Author Topic: Coronavirus Science (facts don’t care about your feelings)  (Read 3694 times)

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Offline waldo

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I’ve never suggested that everything be reopened “fast” as you quoted.  More false choices.  My continued point is that all lives need to be weighed when making policy decisions.  You pandemic alarmists don’t want to acknowledge any serious consequences of being shut down.

you're so all over the map! You keep pretending you're "all about the science"... yet all you do is drop go-fetch links favouring click-bait headlines... while never actually adding your own personal comment/interpretations.

your "deaths of despair" angle was all about protecting the economy by lessening the impact of shutdowns... by shortening those shutdowns - by reopening sooner/faster! That's so confirmed by this, your latest attempt to falsely claim "you're all about the science":

This is not wanting to do nothing.
 
New study, which should’ve been obvious from the start. Hopefully this will be policy going forward, instead of the disastrous one size fits all approach that panic and fear led to in the first place.

Targeted Lockdowns Are Better
A new study finds they save more lives and do less economic damage

https://www.wsj.com/articles/targeted-lockdowns-are-better-11588630768

=> it's not a study; it's not peer-reviewed... it's simply a working paper from economists that relies upon a model they developed. The economists propose a modeling approach that presumes to find an acceptable mortality rate while favouring preserved economic output - all within a methodology that compares uniform policies applied to all age groups versus targeted policies applied only to high-risk groups... a targeted approach that has the oldest group of persons over age 65 under complete lockdown until the arrival of a vaccine.

=> your claimed "science" doesn't include any persons with medical/epidemiology knowledge. At least your referenced economists offer a caveat to that end; one adding a, "caution that their calculations do not take account of many real-world variables and uncertainties, such as economic heterogeneity and factors besides age that affect vulnerability to the virus."

Offline waldo

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Let's see if the guy so concerned about fake news has the credibility to make a retraction.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/09/health/who-coronavirus-asymptomatic-spread-bn/index.html

I just know member Shady will come through here! Now he may not preface it with a walk-back of his leading "shazaam!!!", but I trust the member will do the right thing!

Offline waldo

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Quite true, facts that the naysayers (such as shady) seem to not understand, or choose to ignore. My fear is that such attitude will help create the second wave as things open up before the testing is adequate.
What puzzles me is they seem to think it wouldn't have been any worse if we had done nothing.
This is the frustrating part about the whole thing and I said it on March 15th when our office closed down. 

I knew that once the closures were effective, the covidiots would claim victory when they fought it every step of the way.

Coronavirus shutdowns prevented 60 million infections in the USA

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Researchers found the USA may have been able to avoid an additional 4.8 million confirmed coronavirus cases, which translates to about 60 million more infections, as a result of statewide lockdowns and mandated social distancing restrictions, according to the report published in the peer-reviewed scientific journal Nature.

Infections were much higher than confirmed cases, they argued, because many people didn't have access to a coronavirus test or didn't go to their doctors to obtain one. The study documented changes in testing procedures and availability, as well as differences in case detection across the country.

The effect of large-scale anti-contagion policies on the COVID-19 pandemic

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Abstract

Governments around the world are responding to the novel coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic1 with unprecedented policies designed to slow the growth rate of infections. Many actions, such as closing schools and restricting populations to their homes, impose large and visible costs on society, but their benefits cannot be directly observed and are currently understood only through process-based simulations2–4. Here, we compile new data on 1,717 local, regional, and national non-pharmaceutical interventions deployed in the ongoing pandemic across localities in China, South Korea, Italy, Iran, France, and the United States (US). We then apply reduced-form econometric methods, commonly used to measure the effect of policies on economic growth5,6, to empirically evaluate the effect that these anti-contagion policies have had on the growth rate of infections. In the absence of policy actions, we estimate that early infections of COVID-19 exhibit exponential growth rates of roughly 38% per day. We find that anti-contagion policies have significantly and substantially slowed this growth. Some policies have different impacts on different populations, but we obtain consistent evidence that the policy packages now deployed are achieving large, beneficial, and measurable health outcomes. We estimate that across these six countries, interventions prevented or delayed on the order of 62 million confirmed cases, corresponding to averting roughly 530 million total infections. These findings may help inform whether or when these policies should be deployed, intensified, or lifted, and they can support decision-making in the other 180+ countries where COVID-19 has been reported7.



Online wilber

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Dr Henry had to dance around questions regarding large protest gatherings today, one of which mentioned the Prime Minister. What else could she do. This is the unfair position Trudeau has put medical officers in, just so he could have his photo op.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC
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Offline BC_cheque

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In the video his people literally push aside bystanders so they can get their photo-op.

I agree it was a bad look, no matter how good the cause.
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guest78

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Btw, thanks to the riots err protests, 70 testing sites in the United States were closed last week.  So not only did protestors possibly cause a spike in cases, thousands of tests were prevented from being completed.
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Offline Omni

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Btw, thanks to the riots err protests, 70 testing sites in the United States were closed last week.  So not only did protestors possibly cause a spike in cases, thousands of tests were prevented from being completed.

Perhaps you don't understand the difference between riots and protesta, but I'll give you a hint, it's been shown that the far right crowd, (you're very familiar with the type I'm sure) who have carried out the bulk of the former.

Offline BC_cheque

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Perhaps you don't understand the difference between riots and protesta, but I'll give you a hint, it's been shown that the far right crowd, (you're very familiar with the type I'm sure) who have carried out the bulk of the former.


We've seen protests AND we've seen looting.

We've seen police beating up protesters AND we've seen police marching with the protesters.

People see what they wanna see.

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Offline JMT

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In the video his people literally push aside bystanders so they can get their photo-op.

I agree it was a bad look, no matter how good the cause.

They were pushing the other members of his security out of the way, from what I could tell. I've heard no one call it a bad look until this very moment. He's received nearly universal praise.

Offline JMT

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Dr Henry had to dance around questions regarding large protest gatherings today, one of which mentioned the Prime Minister. What else could she do. This is the unfair position Trudeau has put medical officers in, just so he could have his photo op.

The right to peaceful assembly is protected by the Constitution. The Prime Minister didn't create the events. He simply took part in one, in solidarity with the protesters, offering support and contrition for previous acts.

Online wilber

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The right to peaceful assembly is protected by the Constitution. The Prime Minister didn't create the events. He simply took part in one, in solidarity with the protesters, offering support and contrition for previous acts.

Ontario prohibits gatherings of more than 10 people. He was breaking the law FF sake.

This is just another iteration of Mr Dress Up and stunts like this make it impossible for me to take him seriously.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 10:45:42 pm by wilber »
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Dr Henry had to dance around questions regarding large protest gatherings today, one of which mentioned the Prime Minister. What else could she do. This is the unfair position Trudeau has put medical officers in, just so he could have his photo op.

He's basically effed either way.  If he shows up he'll be criticized for not social distancing, if he doesn't show up he looks like an uncaring entitled stooge chilling at his cottage.

If I were him i'd show up too.
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Online wilber

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He's basically effed either way.  If he shows up he'll be criticized for not social distancing, if he doesn't show up he looks like an uncaring entitled stooge chilling at his cottage.

If I were him i'd show up too.

How many other world leaders did it? Name one. How many of them are effed because they didn't? This was Trudeau theatre, plain and simple.
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Offline JMT

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Ontario prohibits gatherings of more than 10 people. He was breaking the law FF sake.

No, I'm sorry, but that's not correct. Peaceful assembly (protest) is protected by the Charter, and can't be overridden by public health orders that easily.
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Offline JMT

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How many other world leaders did it? Name one. How many of them are effed because they didn't? This was Trudeau theatre, plain and simple.

He was praised by people around the world for doing what he did. It was symbolic, but important.