 10:39:47 am »
Yes, for some reason some people have taken to defending Chinaís irresponsible behaviour.  China at best was grossly irresponsible, and at worst purposely deceitful.  They tried to cover their mess up as long as they could, until it wasnít possible anymore.  The data they initially released indicted an outbreak something similar to SARS, when it was much much worse.  As a result, other countries, particularly in Europe were caught completely unprepared.  Itís time that countries banded together and cancel some of their debt that China holds.  Itís the only way to ensure that China takes the right steps in the future.  As this is the third pandemic to arise in China in recent times.  Enough is enough.
And yet you insist we continue strengthening the most dangerous powerful dictatorship on the planet by selling it as much oil as we possibly can.

Does anyone else recall a point in time when we used to go out of our way to prevent oil from falling into the hands of communist dictatorships?  Why did we do that then but not now? What's changed?

Offline Shady

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #846 on: April 10, 2020, 10:52:02 am »
And yet you insist we continue strengthening the most dangerous powerful dictatorship on the planet by selling it as much oil as we possibly can.

Does anyone else recall a point in time when we used to go out of our way to prevent oil from falling into the hands of communist dictatorships?  Why did we do that then but not now? What's changed?
No, Iíve never said as much as we can.  But Iím absolutely for selling them oil, with strings attached.  Because it makes us stronger.  Especially if theyíre dependent on us.
Anti-herd is the new anti-vaxx.  Sweden did it right.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #847 on: April 10, 2020, 11:18:09 am »
In terms of raw numbers, they {the U.S.} have tested more people.  They also have tests that provide results in 15 minutes.

wait a minute... what about Trump's boastful pledge that, 'everyone who wants a test, gets a test'? And the complete lack of early testing when most needed - you know, when Trump was ignoring/downplaying the virus for those LOST 2 months!

wait a second minute: what happened to Jared's must touted drive-through enterprise - that as of just days ago, has resulted in a grand total of 5 drive through locations across the entire U.S.. Sure, sure, manBoyKushner needed something to do given his monumental failures in his roles attempting to solve the opioid crisis and the Israel-Palestine conflict... and Trump only hires the best!  ;D

wait a third minute: what about all the uproar over Trump pulling federal funding for state-level testing sites? To the point that the intense backlash to the funding pull-back only resulted in a rescind of that intent... last night! 

wait a... another minute: what about the lack of U.S. federal oversight in providing testing standards (including metrics)... to the point the U.S. CDC was forced to stop a national tracking of testing given the wide disparity in how testing is being done at the state level?

Trump, Kushner, and Navarro - the Dunning-Kruger trifecta!

Offline Shady

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #848 on: April 10, 2020, 11:50:05 am »
member Shady - this thread includes several references to Trump/admin (and MAGAites) purposely labeling the COVID-19 virus as "the Chinese virus... as the Wuhan virus" - to the point Trump had to, repeatedly, give notice to "coincident" attacks (verbal and physical) on Chinese/Asian Americans. Will member Shady continue in that vein?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XizsaCNaHc
Referring to it as the Wuhan virus isnít incorrect.  Just as referring to the Spanish flu or West Nile virus isnít incorrect either.  Trump was referring to it as the China virus after China tried to blame the U.S. military for the virusí origin.  Regardless, attacks like this are wrong. 
Anti-herd is the new anti-vaxx.  Sweden did it right.

Offline Bubbermiley

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #849 on: April 10, 2020, 12:02:58 pm »
Actually the Spanish flu may have originated in Kansas and H1N1 in a U.S. pig factory.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2020, 12:05:42 pm by Bubbermiley »

Offline waldo

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #850 on: April 10, 2020, 12:15:41 pm »
Referring to it as the Wuhan virus isnít incorrect.

factualWaldo protip: 2015 - WHO established best practices for naming of new human infectious diseases

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WHO, in consultation and collaboration with the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE) and the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations (FAO), has identified best practices for the naming of new human diseases, with the aim to minimize unnecessary negative impact of disease names on trade, travel, tourism or animal welfare, and avoid causing offence to any cultural, social, national, regional, professional or ethnic groups.

per the official WHO announcement - naming the coronavirus disease (COVID-19) and the virus that causes it

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Official names for the virus responsible for COVID-19 (previously known as ď2019 novel coronavirusĒ) and the disease it causes.

Disease: coronavirus disease (COVID-19)

Virus: severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2)

Offline Shady

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #851 on: April 10, 2020, 12:16:14 pm »
Actually the Spanish flu may have originated in Kansas and H1N1 in a U.S. pig factory.
How about Ebola or West Nile?
Anti-herd is the new anti-vaxx.  Sweden did it right.

Online wilber

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #852 on: April 10, 2020, 12:16:39 pm »
Actually the Spanish flu may have originated in Kansas and H1N1 in a U.S. pig factory.
May have, there are a couple of other theories as well.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC

Online wilber

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #853 on: April 10, 2020, 12:18:25 pm »
Double post.
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Online wilber

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Re: Outbreak Culture
« Reply #854 on: April 10, 2020, 12:25:00 pm »
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/covid-19-government-documents-1.5528726


https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/coronavirus-pandemic-covid-canadian-military-intelligence-wuhan-1.5528381

No surprise but most western countries were slow out of the gate on this.
Just goes to show, a good virus loves a PC society.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2020, 12:38:22 pm by wilber »
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC