Author Topic: So uhh.. Game of Thrones comes back this week.  (Read 879 times)

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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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The writing is terrible in episode 4, and the stupid dialogue makes some of the acting seem bad.  Many of the characters have turned into cardboard cutouts that either now turn "good" or "bad" or "smart" or "dumb", with much of the complexity and shades of grey withering away.

We can now even more appreciate how good of a writer George is, with kudos to the earlier script writers too.

Jon is now a moron ****-chaser, Dany went from caring queen to despot, Sansa betrayed Jon within 5 seconds after learning "the secret" and has gone from dumb girl to smartest tactician in Westeros, Brianne went from stoic badass to weeping loser, Tyrion went from master strategist to total screw-up within a season or 2.
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Offline Boges

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The writing is terrible in episode 4, and the stupid dialogue makes some of the acting seem bad.  Many of the characters have turned into cardboard cutouts that either now turn "good" or "bad" or "smart" or "dumb", with much of the complexity and shades of grey withering away.

We can now even more appreciate how good of a writer George is, with kudos to the earlier script writers too.

Jon is now a moron ****-chaser, Dany went from caring queen to despot, Sansa betrayed Jon within 5 seconds after learning "the secret" and has gone from dumb girl to smartest tactician in Westeros, Brianne went from stoic badass to weeping loser, Tyrion went from master strategist to total screw-up within a season or 2.

Characters need to evolve.

The appeal of the show is that characters have an arch. Hound and Jamie are good guys now. Dany is seemingly a bad guy. Tyrion still has a soft spot for his sister and vice versa.

They're condensing stuff way too much now.

Offline TimG

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Jon is now a moron ****-chaser
To be fair to John: he undermined his position by telling Dany his heritage.  It put him in an a situation where he has to constantly prove his loyalty lest she see him as a rival and a threat. He then made the sitution worse by telling Sansa.

Offline ?Impact

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The appeal of the show is that characters have an arch.

There is a humpback in GoT?

... or do you mean arc?

Offline kimmy

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The bone-headed military tactics are  getting ridiculous. Sending their Calvary into a frontal assault in the dark; having infantry deployed *in front* of the trenches and barricades; dragon riders that can't see ships before they are in firing range. We have incompetence on a grand scale.

I think the lack of consistency is the problem.    In earlier seasons, transportation and logistics was a big deal.  Moving armies around the continent was a major problem.  Strategic locations mattered.  Considerations like how to supply troops mattered. We saw Robb Stark forced to deal with the Freys because he needed to cross the river. We saw Stannis's army withered away by cold and hunger and desertions.  Now armies are zooming around the map like it's a board game.  Euron Greyjoy's navy apparently has the stealth of Red October and the firepower of Lord Vader's Imperial destroyer.  In a couple of seasons they've gone from war being grungy and slow and brutal and medieval, to this new aesthetic that's more like a video game or something. It's a jarring shift in tone.


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Offline kimmy

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To be fair to John: he undermined his position by telling Dany his heritage.  It put him in an a situation where he has to constantly prove his loyalty lest she see him as a rival and a threat. He then made the sitution worse by telling Sansa.

He could learn to keep his mouth shut.   Ned Stark was the paragon of honor, and he kept the secret of Jon's parentage to his grave-- even at the cost of personal dishonor and injury to his wife.  If Ned could keep that secret from his family, I don't see why Jon couldn't.

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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Characters need to evolve.

The appeal of the show is that characters have an arch. Hound and Jamie are good guys now. Dany is seemingly a bad guy. Tyrion still has a soft spot for his sister and vice versa.

They're condensing stuff way too much now.

I think the problem is how quickly these character changes are happening now.  Before it could happen over a season or several episodes, but with only 6 episodes to wrap things up yes they're condensing things too much.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

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I think the lack of consistency is the problem.    In earlier seasons, transportation and logistics was a big deal.  Moving armies around the continent was a major problem.  Strategic locations mattered.  Considerations like how to supply troops mattered. We saw Robb Stark forced to deal with the Freys because he needed to cross the river. We saw Stannis's army withered away by cold and hunger and desertions.  Now armies are zooming around the map like it's a board game.  Euron Greyjoy's navy apparently has the stealth of Red October and the firepower of Lord Vader's Imperial destroyer.  In a couple of seasons they've gone from war being grungy and slow and brutal and medieval, to this new aesthetic that's more like a video game or something. It's a jarring shift in tone.


 -k
Exactly. How did Bronn suddenly show up on Tyrion and Jaime's doorstep with the crossbow in the last episode? Where did he go with it when he decided not to use it?
It's nothing more than poorly thought-out fan fiction now. There is certainly a sense that anything can happen now in the final two episodes because they've dispensed with all logic, character development, and continuity. Should be great.

Offline Boges

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I think the problem is how quickly these character changes are happening now.  Before it could happen over a season or several episodes, but with only 6 episodes to wrap things up yes they're condensing things too much.

I don't think D&D want to do 3 or 4 more seasons of this. Adapting a book is one thing, but creating content the same way George R. Martin does is something completely different.

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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I don't think D&D want to do 3 or 4 more seasons of this. Adapting a book is one thing, but creating content the same way George R. Martin does is something completely different.

That's fine i get that.  They could have run season 8 as 10 episodes though instead of 6, same with season 7.  Instead of trying to horseshoe a narrative that doesn't feel the way the show used to.  Seems they cranked up the budget and big battle the last 2 seasons, but the writing isn't as good sometimes, especially character development and dialogue, which is everything in this show.  Instead we get more epic battle scenes. It's like they want this to be like Lord the Rings.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

Offline kimmy

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Since everything has gone completely ridiculous this season, I hope they give us a "Who's the Daddy?" scene featuring Cersei, Jaime, Euron, and Ser Jerrald of House Springer.

Ser Jerrald:  "The Queen Regent is knocked up again! But who's the daddy?  Cersei Lannister, come on out!"

Cersei takes a seat, and smirks as the studio audience jeers.

Ser Jerrald: "Cersei has been with two men recently. One of them is her own brother! Jaime Lannister, come on out!"

crowd jeers as Jaime takes his seat.

Ser Jerrald: "But Cersei has also been seeing the Lord of the Seas, Euron Greyjoy!"

crowd boos and hisses as Euron arrives, taunting the audience with a "raise the roof" jesture before taking his seat.

Ser Jerrald: "Anything to say to Jaime, Euron?"

Euron: "Jaime! I've been banging your sister! How do ya like that?"

the crowd goes wild as Jaime flips his chair and charges at Euron, only to be held back by the security goldcloaks.

Ser Jerrald: "Settle down, Jaime!  Anything to say to Euron?"

Jaime: "I've already had three babies with her! You've been shooting blanks all these years.  Hope you enjoyed my sloppy seconds."

the audience goes wild as Euron flips his chair and charges at Jaime, only to be held back by the security goldcloaks.

Ser Jerrald: "alright, alright. But Cersei... what can you tell us about this whole situation?"

Cersei: "Pregnant? I can't recall ever saying I was pregnant."

total chaos breaks out; everybody is flipping chairs, security goldcloaks are frantically trying to break up the brawl as Ser Jerrald waves farewell to the audience.


 -k
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Offline kimmy

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Also, I hope that Jaime gets a robot hand like Luke Skywalker, and that Euron's navy gets boarded by Ewoks in birch-bark canoes.

 -k
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Offline Boges

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I didn't see Jamie and Cersei going out like that? That's like the ending of Rogue One. Clegane Bowl was. . . a thing. Stabbing a dude in a head and still having him stay up is bizarre.

So the big bad ends up being Dany and her army. The North has put their lot in with an obvious heel. No one can support her claim now. As she said, she can only rule through fear. That episode up ends everything we've seen from Dany and her armies for every season so far. She didn't have to do what she did and it was a pure act of evil.

The preview didn't indicate how the rest of the "realm" reacted. I suspect Varys has already sown seeds of doubts across the 7 Kingdoms that Jon/Aegon should rule.

Offline kimmy

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Tyrion is now the tallest Lannister!

I was just reading yesterday that "Khaleesi" and "Daenarys" have become popular names for girls. I assume those parents will have to have a long chat with their daughters some day.


SO ANYWAY

This episode was called "The Bells", which is fitting because the ringing of the bells was the dividing point.  Up to there, it had been crowd-pleasing stuff-- Cersei's forces being trounced, insufferable Euron's navy being obliterated, Cersei watching it all helplessly... I found this part really satisfying actually.  Cersei being so confident that somehow she'd still come out on top... seeing everything turn to ashes for her, seeing the realization slowly dawn on her that she was ruined, that was something we've wanted to see for about 8 years, and seeing it finally happen was sweet.

And then the bells ring, signalling the surrender... and Dany thinks about it for a moment and is like "you know what? I'm still mad. I'm not done yet."  And Grey Worm is like "ALSO STILL MAD."  They've foreshadowed this side of her for a long time, so it's not a shocker, but it was still pretty jarring.   She told Jon earlier that she'd have to rule through fear. In earlier seasons we saw her do some incredibly ruthless things in her pursuit of power, always justifying with her belief that she was a more just ruler than those she was replacing.  She lacked the self-awareness to realize she was morphing into the tyrants she'd set out to oppose.  She went past the point of no return this episode.   I get it, I understand this choice... but it was still kind of heartbreaking to see a character that we've cheered for from season 1 go over to the dark side like this.


At the start of the episode we saw Varys writing memos for his little birds to smuggle out.  I assume we're to believe enough of those got out for word to spread all over the seven kingdoms.   But now they've got a dragon queen on the throne and nobody in the land has any weapon that can kill a dragon and there are no armies left that can stand up to Dany's remaining forces. So... how they get out of this jam is a mystery to me. Should be a very interesting finale.


 -k
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Offline Boges

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Arya Deus Ex Machina I reckon.