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Author Topic: Rant - math literacy  (Read 669 times)

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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #45 on: April 30, 2019, 04:25:45 pm »
Here’s the math:


Quote
https://www.thebalance.com/economic-impact-of-climate-change-3305682
In May 2018, Stanford University scientists calculated how much global warming would cost the global economy. If the world's nations adhered to the Paris Climate Agreement, and temperatures only rose 2.5 percent, then the global gross domestic product would fall 15 percent. If temperatures rose to 3 degrees Celsius, global GDP would fall 25 percent. If nothing is done, temperatures will rise by 4 degrees Celsius by 2100. Global GDP would decline by more than 30 percent from 2010 levels. That's worse than the Great Depression, where global trade fell 25 percent.

The only difference is that it would be permanent.


TimG doesn’t care about this math because it doesn’t suit his preconceived narrative.  Deniers will deny.
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #46 on: April 30, 2019, 04:26:15 pm »
Quote from: ?Impact on April 30, 2019, 04:16:49 pm
Ok, I held off long enough. You earn a "dumb" sticker.
Does not change the fact that I am right. You got caught in your own hypocrisy but lack the self awareness needed to acknowledge it.
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Offline Omni

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #47 on: April 30, 2019, 04:27:37 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 04:15:10 pm
But that is my point. As a left wing partisan you don't care about numbers or money or anything else that is needed for practical solutions. You simply latch onto whatever cause you think is important and demand action even if it makes zero sense from an economic perspective. IOW, you can't do math or you simply don't care about the math.

I'm going to suggest we open a coal fired power plant in your backyard. Then we'll wait to see how long, cough, cough, continue to, cough, cough, to try to convince us it's all about "the math" cough, cough.
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #48 on: April 30, 2019, 04:28:04 pm »
Quote from: the_squid on April 30, 2019, 04:25:45 pm
TimG doesn’t care about this math because it doesn’t suit his preconceived narrative.  Deniers will deny.
Math based on *economic models* which Impact says are all political. Do you agree with Impact? I am not rejecting the numbers but rather the politics used to create the models that produced the numbers. What is wrong with that?
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 04:29:47 pm by TimG »
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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #49 on: April 30, 2019, 04:31:26 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 04:28:04 pm
Math based on *economic models* which Impact says are all political. Do you agree with Impact? I am not rejecting the numbers but rather the politics used to create the models that produced the numbers.

No, I don’t agree with impact. 

I do think those without a vested interest will give us a more comprehensive, less biased economic analysis than economists who work to downplay the economic impacts of climate change.  The ones who deny or downplay the impacts are the ones you will agree with as they suit your narrative.
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #50 on: April 30, 2019, 04:34:49 pm »
Quote from: the_squid on April 30, 2019, 04:31:26 pm
I do think those without a vested interest
But who decides who has a vested interest? I personally think all government funded scientists have a vested interested in exaggerating the potential harms because it makes their specialty seem important and more likely to get future funding. Why should you be the one who gets to decide which authorities are free from bias? Why do you believe that your own opinions are not coloured because you ignore opinion that do not tell you what you want to hear?
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 04:40:26 pm by TimG »
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Offline Omni

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #51 on: April 30, 2019, 04:51:55 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 04:34:49 pm
But who decides who has a vested interest? I personally think all government funded scientists have a vested interested in exaggerating the potential harms because it makes their specialty seem important and more likely to get future funding. Why should you be the one who gets to decide which authorities are free from bias? Why do you believe that your own opinions are not coloured because you ignore opinion that do not tell you what you want to hear?

You continue with this less than flimsy argument. Do you actually think government hires scientists and bribes them simply to come up with results that suits some sort of weird political effort? Here's a hint for you, there are many scientists who have similar conclusions that are not gorenment employees. You have pulled the wool well over your eyes it seems.
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Offline cybercoma

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #52 on: April 30, 2019, 04:56:20 pm »
Every. ****. Thread.

We get it, Tim. You don’t believe the scientific consensus on anthropogenic climate change.

Like I said, the less educated vote Conservative.
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #53 on: April 30, 2019, 05:15:10 pm »
Quote from: cybercoma on April 30, 2019, 04:56:20 pm
We get it, Tim. You don’t believe the scientific consensus on anthropogenic climate change.
Once again you are unable to or unwilling to follow the arguments presented and prefer to wallow in your own preconceived notions. In this thread the argument is about economic models which are the basis for any discussion on what to do about the claimed problem. As Impact was trying to argue economic models are never purely scientific exercises and the politics of the modeler matters a lot. But you refuse to acknowledge that because it is inconvenient for your partisan purpose. You would much rather close your ears and eyes and whine about "denying the science" instead of listening to arguments actually being made.
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Offline Omni

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #54 on: April 30, 2019, 05:21:19 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 05:15:10 pm
Once again you are unable to or unwilling to follow the arguments presented and prefer to wallow in your own preconceived notions. In this thread the argument is about economic models which are the basis for any discussion on what to do about the claimed problem. As Impact was trying to argue economic models are never purely scientific exercises and the politics of the modeler matters a lot. But you refuse to acknowledge that because it is inconvenient for your partisan purpose. You would much rather close your ears and eyes and whine about "denying the science" instead of listening to arguments actually being made.

And the arguments by somewhere north of 97% of professional climate scientists concur on that "claimed problem" is actually real. Sounds like you get your info from scientists who actually have a vested interest in being deniers likely paid by Exxon-Mobil, Royal Dutch Shell, etc.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 05:40:06 pm by Omni »
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #55 on: April 30, 2019, 06:41:30 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 04:28:04 pm
Math based on *economic models* which Impact says are all political. Do you agree with Impact?

Economics is about politics. It may rely on models that account those artificial constructs, but they are still artificial. That however has nothing to do with climate science. The real world will still be altered, and no matter what economic model you employ, that will not change. The model the squid was talking about earlier is artificial, but it is the friggen model that your fake economists use, you know the ones that you spread your fear mongering about.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 06:44:56 pm by ?Impact »
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #56 on: April 30, 2019, 06:56:04 pm »
Quote from: ?Impact on April 30, 2019, 06:41:30 pm
The real world will still be altered, and no matter what economic model you employ, that will not change.
But the question is why should we care? If the economic impacts of the change are minimal then there is absolutely no justification for doing anything. We should just adapt. If the economic impacts are large then a case can be made for action depending on the cost relative to the economic impacts.

Bottom line: it is simply impossible to make any decision on what to do about the science without using economic models. That is why it is simply moronic to scream "denier" whenever someone disagrees with the outputs of the economic models that you prefer only because they suit your political preferences.

Quote from: ?Impact on April 30, 2019, 06:41:30 pm
The model the squid was talking about earlier is artificial, but it is the friggen model that your fake economists use, you know the ones that you spread your fear mongering about.
Nothing but hypocritical special pleading. i.e. the economic models you like are good and should be heeded. The models I like are "fake". Are you really so lacking in self awareness that you are unable to see the contradictory nature of your argument?
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #57 on: April 30, 2019, 07:01:41 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 06:56:04 pm
But the question is why should we care? If the economic impacts of the change are minimal

If economic models are based on artificial premises, then who gives a ****. It was also pointed out to you that your holy economic models say it is important, but you continue to keep you head in the sand. The real world changes, and that is what is important. **** your economic models.
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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #58 on: April 30, 2019, 07:11:06 pm »
Quote from: TimG on April 30, 2019, 04:34:49 pm
But who decides who has a vested interest? I personally think all government funded scientists have a vested interested in exaggerating the potential harms because it makes their specialty seem important and more likely to get future funding. Why should you be the one who gets to decide which authorities are free from bias? Why do you believe that your own opinions are not coloured because you ignore opinion that do not tell you what you want to hear?

Conspiracy theory nonsense. 
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Offline TimG

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Re: Rant - math literacy
« Reply #59 on: April 30, 2019, 07:18:56 pm »
Quote from: the_squid on April 30, 2019, 07:11:06 pm
Conspiracy theory nonsense.
You said:

Quote
Sounds like you get your info from scientists who actually have a vested interest in being deniers likely paid by Exxon-Mobil, Royal Dutch Shell, etc.
Why is what you said any different than what I said? If anything what you said really is conspiracy nonsense because the idea that oil companies are paying people to be skeptical of climate change is ridiculous. People are skeptical because the facts do not match the rhetoric spouted by alarmists.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2019, 07:20:51 pm by TimG »
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