Author Topic: Patrick Brown #MeToo  (Read 3911 times)

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Offline Boges

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #345 on: February 15, 2018, 09:55:34 am »
The Age of consent in Canada is like 14. We'd be talking Stat **** if that was the case.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #346 on: February 15, 2018, 09:57:28 am »
The Age of consent in Canada is like 14. We'd be talking Stat **** if that was the case.

I hope you are not doing it with any 14 or 15 year old(s), or you are in for some legal trouble.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #347 on: February 15, 2018, 10:00:27 am »
The Age of consent in Canada is like 14. We'd be talking Stat **** if that was the case.
Conservatives raised it to 16; if you're in a position of authority, then 18. It used to be 18 for gay men as well, but I'm not sure if that was changed by the Liberals recently.

Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #348 on: February 15, 2018, 10:44:39 am »
Sure, could you point out where they previously claimed she was underage?

Pretty sure they did.  Why else would they be correcting it ?

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #349 on: February 15, 2018, 12:31:42 pm »
The earlier incident, the 2007 incident, occurred when Brown was 28 and the "victim" was 19.  The (updated) facts according to the "victim" are that she went to a bar, met a guy, had drinks, went home with him, and gave him a consensual hummer.

He wasn't a leader, an MP, or any of that at the time. She didn't work for him.  So why in the blue hell was the first woman's story in the news in the first place?

"Woman, 19, gets drunk and has consensual oral sex, feels regret later" isn't a news story. She shouldn't feel bad. We all probably did something stupid involving alcohol and/or sex when we were 19. But it's not a news story.

 -k

Because the reporter needed a second person to validate the first one, her girlfriend's claim. Note that according to Brown's girlfriend at that time, WHO WAS IN THE HOUSE, it was the girl who followed Brown around to the point it was annoying her. Brown says the girl came onto him and he rejected her and then drove her home.

The second one's statement is now contradicted by the friend of Brown she alleges she accompanied to his bedroom with. That man now says he never went to Brown's bedroom that night except to charge his phone, and that he never accompanied Brown or the woman there or saw either of them there at any point.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 12:36:08 pm by SirJohn »
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Offline Rue

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #350 on: February 15, 2018, 03:35:26 pm »
What Brown likely wants is the "victims" to explicitly state that they are not accusing him of any crimes. This is a reasonable expectation and would serve to reduce the damages they would be assessed in any defamation lawsuit. If they refuse to do that they further undermine their credibility and increase the potential damages.

His latest comments seem to make that clear for sure. He challenged the complainants to press police charges if they believe he acted criminally. To my relief he has not taken an approach to sue them, just CTV. I was worried he was so angry he would try sue the complainants as well which would not help.   To salvage his reputation he must rise above seeking revenge on the complainants. As for CTV I think they are pathetic. Just my opinion but I think he can come out of this damage if he treats the issue as a genuine misunderstanding which he learns from and rises above lashing out at the complainants. He has to stay away from what appears to be abusive responses to them in this damn theatre of politics. Whether he goes after CTV is another story. Both CTV and CBC have become trash outlets of gossip.  I hate them both for their biases and lack of journalistic integrity these days. I miss Rex Murphy and Gwynne Dyer.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 03:50:46 pm by Rue »
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Offline Rue

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #351 on: February 15, 2018, 03:47:37 pm »
The Age of consent in Canada is like 14. We'd be talking Stat **** if that was the case.

It works like this:

1-any sex without the consent of a partner is sexual assault and a crime
2-as a  general rule he age of consent to sexual activity is 16 years BUT in situations where the 16-18 year old is having sex with someone in a position of trust, authority or dependence, it could be considered statutory **** until they are 18, and after 18 it might not be considered a sexual assault if there was consent, but there could be other criminal charges dealing with possibly fraud;
3-a  14 or 15 year old can consent to sexual activity as long as the partner is less than five years older and there is no relationship of trust, authority or dependency or any other exploitation of the young person. (this means  if the partner is 5 years or older than the 14 or 15 year old, any sexual activity is a criminal offence)
4-then there is the legal rule or doctrine of  "close in age" exception for 12 and 13 year olds and it works like this-believe it or not a  12 or 13 year old can consent to sexual activity with a partner as long as the partner is less than two years older and there is no relationship of trust, authority or dependency or any other exploitation of the young person (which means that if the partner is 2 years or older than the 12 or 13 year old, any sexual activity would be a criminal offence).

So some of your detractors have it wrong and they can go to: http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/other-autre/clp/faq.html.

A lot of people don't know all of the above. You clearly seem to have known so I thought I should clarify on your behalf.

In other words, a person must be at least 12 years old to be able to legally agree to sexual activity.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 12:55:44 pm by Rue »
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Offline kimmy

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #352 on: February 15, 2018, 09:10:58 pm »
OH BY THE WAY we now have confirmation that the accuser and Aiello were coworkers at the Hill Times:
Quote
Since CTV exposed the allegations, Brown has questioned the news organization’s reporting and whether the outlet failed to disclose that one of the women accusing Brown of sexual misconduct and Rachel Aiello, one of the CTV journalists who reported on the story, worked together at the Hill Times, shared at least one journalistic byline and were seen at events together.

“They were colleagues and co-workers, but I don’t know if they were or are real ‘friends,’ said Hill Times editor Kate Malloy.

edit to add: https://globalnews.ca/news/4025367/patrick-brown-allegations-fabricated-political-assassination/

That directly contradicts CTV's claim that there was no connection between the reporter and the accuser.


 -k
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 11:20:07 pm by kimmy »
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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #353 on: February 16, 2018, 09:12:47 am »
I saw part of a Global interview with Patrick Brown.  He's vehement and believable.  But there was an odd moment when he said he did not voluntarily resign; the interviewer seemed genuinely surprised by this and confirmed it with him twice.   But it seems several people who were at the discussion with Brown said he did resign voluntarily.  Perhaps its only PB who tells the truth ever.

   

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #354 on: February 16, 2018, 09:21:30 am »
I saw part of a Global interview with Patrick Brown.  He's vehement and believable.  But there was an odd moment when he said he did not voluntarily resign; the interviewer seemed genuinely surprised by this and confirmed it with him twice.   But it seems several people who were at the discussion with Brown said he did resign voluntarily.  Perhaps its only PB who tells the truth ever.

The Star have a recording of him on with Tory MPPs saying: “Despite the fact that this is character assassination and false allegations, I don’t want any of us to set back on our mission to defeat Kathleen Wynne ... I want nothing more than to see you all successful in replacing this corrupt government. When you work 20 hours a day like I do on defeating this government I would never want to be an obstacle to you defeating this government ... I’ve asked (director of communications) Rebecca (Thompson) to prepare a statement that I will resign.

It sounds like he is losing it.

Offline Goddess

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #355 on: February 16, 2018, 10:10:41 am »
The Star have a recording of him on with Tory MPPs saying: “Despite the fact that this is character assassination and false allegations, I don’t want any of us to set back on our mission to defeat Kathleen Wynne ... I want nothing more than to see you all successful in replacing this corrupt government. When you work 20 hours a day like I do on defeating this government I would never want to be an obstacle to you defeating this government ... I’ve asked (director of communications) Rebecca (Thompson) to prepare a statement that I will resign.

It sounds like he is losing it.

Sounds to me more like a "voluntarynotvoluntary" kind of thing.
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guest7

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #356 on: February 16, 2018, 10:12:29 am »
The Star have a recording of him on with Tory MPPs saying: “Despite the fact that this is character assassination and false allegations, I don’t want any of us to set back on our mission to defeat Kathleen Wynne ... I want nothing more than to see you all successful in replacing this corrupt government. When you work 20 hours a day like I do on defeating this government I would never want to be an obstacle to you defeating this government ... I’ve asked (director of communications) Rebecca (Thompson) to prepare a statement that I will resign.

It sounds like he is losing it.

Didn't he say that he was prepared to resign, hence the request for the statement, but that the release of the statement was done without his knowledge or permission?

Perhaps it was the result of a minor miscommunication.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #357 on: February 16, 2018, 10:23:14 am »
Didn't he say that he was prepared to resign, hence the request for the statement, but that the release of the statement was done without his knowledge or permission?

Perhaps it was the result of a minor miscommunication.

As Goddess says it was involuntary voluntary, but regardless he did say the words. I wouldn't say it was a 'minor' miscommunication, that sounds fairly major to me. The point is however he made it clear that he was resigning. Perhaps it was in the heat of the moment, and the next day he refused to sign the letter prepared, but that doesn't change the fact he resigned.

If he can't be clear about what happened in the heat of the moment 2-3 weeks ago, how can we trust his memory on the heat of the moment (in the room with a young girl certainly involves a lot of heat) from 10 years ago.

guest7

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #358 on: February 16, 2018, 10:30:24 am »
As Goddess says it was involuntary voluntary, but regardless he did say the words. I wouldn't say it was a 'minor' miscommunication, that sounds fairly major to me. The point is however he made it clear that he was resigning. Perhaps it was in the heat of the moment, and the next day he refused to sign the letter prepared, but that doesn't change the fact he resigned.

If he can't be clear about what happened in the heat of the moment 2-3 weeks ago, how can we trust his memory on the heat of the moment (in the room with a young girl certainly involves a lot of heat) from 10 years ago.

Like dia I only saw part of the interview, and I was doing something else, but also like her, that part stood out for me.  My take was that he was prepared to resign, but didn't lower the boom himself.  So he says, of course.

As to your last assertion, I have no opinion, not having followed the story anywhere but on here and the "other site" really.  If he is innocent I do hope he follows through on his threat to sue, and I hope he takes CTV for millions.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Patrick Brown #MeToo
« Reply #359 on: February 16, 2018, 10:37:38 am »
I hope he takes CTV for millions.

Why CTV? They pursued a very important story, they interviewed the accusers and at least one person one of them confided in years ago, they immediately made corrections when they were identified. It sounds like there was also a lot of related stories about his time on Parliament hill that the general public was not aware of and has come out after this story, I am sure there were members of the media that heard those stories years ago but didn't report them until we got to this level of detail. What did CTV do wrong? How should the media handle stories, not report anything, or only report what you want to hear?

Yes there need to be journalistic standards met. What make you think that CTV didn't meet them. A story of this prominence would have many senior CTV officials and legal team vetting it, or so I would expect. This is not like the standard bullcrap that rags like the Rebel put out and you never seem to have problems with them.