Author Topic: Philosophy Culture  (Read 811 times)

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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2018, 04:42:41 pm »
Reasoning is better than having a ring in ones nose from religious indoctrination.. Even faulty reasoning can be corrected by further reasoning.

Most of the time yes.  But the Nazi ideology was based on reasoning also, but very faulty.  With morality, maybe the ends are more important than the means.  ie: If religious indoctrination makes no logical sense (ie: God gave Moses the 10 Commandments) but the results are still good (don't kill, don't steal, don't commit adultery etc) then that's not necessarily a bad thing, could be much worse.
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Offline Omni

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2018, 05:05:01 pm »
Morality would still exist if we lived in isolation because treatment of animals and the environment has moral implications.

I think we do need a tribe to survive.  Our country is one tribe we need.  Without this tribe we wouldn't care about defending our borders to survive, and foreign tribes (countries) could attack or invade us if we didn't band together to protect ourselves& pooling our resources etc.
Why do we need a "tribe" to survive? This is such a silly idea. The world has become. and will continue to become a much smaller place. Doing stupid **** like putting up a Trump wall will only make the inevitable more painful. But I guess if "invasion" is a word you like to throw around then I assume you are a Trumpite.

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2018, 05:17:46 pm »
Why do we need a "tribe" to survive? This is such a silly idea. The world has become. and will continue to become a much smaller place. Doing stupid **** like putting up a Trump wall will only make the inevitable more painful. But I guess if "invasion" is a word you like to throw around then I assume you are a Trumpite.

I wasn't referring to "invasions" by caravans & migrants, I'm talking about literally survival, so attacks & invasions by foreign countries and their militaries, like say Russia or whomever.  If the world didn't have countries with borders that protected themselves from outside violent aggressors, all you would need is one moderately powerful group (tribe) to form and grab all the territory for themselves.

A tribe in the form of a country also has other security benefits, like ability to negotiate trade deals etc that benefit the inhabitants, and negotiate alliances with other "tribes" so they can collectively protect each other from foreign military aggression.
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Offline Omni

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2018, 05:36:36 pm »
I wasn't referring to "invasions" by caravans & migrants, I'm talking about literally survival, so attacks & invasions by foreign countries and their militaries, like say Russia or whomever.  If the world didn't have countries with borders that protected themselves from outside violent aggressors, all you would need is one moderately powerful group (tribe) to form and grab all the territory for themselves.

A tribe in the form of a country also has other security benefits, like ability to negotiate trade deals etc that benefit the inhabitants, and negotiate alliances with other "tribes" so they can collectively protect each other from foreign military aggression.
I guess I' trying to look a little bit further forward. We could **** away a lot of resources building a bunch more useless walls, or we could focus those resources on the inevitability of integration.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2018, 06:14:22 pm »
I guess I' trying to look a little bit further forward. We could **** away a lot of resources building a bunch more useless walls, or we could focus those resources on the inevitability of integration.

Inevitable on what time line? In another eon?
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2018, 06:20:14 pm »
Most of the time yes.  But the Nazi ideology was based on reasoning also, but very faulty.  With morality, maybe the ends are more important than the means.  ie: If religious indoctrination makes no logical sense (ie: God gave Moses the 10 Commandments) but the results are still good (don't kill, don't steal, don't commit adultery etc) then that's not necessarily a bad thing, could be much worse.

Nazi ideology was religious ideology as well. 
“Gott mit uns”

To say religious ideology is peaceful is to ignore centuries of history.   

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2018, 06:31:50 pm »
Nazi ideology was religious ideology as well. 
“Gott mit uns”

To say religious ideology is peaceful is to ignore centuries of history.

It's peaceful NOW. At least Judeo Christianity in the West is.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2018, 06:45:18 pm »
I guess I' trying to look a little bit further forward. We could **** away a lot of resources building a bunch more useless walls, or we could focus those resources on the inevitability of integration.

What does integration mean to you?
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #38 on: November 13, 2018, 06:47:38 pm »
Nazi ideology was religious ideology as well. 
“Gott mit uns”

To say religious ideology is peaceful is to ignore centuries of history.

Well I never said that religion is peaceful, you're right it isn't.

I think any good ideology passes rigorous critique & proves successful in the real world with the passage of time.
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2018, 06:49:53 pm »
It's peaceful NOW. At least Judeo Christianity in the West is.

Religion didn't make the West peaceful IMO, it was probably the fact they almost destroyed themselves in WWI & WWII & said "well that's enough of that!" and created the UN.
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Offline SirJohn

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #40 on: November 13, 2018, 08:15:12 pm »
Religion didn't make the West peaceful IMO, it was probably the fact they almost destroyed themselves in WWI & WWII & said "well that's enough of that!" and created the UN.

What I mean is western religious leaders don't call for persecution or war against those who disbelieve or blaspheme, and haven't for some time. The pope takes Muslim refugees into the Vatican and urges Catholics to sponsor more.

Meanwhile, non Muslims aren't allowed to even pass through Mecca, much less go there.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline MH

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #41 on: November 13, 2018, 08:20:16 pm »
Religion didn't make the West peaceful IMO, it was probably the fact they almost destroyed themselves in WWI & WWII & said "well that's enough of that!" and created the UN.

By today's standards, no, but it provided a framework for order that allowed Europe to excel and conquer the world. 

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2018, 08:42:04 pm »
Morality would still exist if we lived in isolation because treatment of animals and the environment has moral implications.
It has practical implications. For a single person in isolation, there’s no such thing as a moral one because there is no social action.

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #43 on: November 13, 2018, 11:03:16 pm »
What I mean is western religious leaders don't call for persecution or war against those who disbelieve or blaspheme, and haven't for some time. The pope takes Muslim refugees into the Vatican and urges Catholics to sponsor more.

Meanwhile, non Muslims aren't allowed to even pass through Mecca, much less go there.

We're a lot more advanced than every developing country in almost all ways.  Not all, but almost.
I queef, therefore I am.

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Philosophy Culture
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2018, 11:07:50 pm »
It has practical implications. For a single person in isolation, there’s no such thing as a moral one because there is no social action.

So if you were living in isolation you wouldn't think twice when killing an animal, or about the method of killing it?  Would you let a bird land in your hand to feed and then crush it with your bare hand just for fun?

I think you're right about social action, but animals are living beings like humans so it also comes with social action, or at least a conscience since they also feel pain.,
I queef, therefore I am.