Author Topic: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)  (Read 16005 times)

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Offline cybercoma

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1800 on: August 06, 2020, 08:08:22 am »
Other countries are locking up contracts with drug companies for vaccines. Has Canada or are we staking everything on the CanSino vaccine which might be withheld by the Chinese government? We've ordered 37 million syringes but will there be anything to put in them?
It was announced yesterday that we did.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1801 on: August 06, 2020, 08:30:56 am »
So we finally secured some prospective vaccines. As usual, a day late and a dollar short.
What does this even mean? Is there a problem with the contracts? Care to elaborate because you sound like one of those people that complains when they don't do something then complains when they do. If it doesn't matter what they do either way, then you're not arguing in good faith--you're just being partisan.
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Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1802 on: August 06, 2020, 09:15:12 am »
What does this even mean? Is there a problem with the contracts? Care to elaborate because you sound like one of those people that complains when they don't do something then complains when they do. If it doesn't matter what they do either way, then you're not arguing in good faith--you're just being partisan.

Not so. The Oxford vaccine has been the front runner from the beginning because of their MERS research. While Trudeau was having another Kumbaya moment preaching equal distribution of vaccines, other countries have been pro active ensuring their supplies. Canada did nothing.

Now we are at the mercy  of the US government and American big pharma again. The US secured their 30O million doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine on May 20th as Canada sat on its hands. Chinese are holding up research samples of the CANSINO vaccine (Meng again?) If these vaccines are successful will an American government allow their export before US needs are supplied? Don’t expect a Biden administration to be much different from Trump on this issue. The Oxford vaccine will be sold at cost until the pandemic is over, that was a condition of them releasing their research to an industry partner and why they have no US partners. I doubt very much US big pharma will be so generous.

Early access to a good vaccine will enable countries to open up their economies and borders. Those that don’t have them will struggle and may find borders closed to them. Expect proof of immunization to be a condition of entry to developed countries as in the days before smallpox was eradicated.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1803 on: August 06, 2020, 11:29:15 am »
Not so. The Oxford vaccine has been the front runner from the beginning because of their MERS research. While Trudeau was having another Kumbaya moment preaching equal distribution of vaccines, other countries have been pro active ensuring their supplies. Canada did nothing.

no - as I read, initial results from the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine showed common moderate adverse effects... when moving into Phase 3 trials, some groups were added to include paracetamol (acetaminophen)... possibly suggestive of a concern for tolerability. As for your "doing nothing", Canada now has agreements with manufacturers of 2 of the 6 'candidate vaccines' that have moved into Phase 3 trials.

Now we are at the mercy  of the US government and American big pharma again. The US secured their 30O million doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine on May 20th as Canada sat on its hands. Chinese are holding up research samples of the CANSINO vaccine (Meng again?) If these vaccines are successful will an American government allow their export before US needs are supplied? Don’t expect a Biden administration to be much different from Trump on this issue. The Oxford vaccine will be sold at cost until the pandemic is over, that was a condition of them releasing their research to an industry partner and why they have no US partners. I doubt very much US big pharma will be so generous.

last I was aware, Pfizer is a German company. By the by, the U.S. has also reached additional agreements with the same 2 manufacturers/vaccines that Canada just announced. Something about diversification... cause its too soon to presume upon the eventual first/best candidate as you are doing - ya think!

Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1804 on: August 06, 2020, 11:48:49 am »
no - as I read, initial results from the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine showed common moderate adverse effects... when moving into Phase 3 trials, some groups were added to include paracetamol (acetaminophen)... possibly suggestive of a concern for tolerability. As for your "doing nothing", Canada now has agreements with manufacturers of 2 of the 6 'candidate vaccines' that have moved into Phase 3 trials.


The Moderna vaccine has also had side effects. I wouldn't be surprised if all these vaccines will require two shots because of the side effects of a single large dose.

Quote
last I was aware, Pfizer is a German company. By the by, the U.S. has also reached additional agreements with the same 2 manufacturers/vaccines that Canada just announced. Something about diversification... cause its too soon to presume upon the eventual first/best candidate as you are doing - ya think!

Nope

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Pfizer Inc. is an American multinational pharmaceutical corporation headquartered in New York City. It is one of the world's largest pharmaceutical companies. It is listed on the New York Stock Exchange, and its shares have been a component of the Dow Jones Industrial Average since 2004. Wikipedia

Pfizer is partnering with BioNtech which is a German company.

I really hope things go well with these vaccines. I'm no spring chicken and want to do some more traveling while I still can.

Other than printing and shovelling out money, the feds seem behind on so many things. They keep having to be badgered into action by provinces. BC is still complaining about not being able to get proper contact information from airlines. How do you contact trace if you have no contact info? The airlines just say they are governed by federal regulations and are complying. Meanwhile, not a peep out of Garneau.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2020, 12:21:24 pm by wilber »
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1805 on: August 06, 2020, 12:55:20 pm »
Pfizer is partnering with BioNtech which is a German company.

the German company BioNtech is the driver (in regards its expertise/focus on the combo mRNA format and target antigen). Your Trumpian scare tactics won't fly in the face of the global reach/partnerships that exist between the respective companies involved in all these candidate offerings... see 3M ignoring Trump in regards exporting N95 masks!

Other than printing and shovelling out money, the feds seem behind on so many things. They keep having to be badgered into action by provinces. BC is still complaining about not being able to get proper contact information from airlines. How do you contact trace if you have no contact info? The airlines just say they are governed by federal regulations and are complying. Meanwhile, not a peep out of Garneau.

more, yet more member wilberHairOnFire reactions: as I read... the contact info raised concern is but "days old" and reflects upon domestic flights --- "Federal Transport Minister Garneau and B.C. Transport Minister Trevena spoke on Wednesday afternoon - Garneau committed to create a way for airlines to share passenger data to trace "individuals who may have been exposed to COVID 19 while on a domestic flight."" This last Tuesday, per Dr. Theresa Tam, Canada's chief public health officer:  "there hasn't been a confirmed case of in-flight transmission".

Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1806 on: August 06, 2020, 01:24:19 pm »
the German company BioNtech is the driver (in regards its expertise/focus on the combo mRNA format and target antigen). Your Trumpian scare tactics won't fly in the face of the global reach/partnerships that exist between the respective companies involved in all these candidate offerings... see 3M ignoring Trump in regards exporting N95 masks!


We signed the deal with Pfizer, not BioNtech.

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more, yet more member wilberHairOnFire reactions: as I read... the contact info raised concern is but "days old" and reflects upon domestic flights --- "Federal Transport Minister Garneau and B.C. Transport Minister Trevena spoke on Wednesday afternoon - Garneau committed to create a way for airlines to share passenger data to trace "individuals who may have been exposed to COVID 19 while on a domestic flight."" This last Tuesday, per Dr. Theresa Tam, Canada's chief public health officer:  "there hasn't been a confirmed case of in-flight transmission".

Actually BC brought this issue up some time ago and a few days ago finally sent a letter to Garneau. Now he has to respond.
How do you determine if there is a case of in flight transmission if you can't contact trace the passengers? Being able to track passengers properly would confirm whether there has been a case of in flight transmission or not. Then we could either be concerned about it or not have to worry about it. If we don't have to worry about it, people would be more confident about travelling and airlines might have a better chance of survival.

Restaurants must be able to provide contact information for customers but we can't get it from airlines. Ridiculous.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2020, 01:28:54 pm by wilber »
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1807 on: August 06, 2020, 01:49:54 pm »
We signed the deal with Pfizer, not BioNtech.

no - per Pfizer Canada:



Actually BC brought this issue up some time ago and a few days ago finally sent a letter to Garneau. Now he has to respond.

"finally sent a letter.".. finally? Oh my - now... finally... so serious!  ;D You could add credence to your claim if you advised on the date/nature of, "bringing this issue up some time ago" - when, with who/what?

Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1808 on: August 06, 2020, 01:58:07 pm »
no - per Pfizer Canada:



"finally sent a letter.".. finally? Oh my - now... finally... so serious!  ;D You could add credence to your claim if you advised on the date/nature of, "bringing this issue up some time ago" - when, with who/what?

Dr Henry and Minister Dix daily briefings.

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Henry also revealed that contact tracing has been a challenge when cases have been linked to air travel.

“One of the most challenging things we do is trying to get flight manifests a couple of days later when we recognize somebody who might be ill. The type of information on those flight manifests is often not very helpful in trying to follow up with people,” Henry explained.

She says she would like airlines to provide more complete information, including identifying people within rows of someone who may be ill.

CTV News, July 15

If you don't get a response any other way, you have to put it in writing.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1809 on: August 06, 2020, 02:08:28 pm »
CTV News, July 15

If you don't get a response any other way, you have to put it in writing.

wow! July 15th... that's your described "some time ago"?  ;D Notwithstanding your quote says dickAll about the "to who/what... or the when"... that this concern was supposedly brought forward. C'mon member wilber, get in the game!

Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1810 on: August 06, 2020, 02:32:34 pm »
wow! July 15th... that's your described "some time ago"?  ;D Notwithstanding your quote says dickAll about the "to who/what... or the when"... that this concern was supposedly brought forward. C'mon member wilber, get in the game!

The point is she got no response from the feda at all and in the meantime, several domestic flights have arrived at YVR with Covid cases on them.  It was the same when BC had to put its own personnel at borders and airports to advise people they must self isolate because the feds weren't doing it. Arriving international travellers are still required to present a province  approved self isolation plan to or they are quarantined at a hotel at the province's expense. When did it become a provincial responsibility to protect Canada's borders?
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Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1811 on: August 06, 2020, 03:05:21 pm »
According to federal authorities, since June 29, at least 26 flights arriving at Canadian airports from both domestic and international locations have had confirmed COVID-19 cases onboard.

Quote
Dr. Bonnie Henry, the province’s provincial health officer, addressed the issue of passenger manifests in her briefing on Tuesday. She said the information airlines provide is shockingly inadequate, rarely accurate and that B.C. doesn’t even bother asking for flight manifests anymore.
“I can tell you that they may think they provide information but I can show you the sheets,” Henry said, adding. “We stopped asking for flight manifests . . . We have requested flight manifests, and even in March when we were trying to get them, it took days to get them.”

And it isn't just BC

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/british-columbia/article-bc-ontario-demand-ottawa-force-airlines-to-provide-complete/

The feds have had four months to sort this out. Do Dr. Tam and the federal government not care if contact tracing isn't possible for airline flights?
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1812 on: August 06, 2020, 05:10:51 pm »
The point is she got no response from the feda at all and in the meantime, several domestic flights have arrived at YVR with Covid cases on them.
The feds have had four months to sort this out. Do Dr. Tam and the federal government not care if contact tracing isn't possible for airline flights?

you still haven't provided anything that speaks to just who/what "feds" have been contacted... and when said "feds" were approached with a raised concern. Your blindly throwing shyte still ain't hitting anything yet!

let the waldo provide clarity: as I read/interpret, the issue is with respect to domestic flights only. Airline spokespeople state they provide the information they have... which in some cases has flight seats associated to 3rd parties... where an airline might not have “direct customer contact” information if tickets are purchased through a third party such as a travel agency or website.

Offline wilber

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1813 on: August 06, 2020, 07:32:40 pm »
you still haven't provided anything that speaks to just who/what "feds" have been contacted... and when said "feds" were approached with a raised concern. Your blindly throwing shyte still ain't hitting anything yet!

let the waldo provide clarity: as I read/interpret, the issue is with respect to domestic flights only. Airline spokespeople state they provide the information they have... which in some cases has flight seats associated to 3rd parties... where an airline might not have “direct customer contact” information if tickets are purchased through a third party such as a travel agency or website.
Give me a break.

The Feds have had four months to come up with something requiring airlines to give adequate information for contact tracing and have failed miserably. It's like buying a hotel room through Expedia and then the hotel saying they have no idea who stayed in their room.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Covid Culture (was Outbreak Culture)
« Reply #1814 on: August 06, 2020, 08:45:24 pm »
Give me a break.

The Feds.........................................................

still waiting member wilber - still waiting!

you still haven't provided anything that speaks to just who/what "feds" have been contacted... and when said "feds" were approached with a raised concern. Your blindly throwing shyte still ain't hitting anything yet!

who/what be your "Feds"... and when were your said "Feds" contacted?