Author Topic: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?  (Read 2242 times)

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Offline SirJohn

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #90 on: March 01, 2018, 04:10:45 pm »
Both men got their government jobs because the people of Canada voted for them. Harper got his first job because his uncle George managed to get him into the mail room at Imperial Oil.

Which is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. He did a lot of things in the world of politics prior to becoming PM, including negotiating  the merger of the Alliance the PCs.
Which still has nothing to do with this topic. Harper is not, to my knowledge, running in the provincial election.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Omni

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #91 on: March 01, 2018, 04:26:51 pm »
Which is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. He did a lot of things in the world of politics prior to becoming PM, including negotiating  the merger of the Alliance the PCs.
Which still has nothing to do with this topic. Harper is not, to my knowledge, running in the provincial election.

I didn't bring Harper into the discussion. Just responding to YOUR post.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #92 on: March 01, 2018, 04:37:10 pm »
I didn't bring Harper into the discussion. Just responding to YOUR post.

I did not bring him up except as a reference to how politicians often become more pragmatic after they get in office than before.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #93 on: March 01, 2018, 05:01:21 pm »
What stats are you using?  Blacks in the US commit about 50% of crime and violent crime, but make up only 13% of the population.  The large majority of that is by men, so 6% of the pop commits about 40+% of all violent crime.  Yet blacks account for only about 26-28% of police shooting victims, whites about 50-55%.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/07/18/police-shootings-and-race/?utm_term=.557f44049778

Yes on occasion a crappy officer makes a bad decisions and even racist ones, but the narratives not based on facts need to stop, and the elephant in the room needs to be addressed:

But you're not supposed to look at those stats, and you're certainly not supposed to pay any attention to them if you accidentally come across them. It goes against the prevailing narrative of the poor helpless minority and the evil nasty racist white folks who are just gunning them down for fun. And if you do notice them you're supposed to point out how it's all the white man's fault anyway because of racism keeping the poor Black man down and preventing him from getting jobs. You're certainly not supposed to bring up things like African immigrants earning, by and large, 30% more than native born Black Americans and wonder why that is. No, whatever goes wrong it's the white man's fault. And if you think otherwise, why then you must be a racist.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #94 on: March 01, 2018, 09:28:20 pm »
But you're not supposed to look at those stats, and you're certainly not supposed to pay any attention to them if you accidentally come across them. It goes against the prevailing narrative of the poor helpless minority and the evil nasty racist white folks who are just gunning them down for fun. And if you do notice them you're supposed to point out how it's all the white man's fault anyway because of racism keeping the poor Black man down and preventing him from getting jobs. You're certainly not supposed to bring up things like African immigrants earning, by and large, 30% more than native born Black Americans and wonder why that is. No, whatever goes wrong it's the white man's fault. And if you think otherwise, why then you must be a racist.

It's more satisfying to blame an oppressor than to admit any fault in the victim/oneself, though many white people especially in US certainly have some blame to factor in especially further back in the past when racism was far more rampant & slavery/jim crow existed & those legacies have generational effects.

But you also have to factor in personal responsibility.  ie: Single motherhood in the black community has skyrocketed since the 60's civil rights era (leading to more poverty & young men without role models etc) and white people aren't forcing black people to have unprotected sex out of wedlock. 

There's a lot of immigrants from Africa who don't do well in US/Canada either & commit crime and they were never enslaved.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #95 on: March 01, 2018, 09:30:57 pm »
anybody actually watch any of the 2nd PC debate?
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

Offline Boges

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #96 on: March 07, 2018, 01:04:14 pm »
Colobus Monkey 2018!!!

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2018/03/07/ontario-finance-minister-to-table-pre-election-budget-that-returns-ontario-to-deficit.html

Back to Deficit!

Patrick Brown's budget assumed a deficit, because he knew the Liberals were lying.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #97 on: March 07, 2018, 04:22:53 pm »
Colobus Monkey 2018!!!

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2018/03/07/ontario-finance-minister-to-table-pre-election-budget-that-returns-ontario-to-deficit.html

Back to Deficit!

Patrick Brown's budget assumed a deficit, because he knew the Liberals were lying.

Ontario was never out of deficit. The claim to the contrary was a lie. They borrowed massively this year and last year. They're simply playing accounting games to hide it.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Rue

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #98 on: March 10, 2018, 11:55:53 am »
Well it definitely looks like the election was rigged to shut out Mulroney slipping up the middle with a split between Elliot and Ford as a compromise neutral pick and that is too bad. Looks like the Vic Fideli camp had enough clout to fix the election and "lose" the many ballots not to mention discourage and prevent PC members from voting. This is a rigged dirty vote. I think Elliot was the principle party in leaking the anti Brown story to oust him. I think her accepting a plumb liberal patronage appointment as Ombudsman for Patients and then running back to the Tory party is the utmost in political whoring.

My prediction is Mulroney will flip over to federal politics for the next fed  election and will be given a cabinet post provincially if Elliot wins but not in finance-I think Fideli has that one all lined up.

I do think Elliot is just another Wynne albeit she is in a party that will not be the same as Wynne's but there is little difference in their politics other than their patronage appointment lists.
You have me mistaken with an eagle. I only come to eat your carcass.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #99 on: March 10, 2018, 02:16:24 pm »
Well it definitely looks like the election was rigged to shut out Mulroney slipping up the middle with a split between Elliot and Ford as a compromise neutral pick and that is too bad. Looks like the Vic Fideli camp had enough clout to fix the election and "lose" the many ballots not to mention discourage and prevent PC members from voting. This is a rigged dirty vote.

Don't ascribe to malice what is most likely incompetence. When you run something this quickly, with a new kind of voting, there are bound to be problems. Elliot was the most obvious candidate. Mulroney did just okay in the debates and discussions. She has potential but didn't awe anyone, and everybody seems to think she needs some seasoning. And it looks like a 'reasonable' candidate is a shoe-in vs Wynne, vs a loose cannon like Ford. I'd vote for Elliot myself I was a member. I want Wynne gone.

Yes, Elliot is further to the left than I or a lot of PCs would like, that's why she lost the last couple of times. But she'll be better than Wynne, and her party will hold her to a better fiscal policy framework. Hopefully they can begin to cut back on the size of the public service and the unnecessary spending programs. Mirroring the ban on campaign donations by anyone but individuals, as in the federal system, would be good too.

 
« Last Edit: March 10, 2018, 06:32:53 pm by SirJohn »
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #100 on: March 10, 2018, 05:09:56 pm »
Way too funny, it looks like Ford is going to be the next OPC leader to lose to the Liberal - yet again.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #101 on: March 10, 2018, 07:29:23 pm »
I had to look it up because I thought you were joking....you’re not joking.

Offline wilber

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #102 on: March 10, 2018, 07:36:30 pm »
Not so fast. Recount, you won't know till tomorrow.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #103 on: March 10, 2018, 07:59:52 pm »
Not so fast. Recount, you won't know till tomorrow.

The Star is saying one is leading the popular vote and the other taking the most riding points. I guess the "Electoral College" will decide.

Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Let the Caucus Pick the PC Ontario Leader ?
« Reply #104 on: March 11, 2018, 08:22:41 am »
Let's see ... the predictions of "Right wing populism is not going to succeed ... we are not THAT crazy..." resulted in:

Rob Ford victory
Brexit victory
Trump victory

By the time the 2016 US election came up my friends were shocked that I was not 100% sure Hillary Clinton would win.  "Why not ?".  The answer, to me, was that pollsters are not reliable in predicting populist wins.