Author Topic: Superhero Movies  (Read 787 times)

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Offline cybercoma

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #105 on: March 20, 2019, 10:02:15 am »
I think the real reason Han Solo (which I actually really enjoyed...) was a box office dud....
Do I need to go back and watch this? I literally fell asleep about 30 minutes into the film then got up and left the room when I woke up.

Offline kimmy

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #106 on: March 21, 2019, 09:49:27 am »
Do I need to go back and watch this? I literally fell asleep about 30 minutes into the film then got up and left the room when I woke up.

I think you'll be just fine without it.

It was fine if you take it as a stand-alone action adventure movie.  It doesn't tell you much about the character that you didn't already know. You see some of the stuff that you already knew about him. He meets Chewbacca. He meets Lando.  He wins the Falcon in a card game. He makes the Kessel Run in 12 parsecs. He's all about the cash, except that he has a heart of gold. Etc.  You knew all this already.

I liked that they made a Star Wars movie with no Skywalkers, no Jedi, no Force, no fighting the Empire. It's some criminals, doing a heist, in a futuristic setting.  It shows a part of the Star Wars universe that you knew existed, but wasn't seen in other Star Wars movies.  And the young actors, especially Donald Glover, are good.  Donald Glover steals the show every time he's on the screen. But it's hardly essential viewing, even for Star Wars fans. It's just a fun movie.


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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #107 on: March 21, 2019, 10:50:27 am »

The angry internet nerds would have you believe that their angry nerd boycott was the reason Han Solo tanked at the box office.  But the angry internet nerds were campaigning against Captain Marvel too, and it has turned out big even by Marvel "MCU" standards. So I think it's fair to suggest that the angry internet nerds aren't nearly as powerful as they think they are.

I think the real reason Han Solo (which I actually really enjoyed...) was a box office dud is that it was, as you say, just trying to cash in.  Fans didn't *want* a Han Solo reboot.   Once upon a time they tried to launch a Young Indiana Jones Adventures TV show, and people didn't want it. Later on, they tried to reboot Indiana Jones with Harrison Ford passing the torch to Shia LaBeouf, and people didn't want that either.  People didn't want Indiana Jones reboots starring anybody except Harrison Ford.  I don't think people wanted a Han Solo reboot starring anybody else either.   Disney assumed they could just put the name Han Solo on a product and people would flock to see it because everybody loves Han Solo.  They were wrong.

I think there's a few factors that explain Han Solo's not doing great, some we've mentioned:

- the backlash to The Last Jedi, which a ton of fans were PO'd about.
- the fact it came out only a few months after The Last Jedi.  SW fans are used to waiting years or decades between SW films.  Some SW overkill here.
- Star Wars is much different than Marvel movies in that SW films are sacred to fans.  You can make all the crappy SW spin-off novels, comics, games etc, but the films are sacred, eff it up or try to milk it for cash-in & fans will sniff it out and rip you apart.
- It was a spin-off movie, which doesn't have the box office pull like the numbered entries in the series.  Rogue One was infinitely better than Force Awakens or Last Jedi, and arguably the best SW movie since Return of the Jedi, but it just didn't do as well in the box office.
- "Young Han Solo" was an ok idea but also a bit corny (as you say like Young Indiana Jones).
- Trailers and reviews were good not great.  Movie itself was good not great.
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Offline cybercoma

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #108 on: March 22, 2019, 07:00:29 am »
I think you'll be just fine without it.

It was fine if you take it as a stand-alone action adventure movie.  It doesn't tell you much about the character that you didn't already know. You see some of the stuff that you already knew about him. He meets Chewbacca. He meets Lando.  He wins the Falcon in a card game. He makes the Kessel Run in 12 parsecs. He's all about the cash, except that he has a heart of gold. Etc.  You knew all this already.

I liked that they made a Star Wars movie with no Skywalkers, no Jedi, no Force, no fighting the Empire. It's some criminals, doing a heist, in a futuristic setting.  It shows a part of the Star Wars universe that you knew existed, but wasn't seen in other Star Wars movies.  And the young actors, especially Donald Glover, are good.  Donald Glover steals the show every time he's on the screen. But it's hardly essential viewing, even for Star Wars fans. It's just a fun movie.


 -k
See....this all SOUNDS great to me, but I felt like the execution was lacking. I do love me some Childish Gambino though, so I probably owe it to myself to at least stay awake until Lando shows up next time.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #109 on: March 22, 2019, 07:01:56 am »
The Last Jedi was a great movie and the backlash was largely, if not entirely, a concerted effort by alt-right groups (namely the Kotaku in Action and Incel idiots) to flood public commentary on the film. They literally had Facebook groups to organize their brigading.

Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #110 on: March 22, 2019, 10:41:46 am »
I think you'll be just fine without it.

It was fine if you take it as a stand-alone action adventure movie.  It doesn't tell you much about the character that you didn't already know. You see some of the stuff that you already knew about him. He meets Chewbacca. He meets Lando.  He wins the Falcon in a card game. He makes the Kessel Run in 12 parsecs. He's all about the cash, except that he has a heart of gold. Etc.  You knew all this already.

I liked that they made a Star Wars movie with no Skywalkers, no Jedi, no Force, no fighting the Empire. It's some criminals, doing a heist, in a futuristic setting.  It shows a part of the Star Wars universe that you knew existed, but wasn't seen in other Star Wars movies.  And the young actors, especially Donald Glover, are good.  Donald Glover steals the show every time he's on the screen. But it's hardly essential viewing, even for Star Wars fans. It's just a fun movie.

I agree with all this.  For cyber, yup it's a fun action-adventure movie set in a SW world, it's worth a watch.  As I said, it's good, not great.  Go in with modest expectations & you'll have a good time.  I also fell asleep about 30 mins in.  I went back to re-watch and was glad i did.

It's kind of hokey in that they basically show literally everything you heard in the original trilogy about Han's backstory, Like kimmy was saying, and this all happens during a single mission he was on.  That tells me they didn't have much plans for a sequel and just wanted to blow their whole load and get everything in on this one film.  That was my only major criticism.  But it's still fun to see all that stuff, I'd watch a sequel if it happened.

I think the coolest part is seeing the otherwise beat-up old Falcon brand spanking new, all the interiors and exteriors.  Donny Glover also does an amazing job, he sounds exactly like Billy Dee, so much so it's freaky.  Woody Harrison also does a good job, I mean who doesn't love Woody?
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 10:47:26 am by Poonlight Graham »
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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #111 on: March 22, 2019, 11:04:39 am »
The Last Jedi was a great movie and the backlash was largely, if not entirely, a concerted effort by alt-right groups (namely the Kotaku in Action and Incel idiots) to flood public commentary on the film. They literally had Facebook groups to organize their brigading.

Maybe the review-bombing was a bit of an organized affair.  But I post sometimes on Star Wars forums, lots of hardcore star wars nerds had problems with it.  I did too, but have come to appreciate it more.  My friends all had mixed feelings on it too.  It's not terrible, but it's not Rogue One either.  A lot of people, including Mark Hamil, had problems with how Luke was handled.  Some people like yourself genuinely liked it.  I can see why.

For me, it has a lot of great moments and yet a lot of cringy moments too, so I have mixed feelings on it, i like watching it but it's also flawed.  I like that it wasn't predictable.  Rian came up with a bunch of clever twists on our expectations.

It was mostly original, but almost too different from the original trilogy, the feel was off.  On the other hand, A Force Awakens was A New Hope remake with ESB scenes thrown in (Han dying on the bridge) with few original ideas.  I'm glad Rian threw away some of the remake plots he inherited.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 11:07:03 am by Poonlight Graham »
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Offline kimmy

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #112 on: March 24, 2019, 01:20:18 pm »
I also really enjoyed The Last Jedi, but I also understand that a lot of people didn't enjoy it for totally reasonable reasons.  It's hard to sort out how much of the negativity around the film was from actual people who were disappointed with the film and how much was due to the Gamergaters and 4chan types.  Those people have an outsized online presence, but I think everybody-- including they themselves-- greatly overestimate their real power.  It's like the cartoon thing where you see a menacing shadow on the wall, but it turns out to be a mouse standing in front of a flashlight. 

I think, ultimately, that if it was a poor-quality entry in the series that could kill this franchise, it was The Phantom Menace, not The Last Jedi, that would have done it. 

It was mostly original, but almost too different from the original trilogy, the feel was off.  On the other hand, A Force Awakens was A New Hope remake with ESB scenes thrown in (Han dying on the bridge) with few original ideas.  I'm glad Rian threw away some of the remake plots he inherited.

I agree with this. I feel like The Force Awakens was the movie that really deserved more scorn from the hardcore Star Wars fans, because Kennedy and Abrams threw a large portion of the Star Wars canon-- dozens or maybe hundreds of books set after Return Of The Jedi-- in the garbage and said "fuck it, let's just remake A New Hope.  That was stupid.  I really liked that Rian Johnson took a bunch of the most derivative ideas in The Force Awakens and threw them in the trash or turned them on their head.   Kylo smashing the stupid mask was sort of emblematic of the whole theme, to me. He unceremoniously dumped Dollar Store Emperor Palpatine as well.  The idea that Rey's parents were nobodies... junk peddlers, or whatever he called them, was wonderful, and it says something about the whole Star Wars saga that it was such a radical idea to propose that a character didn't have some convoluted connection to previous characters.  I liked that he tried to break a bunch of Star Wars' dumber tropes, and felt a little disappointed that many fans seem to have rebelled against the idea. "We *want* Rey's parents to be somehow connected to the Skywalkers."  "We *want* Dollar Store Emperor Palpatine back!"


I also agree about Rogue One being a really great addition to the franchise.  It started slow, but the buildup to the ending was wonderful. It built up so much momentum in the final act of the movie that I was still amped while I was leaving the theatre. The way that the ending it perfectly dovetailed with the beginning of A New Hope was wonderful, the cameo of Princess Leia at the very end almost made me cry, and best of all the scene with Vader.  That was really the first time in any of the movies they gave you a sense of why everybody in the galaxy was so fucking terrified of him.  It was so good.

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Offline kimmy

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #113 on: March 24, 2019, 02:14:06 pm »
I did get out to see Captain Marvel yesterday, and I enjoyed it a lot.

The three principals are all very likeable. Brie Larson is just fine.  Samuel L Jackson is as charming as ever, and seems to be having a lot of fun here. And Reggie The Cat delivers a nuanced, understated performance as Goose.

What this movie has, more than any other MCU movie, is lots of Samuel L Jackson.  In the other movies, he's been a supporting character. Here, he's front and center, with almost as much screen time as Larson.  They could have made this as a cop buddy movie starring the two of them and it probably would have worked that way too. "She's a by-the-book rookie with a nose for the truth. He's a wily veteran who plays by his own rules."    You could almost imagine Jules Winston driving around with Carol Danvers instead of Vinnie Vega.  "Hey Jules, you know what they call a Quarter Pounder With Cheese on Hala?"   And they have a cat. All the scenes with a cat in them are winners.

There are lots of Easter eggs in the movie, little shout-outs to the comic-book lore of the character.  One scene where she's experimenting with different looks for her outfit gives a brief look at previous incarnations of her costume (though not the black swimwear with lightning-bolt look.)

The movie is set in 1995, and there are lots of nostalgic touches. One scene has Carol attempting to search for information using Alta Vista, but her dial-up connection crapped out before the page could load. Another has the characters all sitting patiently waiting for a computer to load some audio files from a CD.  Lots of 1990s music-- one of my favorite scenes had Carol, in a belligerent mood, roll up her sleeves and get busy with the bad-guys as "Just A Girl" by No Doubt plays.

The movie opens with a Stan Lee montage in place of the usual Marvel opening sequence. And there's a Stan Lee cameo, perhaps his last.  Coolest Easter egg ever: Stan is seen reading a script for "Mall Rats", the 1995 Kevin Smith movie where Stan Lee made his very first cameo appearance. Full circle. Kevin Smith discusses.

"Trust me, True Believer!"

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Offline kimmy

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #114 on: April 27, 2019, 05:32:52 pm »
Avengers End Game has arrived in theatres, and is already smashing box office records.  The reviews are also extremely good.  I will be waiting for the chaos at the theatres to die down a little before I go.



Of course, these movies aren't for everyone. 



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Offline MH

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #115 on: April 27, 2019, 06:03:17 pm »
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Offline the_squid

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #116 on: April 27, 2019, 06:11:03 pm »
The last Avengers movie was really good...  but with so many blockbuster super heroes dying, they are going to have to have some sort of ďdeus ex machina Ē type plot device to bring back guys like Spider-Man.  Iíll be pretty disappointed  if they do something like that.

I havenít looked to see if thatís what they did. 

Offline kimmy

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #117 on: April 28, 2019, 08:47:40 pm »
The last Avengers movie was really good...  but with so many blockbuster super heroes dying, they are going to have to have some sort of ďdeus ex machina Ē type plot device to bring back guys like Spider-Man.  Iíll be pretty disappointed  if they do something like that.

I havenít looked to see if thatís what they did.

They showed the trailer for "Spiderman: Far From Home" when I went to Captain Marvel, so I have a hunch they're bringing him back.  :D


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Offline the_squid

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Re: Superhero Movies
« Reply #118 on: April 28, 2019, 11:22:18 pm »
They showed the trailer for "Spiderman: Far From Home" when I went to Captain Marvel, so I have a hunch they're bringing him back.  :D


 -k

I know they're bringing them back....    but they could have different timelines, I suppose, without ruining the Endgame movie.