Canadian Politics Today

Beyond Politics => General Discussion => Topic started by: SirJohn on April 15, 2018, 04:38:23 pm


Title: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 15, 2018, 04:38:23 pm
Or helpless Black victims of racism arrested by evil police after being thrown out of restaurant by racist manager. Take your pick.

So yeah, this is apparently a thing now. Two black guys were in Starbucks waiting to meet some guy. They asked to use the bathroom and when they didn't want to order anything were told to leave. They refused. Police were called. Police told them they had to leave. They refused, and were arrested. This is being described as pretty blatant racism. I saw some panel on MSNBC a short time ago where the chick leading it was astonished the (black)police chief would say they didn't do anything wrong.

But to me, the issue isn't as clear cut. Or actually it is, from the police perspective. When you're told to leave some private premise you leave. End of story. It doesn't matter why. It doesn't matter if it's fair. You have no right to be there and if they want you gone you leave. If the police tell you this (which they did) and you refuse to leave you're arrested. It doesn't matter what your skin is. You don't make your case to the cops that the owner is being unfair you make it to a lawyer and he makes the case to the company, possibly through the courts later.

So to me the question is why did the manager called the cops. Was it because they were Black or because they were Black and weren't ordering anything? Most restaurants refuse to let people off the street use their bathroom facilities. They're reserved for customers. Most restaurants will kick you out if you don't want to order anything. Starbucks is kind of different, though, in that they encourage people to hang around, use their wifi, etc. But the company seems to suggest they were following policy.  Would they have called the cops if these guys were white or Asian? Would they have called the cops if they'd been wearing suits and ties? You have to get into the head of the manager to find that out. But everyone seems to have already decided.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/business/wp/2018/04/15/two-black-men-were-arrested-waiting-at-a-starbucks-now-the-company-police-are-on-the-defensive/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f33908fe237d
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 15, 2018, 05:11:09 pm
Or helpless Black victims of racism arrested by evil police after being thrown out of restaurant by racist manager. Take your pick.

So yeah, this is apparently a thing now. Two black guys were in Starbucks waiting to meet some guy. They asked to use the bathroom and when they didn't want to order anything were told to leave. They refused. Police were called. Police told them they had to leave. They refused, and were arrested. This is being described as pretty blatant racism. I saw some panel on MSNBC a short time ago where the chick leading it was astonished the (black)police chief would say they didn't do anything wrong.

But to me, the issue isn't as clear cut. Or actually it is, from the police perspective. When you're told to leave some private premise you leave. End of story. It doesn't matter why. It doesn't matter if it's fair. You have no right to be there and if they want you gone you leave. If the police tell you this (which they did) and you refuse to leave you're arrested. It doesn't matter what your skin is. You don't make your case to the cops that the owner is being unfair you make it to a lawyer and he makes the case to the company, possibly through the courts later.

So to me the question is why did the manager called the cops. Was it because they were Black or because they were Black and weren't ordering anything? Most restaurants refuse to let people off the street use their bathroom facilities. They're reserved for customers. Most restaurants will kick you out if you don't want to order anything. Starbucks is kind of different, though, in that they encourage people to hang around, use their wifi, etc. But the company seems to suggest they were following policy.  Would they have called the cops if these guys were white or Asian? Would they have called the cops if they'd been wearing suits and ties? You have to get into the head of the manager to find that out. But everyone seems to have already decided.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/business/wp/2018/04/15/two-black-men-were-arrested-waiting-at-a-starbucks-now-the-company-police-are-on-the-defensive/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f33908fe237d

Seems as though you have taken your pick, but that was easily predictable. As the article points out these two were waiting for their lawyer to join them, and who did arrive. Who hasn't gone into a coffee shop with a plan to meet a friend and announced so to the barista without being led away in handcuffs? I know I have, but then I'm in Canada and I'm white.   
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 15, 2018, 06:47:08 pm
Seems as though you have taken your pick, but that was easily predictable. As the article points out these two were waiting for their lawyer to join them, and who did arrive. Who hasn't gone into a coffee shop with a plan to meet a friend and announced so to the barista without being led away in handcuffs? I know I have, but then I'm in Canada and I'm white.

No, I've decided the police did nothing wrong. I said I don't know what was in the mind of the manager. Starbucks seems to suggest that they were following company policy, because they said they'll look at whether the policy is appropriate. I would suggest that if the individuals were dressed in suits and ties they wouldn't have been thrown out, but that's just a guess.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 15, 2018, 08:02:05 pm
No, I've decided the police did nothing wrong. I said I don't know what was in the mind of the manager. Starbucks seems to suggest that they were following company policy, because they said they'll look at whether the policy is appropriate. I would suggest that if the individuals were dressed in suits and ties they wouldn't have been thrown out, but that's just a guess.

While I was single and dating, I waited at plenty of places - including coffee shops - without ordering. Sometimes, I even wore jeans. Never was I asked to leave, and never were the police called.   I'd consider this more of the racism some people are so convinced does not exist.   
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 15, 2018, 09:00:32 pm
While I was single and dating, I waited at plenty of places - including coffee shops - without ordering. Sometimes, I even wore jeans. Never was I asked to leave, and never were the police called.   I'd consider this more of the racism some people are so convinced does not exist.

Who said racism doesn't exist? Did you wait at these coffee shops without ordering anything, and then ask to use the bathroom?

Mind you, women are given a lot more leeway than men. Women aren't considered threatening in any way. Men are, especially if dressed poorly, and most especially, I grant you, if they're young and black.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: msj on April 15, 2018, 09:08:19 pm
Mind you, women are given a lot more leeway than men. Women aren't considered threatening in any way. Men are, especially if dressed poorly, and most especially, I grant you, if they're young and black.

Maybe you should watch the video so you can make an informed comment rather than bore us with your usually speculative drivel?
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 15, 2018, 09:11:14 pm
Who said racism doesn't exist? Did you wait at these coffee shops without ordering anything, and then ask to use the bathroom?

Mind you, women are given a lot more leeway than men. Women aren't considered threatening in any way. Men are, especially if dressed poorly, and most especially, I grant you, if they're young and black.

"Dressed poorly"? Explain how you see that. Maybe in your world you put on a suit and tie to go for a **** cup of coffee, but not in the real world. What they are wearing matters much less to you than the color of their skin. You're famous for that.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 16, 2018, 03:59:30 pm
"Dressed poorly"? Explain how you see that. Maybe in your world you put on a suit and tie to go for a **** cup of coffee, but not in the real world. What they are wearing matters much less to you than the color of their skin. You're famous for that.


There are many demands for the police who dealt (properly) with this to be fired. Many demands the manager be fired, even though she appears to have acted within company policy. I'm sure you'd be one of those shrill types who has no problem making up your mind on scant evidence too.

Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 16, 2018, 04:20:08 pm
You're famous for your brainless, knee-jerk reactions to things. I mean, granted there are a lot of **** on this site from the far left, but they're all smarter than you are.

There are many demands for the police who dealt (properly) with this to be fired. Many demands the manager be fired, even though she appears to have acted within company policy. I'm sure you'd be one of those shrill types who has no problem making up your mind on scant evidence too.

Your mother wears army boots. And you do do always resort to insults when you're refuted. But if you seem to think you are so smart how come you didn't know the Starbucks manager has already been fired? tsk, tsk
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: BC_cheque on April 16, 2018, 04:25:25 pm
While Argus doubles down on the shameless racial profiling, Starbucks CEO was on Goodmorning America apologizing sincerely for the error in judgment. .

Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 16, 2018, 04:32:20 pm
While Argus doubles down on the shameless racial profiling, Starbucks CEO was on Goodmorning America apologizing sincerely for the error in judgment. .

I wonder if that has anything to do with the fact these guys were in fact waiting to meet with their lawyer who did show up.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: BC_cheque on April 16, 2018, 04:35:52 pm
Maybe it was all planned that way and the poor white manager just fell right into their dirty trap by calling the police.

I bet George Soros even paid them out.

Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 16, 2018, 04:48:22 pm
Your mother wears army boots. And you do do always resort to insults when you're

Insulted. Yes, I do.

Quote
But if you seem to think you are so smart how come you didn't know the Starbucks manager has already been fired? tsk, tsk

Nope. She/he was not fired. All Starbucks says is she is 'no longer at that store'. She violated no company policy. I've seen several reports which seem to indicate that the men might have asked to use the rest room and then sat down. Which makes sense because people just sitting there might not come to the attention of the counter staff very quickly at a Starbucks. Since they weren't customers they were asked to leave. Which the restaurant had a perfect right to do.

According to Starbucks, figuring out how to deal with people who aren't customers is left to the discretion of the local managers. Most eateries have policies that limit the use of restrooms to paying customers, and almost all prohibit loitiering and/or trespassing. These are common and sinsible policies for business that want to cultirivate an environment conducive to their customers.

So because of this I"m not SURE if she did this improperly. I AM sure the men deserved to be arrested, though. If you're told to leave someone else's premises you leave. If you don't, the cops will arrest you. How do people not understand that?

https://www.phillymag.com/business/2018/04/16/starbucks-manager-philadelphia-arrest/
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 16, 2018, 05:08:35 pm
Insulted. Yes, I do.

Nope. She/he was not fired. All Starbucks says is she is 'no longer at that store'. She violated no company policy. I've seen several reports which seem to indicate that the men might have asked to use the rest room and then sat down. Which makes sense because people just sitting there might not come to the attention of the counter staff very quickly at a Starbucks. Since they weren't customers they were asked to leave. Which the restaurant had a perfect right to do.

According to Starbucks, figuring out how to deal with people who aren't customers is left to the discretion of the local managers. Most eateries have policies that limit the use of restrooms to paying customers, and almost all prohibit loitiering and/or trespassing. These are common and sinsible policies for business that want to cultirivate an environment conducive to their customers.

So because of this I"m not SURE if she did this improperly. I AM sure the men deserved to be arrested, though. If you're told to leave someone else's premises you leave. If you don't, the cops will arrest you. How do people not understand that?

https://www.phillymag.com/business/2018/04/16/starbucks-manager-philadelphia-arrest/

 I have a starbucks a 10 minute walk from my house and I've gone there and logged into their wifi while waiting for a friend to show and then we ordered coffee's.  The waiter was happy to wait. You keep trying to dodge the likelihood these men were asked to leave because of an attitude similar to yours.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 16, 2018, 06:17:59 pm
I have a starbucks a 10 minute walk from my house and I've gone there and logged into their wifi while waiting for a friend to show and then we ordered coffee's.  The waiter was happy to wait. You keep trying to dodge the likelihood these men were asked to leave because of an attitude similar to yours.

My attitude is, if you're a customer, welcome, if not, gtfo.
Starbucks doesn't have waitresses, as far as I'm aware. The ability of the staff at the counter to tell how long people have been sitting at tables, esp without ordering, is limited compared to restaurants that have waitresses. Thus if you don't actually approach them and, say ask for the key/code for the rest room, they might not notice you for a while. In this case they asked to use the rest room. I guarantee you at that point they were asked if they were going to order something. It is possible they said they'd order something when their friend arrived. If that was the case, I don't see why anyone would have a problem. Unfortunately, the information is not clear. If they just said no, they didn't want to order anything it's entirely reasonable they were told to leave.

Everything which happened after that is entirely their responsibility. When you're told to leave, you leave. Especially when it's a cop telling you. You are not entitled to one damn thing in a private restaurant, and certainly not entitled to stay when told to leave.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Queefer Sutherland on April 16, 2018, 06:30:17 pm
Maybe they were being racist, maybe they weren't, I haven't looked at all the info.  In order for me to properly assess the info I have to read a bunch of articles, watch a bunch of videos of the scene and interviews etc.  The case is interesting but i don't feel like wasting an hour of my life trying to figure out if Starbucks kicked some guys out of a coffee shop.  Hopefully justice will be done either way it goes.  There's black guys getting shot by police who don't deserve it, i'll save my time for those more important instances.  Not that I'm better than any of you guys discussing it because it's still important, so have fun.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: kimmy on April 17, 2018, 02:30:41 am
Would these guys have been kicked out of the Starbucks if they weren't black?

If white guys were kicked out of a Starbucks for loitering, would it be news?

Ultimately, I think I'm with Poonlight on this one.

i don't feel like wasting an hour of my life trying to figure out if Starbucks kicked some guys out of a coffee shop.

 -k
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Boges on April 17, 2018, 08:40:45 am
Sure, technically you shouldn't be in the store if you're not a paying customer. But as a White Privileged person, I'd never image to have the cops called on me if I was waiting around for friends to show up.

The double standard is glaring.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: ?Impact on April 17, 2018, 08:53:13 am
A lot of context is missing here. How busy was the store? Were they being quiet and respectful? How long were they there?

There is the letter of the law, and then there is common deceancy.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: kimmy on April 17, 2018, 09:00:41 am
Sure, technically you shouldn't be in the store if you're not a paying customer. But as a White Privileged person, I'd never image to have the cops called on me if I was waiting around for friends to show up.

The double standard is glaring.

I see white people harassed by cops and told to move all the time. These white people happen to be panhandlers, drunks, and drug users.

As ?Impact says, there is more context than just skin color.

 -k
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 11:11:49 am
Sure, technically you shouldn't be in the store if you're not a paying customer. But as a White Privileged person, I'd never image to have the cops called on me if I was waiting around for friends to show up.

As a white privileged person would you tell the restaurant manager to go **** himself if he told you the tables were for paying customers and you had to leave? Probably not. And if the police showed up and said the restaurant wanted you to leave would you hold your middle finger up to them and tell them you refused to leave?
Probably not.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: BC_cheque on April 17, 2018, 11:15:14 am
I see white people harassed by cops and told to move all the time. These white people happen to be panhandlers, drunks, and drug users.


These guys weren't panhandling, drunk or drug users though.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 11:18:29 am
These guys weren't panhandling, drunk or drug users though.

If these guys had been white and asked to leave they probably would have just left. Nobody would have taken any videos. And it never would have gotten on the national news. The idea they never would have been asked to leave if they were white is ridiculous. They were non-customers and brought themselves to the attention of staff by asking to use the bathroom. Staff NEVER want to let non-customers use their restrooms.

But these two entitled **** refused to leave, even when the police showed up.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Queefer Sutherland on April 17, 2018, 11:24:22 am
Those darned blacks, causing a ruckus again!  Get off of my lawn you darned punk kids! [/sacrasm]

Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: BC_cheque on April 17, 2018, 11:27:49 am
If these guys had been white and asked to leave they probably would have just left. Nobody would have taken any videos. And it never would have gotten on the national news. The idea they never would have been asked to leave if they were white is ridiculous. They were non-customers and brought themselves to the attention of staff by asking to use the bathroom. Staff NEVER want to let non-customers use their restrooms.

But these two entitled **** refused to leave, even when the police showed up.

I'm not sure where you're getting that they were asked to leave before the cops were called because other than from you, I haven't read it in any other reports.

Even if they were asked to leave first, that's the kicker.  Two well-dressed white men waiting in Starbucks for another party would not be asked to leave in the first place.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 11:35:37 am
I'm not sure where you're getting that they were asked to leave before the cops were called because other than from you, I haven't read it in any other reports.

Commissioner Richard Ross said in the video that one or both of the men asked to use the restroom but had not purchased anything. An employee said Starbucks company policy was to refuse the use of the restrooms to non-customers and asked the men to leave, according to Ross. The employee called the police when they refused.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/business/wp/2018/04/16/two-black-men-were-arrested-at-starbucks-ceo-now-calling-for-unconscious-bias-training/?utm_term=.da141163ff59

Quote
Even if they were asked to leave first, that's the kicker.  Two well-dressed white men waiting in Starbucks for another party would not be asked to leave in the first place.

I don't know where you get that they were 'well dressed'. They were as well-dressed as construction workers, maybe, or guys going to play football in the park. If they hadn't approached an employee and asked to use the restroom they probably would have been given a longer grace period before being asked to leave. But eventually someone not buying is going to be asked to leave.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 01:14:58 pm
I'm just hearing that Starbucks is planning to close all of it's 8000 stores on the afternoon of May 29th to give their employees a course on racial profiling. That's a serious response to what happened in Philly and probably a pretty strong PR move to smooth out their customer relations. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 01:18:32 pm
I'm just hearing that Starbucks is planning to close all of it's 8000 stores on the afternoon of May 29th to give their employees a course on racial profiling. That's a serious response to what happened in Philly and probably a pretty strong PR move to smooth out their customer relations. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Do you have a cite for that?  8000 stores is a lot, training generally requires trainers and would they be able to muster that many trainers that quickly?  And would they really give up an entire afternoon's receipts, when they could do ongoing training while keeping the stores open.  Anyway, I did try to find a source for that story, but was unsuccessful - so if you have one, please share.  :)
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 01:29:50 pm
Do you have a cite for that?  8000 stores is a lot, training generally requires trainers and would they be able to muster that many trainers that quickly?  And would they really give up an entire afternoon's receipts, when they could do ongoing training while keeping the stores open.  Anyway, I did try to find a source for that story, but was unsuccessful - so if you have one, please share.  :)

I had just heard it on CNN but here is a cite.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-philadelphia-starbucks/starbucks-to-close-8000-u-s-stores-for-racial-bias-training-idUSKBN1HO2UF
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 01:34:13 pm
I had just heard it on CNN but here is a cite.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-philadelphia-starbucks/starbucks-to-close-8000-u-s-stores-for-racial-bias-training-idUSKBN1HO2UF

Thanks.  Looks like an (unnecessary) grand gesture to me, but good on them for stepping up instead of avoiding and deflecting. 
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 01:40:34 pm
Thanks.  Looks like an (unnecessary) grand gesture to me, but good on them for stepping up instead of avoiding and deflecting.

I imagine they have data that tells them how bad it would be for business if their Black customers boycotted.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 01:44:46 pm
I imagine they have data that tells them how bad it would be for business if their Black customers boycotted.

It was more the grand scale of closing all Starbucks and re-educating 170,000 people at the same time that I was referring to.  Would have expected the usual approach of rolling workshops or something.  Anyway, as I was saying - Good on them for taking steps, even if it is just to avoid a boycott.  I guess.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 02:42:49 pm
I imagine they have data that tells them how bad it would be for business if their Black customers boycotted.

More like how bad it would be for business if young urban hipsters and earnest (and largely knowledge-free) millennials who get their news from Facebook boycotted them.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 02:47:09 pm
More like how bad it would be for business if young urban hipsters and earnest (and largely knowledge-free) millennials who get their news from Facebook boycotted them.

You mean the types of people who are interested in opposing racism rather than ignoring/supporting it.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 02:51:12 pm
young urban hipsters and earnest (and largely knowledge-free) millennials who get their news from Facebook boycotted them.

Not a lot different from an old Canadian guy who wasn't there, wasn't involved, has no knowledge of Starbuck policy or how the manager in question did or did not follow it, but has no problem absolving all the White people from blame, while assuming the Black guys were at fault because they didn't have suits on.  And they were black of course, but you are hardly honest enough to admit that.  Are you?
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 02:51:30 pm
You mean the types of people who are interested in opposing racism rather than ignoring/supporting it.

I mean self-righteous airheads like you.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 02:52:06 pm
Not a lot.different from an old Canadian guy who wasn't there, wasn't involved, has no knowledge of Starbuck policy or how the manager in question did or did not follow it, but has no problem absolving all the white people from blame, while assuming the Black guys were at fault because they didn't have suits on.  And they were black of course, but you are hardly honest enough to admit that.  Are you?

I did none of that, but don't let facts get in the way of your brainless leftist sniveling.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 02:56:06 pm
I did none of that, but don't let facts get in the way of your brainless leftist sniveling.

Backtracking, eh?  Your arguments have been;  "Manager followed policy, not her fault".  "Cops doing their job, not their fault."  "Businesses can throw people out for any reason they want".  "Black guys weren't wearing a suit, no wonder they were kicked out".
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 02:59:50 pm
I mean self-righteous airheads like you.

Whatever I am I prefer it to being a narrow minded xenophobe.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Boges on April 17, 2018, 04:29:40 pm
As a white privileged person would you tell the restaurant manager to go **** himself if he told you the tables were for paying customers and you had to leave? Probably not. And if the police showed up and said the restaurant wanted you to leave would you hold your middle finger up to them and tell them you refused to leave?
Probably not.

Probably if I was waiting for friends and not clearly loitering.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 08:40:36 pm
Backtracking, eh?  Your arguments have been;  "Manager followed policy, not her fault".  "Cops doing their job, not their fault."  "Businesses can throw people out for any reason they want".  "Black guys weren't wearing a suit, no wonder they were kicked out".

Lacking your amazing ability to read people's minds I have never claimed to know what is in the manager's. In fact, I said that several times. The cops WERE doing their jobs and businesses DO have the right to throw people out any time they want. As for the Black guys not wearing a suit, I merely replied to someone saying they were well-dressed.

But carry on bleating about me rather than discussing the issue.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 08:41:27 pm
Probably if I was waiting for friends and not clearly loitering.

Waiting on friends while not making any purchases IS loitering.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: SirJohn on April 17, 2018, 08:41:55 pm
Whatever I am I prefer it to being a narrow minded xenophobe.

Okay, bub. Take pride in being a sanctimonious moron.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: guest4 on April 17, 2018, 09:37:36 pm
Waiting on friends while not making any purchases IS loitering.
Starbucks expects people to "loiter."
Quote
The official acknowledged that the incident is at odds with what many people have done at a Starbucks without drawing suspicion or calls to police. The stores are “community hubs”, the official said, where people often drop in to use the wifi or chat with friends without necessarily ordering anything.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/starbucks-police-boycott-black-men-arrest-philadelphia-racism-a8305381.html



Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 17, 2018, 09:47:45 pm
Starbucks expects people to "loiter."https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/starbucks-police-boycott-black-men-arrest-philadelphia-racism-a8305381.html

Perhaps our buddy sir argus has never seen the inside of a Starbucks but presumes to be an expert regardless. Sounds about right.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Boges on April 18, 2018, 09:37:34 am
Waiting on friends while not making any purchases IS loitering.

And people do it all the time.

I think you miss the obvious racism here that this manager thought black men chilling outside a Starbucks was somehow threatening. That's something I've never experienced even if I was technically loitering.

Starbucks is the place people go to, to loiter. Buy ONE coffee and use their Wifi for 3 hours.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: cybercoma on April 18, 2018, 10:59:59 am
And people do it all the time.

I think you miss the obvious racism here that this manager thought black men chilling outside a Starbucks was somehow threatening. That's something I've never experienced even if I was technically loitering.

Starbucks is the place people go to, to loiter. Buy ONE coffee and use their Wifi for 3 hours.
Starbucks' branding isn't even about the coffee. It's about being a community space for people to drop in and hang out.
Title: Re: Black troublemakers arrested at Starbucks
Post by: Omni on April 18, 2018, 03:52:48 pm
Starbucks' branding isn't even about the coffee. It's about being a community space for people to drop in and hang out.

Unless you're Black, according to sir argus, but that's old news.