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"Me Too" Blowback
Goddess:
I think this started as a good movement, but as it progresses I'm getting more and more disappointed in the dragnet that its producing. Some of the accusations, in my opinion, are barely newsworthy - nothing more than clumsy, drunken attempts at persuading women to sleep with men.
It started off exposing powerful men who used their positions to force women into doing things they didn't want to do, which needed exposing. But now its turned into a bit of a gong show.
We're all mammals, we're all trying to get laid. I don't think destroying a career is the answer or shaming someone because of a bumbling attempt at getting some back in college.
I'm starting to worry a bit about possible blowback for women now. I'm seeing a lot of angry men all over the internet and the comments are sometimes scary. Too many are expressing a desire for women to STFU, get back in the kitchen and make them a sammich.
I'm starting to think this could turn out very bad for women in the end. :-\
BC_cheque:
I'm not too worried about what a bunch of losers have to say. If they feel women need to get in the kitchen, it's a sentiment they've likely had long before this issue.
But I agree with the rest. Women show unwanted attention toward men as well and I don't see them crying a river and trying to destroy careers.
It's definitely gotten out of hand.
TimG:
The Weinsteins of the world need to be stopped. Clearly the normal legal system was not working.
Excesses are expected but if moderate women speak out about the excesses it is possible to get to scope back to where it should be.
Judith Curry - a woman in science since the 70s has some thoughts which I think capture where the scope should be:
https://judithcurry.com/2017/12/10/girls-rules/#more-23660
--- Quote ---This really is a tremendous opportunity for rapid and essential cultural change. To seize this moment, we need to:
Provide an unambiguous definition of sexual harassment that clearly distinguishes **** and quid pro quo from minor social transgressions. Codes of conduct are needed. Due process should be followed for addressing any accusations. Avoid turning this situation into a land mine for males.
Provide institutional support and train females to become more resilient and anti-fragile in the face of career challenges and in avoiding potential harassment situations. Your behavior and dress matters.
Resist playing the victim card — instead, focus on changing policies and weeding out the serial harassers.
Recognize that there are also female predators: I know of examples in my field of serial ‘power ****’, and a female who cried **** when a consensual relationship didn’t go the way she wanted and also attempted to destroy the career of a young female scientist of whom she was jealous. Females shouldn’t get a free pass for sexual or other types of harassment.
--- End quote ---
Goddess:
Yes, that's what I'm talking about, TimG.
This issue has become a runaway train, barely on the tracks and it needs to get under better control.
Queefer Sutherland:
The #metoo movement I think has been, on the whole, wonderful for women & society in general. The thing that needs to be kept in mind is that people are innocent until proven guilty. That doesn't mean we shouldn't take every harrassment complaint very seriously. But unless it's a Bill Cosby-type situation where dozens of women have come forward and the guilt looks pretty overwhelming, we need to reserve judgement until the evidence is laid bare and the process does its job. Otherwise it's chaos, and people can ruin careers & lives based on completely made-up claims.
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