Author Topic: New TV Season  (Read 1457 times)

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Offline kimmy

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #45 on: March 09, 2019, 06:38:13 pm »
Exciting news for geeks and nerds, as Amazon Prime this week announced that their long awaited Tolkien TV series will be set in the Second Age of Middle Earth.

That probably doesn't mean much to anybody who hasn't read "The Silmarillion", Tolkien's lesser-known companion to The Hobbit and Lord Of The Rings.  Tolkien's Middle Earth history is divided into three ages. The First Age describes the creation of Middle Earth and its inhabitants by the Valar, a group of deities. The bulk of The Silmarillion is spent describing stories set in the First Age, which largely consists of an epic war between the elves and Melkor, a renegade Valar. The First Age ends with a cataclysmic assault by the remaining Valar against Melkor.

The Second Age is not described in much detail by comparison. Tolkien provides a rough sketch of significant events-- Melkor's apprentice, Sauron rises to take his place as a corrupting influence in Middle Earth. The kingdom of Numenor-- the great race of ancient men whom Aragorn is descended from-- rises in power.  The Rings of Power are forged.  More warring between the elves and Sauron.  The kingdom of Numenor rises, becomes the most powerful force on Middle Earth, and crushes Sauron.  Sauron, at the time the most handsome and charming being in Middle Earth, and charms his way into becoming a royal advisor in Numenor. He fuels the pride and hubris of the Numenorean kings, causing them to end their relationship with the elves, and eventually convincing them to sail to the land of the Valar themselves, in search of immortality.  This causes the wrath of the gods to be unleashed again. Numenor is utterly destroyed-- literally wiped off the map.  The rise and fall of Numenor is detailed in a short portion of The Silmarillion called "The Akallabeth", which is probably the closest thing in Tolkien's work to a religious allegory.   The only Numenoreans who survived were those who had left to found the kingdom of Gondor.  Sauron's physical form is destroyed along with everything else in Numenor, but his spirit returns to Mount Doom to regain physical form, take up his ring, and plot to destroy Gondor and the elves yet again.  The end of the Second Age is shown in the opening scene of The Fellowship Of the Ring movie-- the alliance of Gondor and the elves once again teaming up to beat Sauron.

There is lots of material that could be turned into a series, but Amazon's big reveal was that they posted a Middle Earth map... and then a larger map, and finally a map that showed an unsunken Numenor in the lower left corner. So it seems likely that the rise and fall of Numenor will be a key element of the series they're going to create.




I'm pretty geeked. I'm so glad that they didn't decide to do something shitty like a "Young Aragorn Adventures" or something trying to play off the success of the Peter Jackson movies. Legolas and Gimli driving around Eriador in a van solving mysteries or some dumb **** like that.  Setting their series in the Second Age is a bolder decision showing that they're planning on creating something new rather than trying to ride the coat-tails of the movies.

 -k
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2019, 03:28:29 pm »
I only read The Silmarillion once, about 35 years ago. I found it fairly hard to get engaged, not like the other Tolkien books. Hopefully this series will help make things come alive.

Offline kimmy

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2019, 04:02:43 pm »
I only read The Silmarillion once, about 35 years ago. I found it fairly hard to get engaged, not like the other Tolkien books. Hopefully this series will help make things come alive.

The first time I tried to read it, in my early teens, I couldn't get engaged either. When I read it again at about 20, I was really absorbed in it.

It's written in a completely different style... The Hobbit and LOTR are up-close and detailed stories of tiny pieces of the vast realm he created, while The Silmarillion is the exact opposite, a Cole's Notes summary of a long history with only brief snippets focusing on the individuals and their specific deeds. There are a few parts where it does delve into specific events in greater detail, like the story of Beren and Luthien, but most of it is very terse.

One of the early battles, just after Feanor and the elves have returned to Middle Earth, Morgoth unleashes his armies to try to eradicate them, but the elves completely massacre them. Tolkien sums up the whole battle in a paragraph, concluding with something like... "of the hosts that Morgoth sent forth, all that returned to the gates of Angband was a handful of leaves."   Just a very broad strokes approach to writing, yet with a sort of poetic touch that adds some subtext.

Tolkien was first and foremost a professor of languages. He created these imaginary languages for his own amusement.  Then he created some fictional peoples for his fictional languages.  Then he imagined a fictional world for his fictional peoples.  And then a fictional history for his fictional world, which he sketched out over a span of many years and never really completed.  And of his vast imaginary history, he took one tiny piece-- the story of Bilbo Baggins finding the ring-- and fleshed it out into a complete story for his son when his son to read as a boy.  And later he fleshed out a second piece-- The Lord of The Rings-- for his son to read as a young man.  I think it's interesting to think of the two stories as a father's messages for his son at different ages and ponder what he wanted his son to get from them.


For a TV series based on the Second Age, they'll be doing the same thing-- taking a portion of this long history, and distilling it into an up close look at a small portion and focusing on the characters and events in detail.


 -k
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Offline TimG

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2019, 04:07:26 pm »
It's written in a completely different style... The Hobbit and LOTR are up-close and detailed stories of tiny pieces of the vast realm he created, while The Silmarillion is the exact opposite, a Cole's Notes summary of a long history with only brief snippets focusing on the individuals and their specific deeds. There are a few parts where it does delve into specific events in greater detail, like the story of Beren and Luthien, but most of it is very terse.
I found the Silmarillion as appealing as a history text book and never got past the first couple chapters.  I am sure there is lots of material to build a story out off just like there is a lot of good historical dramas based on real history. I am looking forward to see what Amazon does with it.

Aside: I got in a argument with someone who insisted that Atlantis was a real place and rejected my explanation that it was fictional construct for an ancient Greek story. I wonder if there will be people in 1000 years insisting the middle earth was real?
« Last Edit: March 10, 2019, 04:10:24 pm by TimG »

Offline kimmy

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #49 on: March 10, 2019, 08:44:58 pm »
Aside: I got in a argument with someone who insisted that Atlantis was a real place and rejected my explanation that it was fictional construct for an ancient Greek story.

You should have told your friend that Atlantis was burned down by General Sherman, but has been rebuilt and has become the economic center of the US Deep South.

I wonder if there will be people in 1000 years insisting the middle earth was real?

If humans are still around in 1000 years, it's a fair bet that stupid humans will still be around in 1000 years!


Numenor, after its destruction, was referred to by the elves as "The Downfallen", or in their language, "Atalante". 

Just taking a trip down the Wikipedia rabbit hole, it seems that the tale of the fall of Atlantis, was-- like Tolkien's story of the fall of Numenor-- an allegory for man's hubris leading to his downfall.

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Offline wilber

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #50 on: March 19, 2019, 09:46:28 pm »
Jim Jeffries is back, I was worried he might have been cancelled.
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Offline MH

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #51 on: March 20, 2019, 06:01:55 am »
The final season of Kimmy Schmidt finished and it was pretty much as expected, which is great for me.  I will miss it and hope something new comes up. 

Offline MH

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #52 on: May 29, 2019, 05:41:55 am »
Chernobyl !

Who is watching ?  It's an HBO gig.
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Offline Pinus or Vid or...?????

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #53 on: May 29, 2019, 07:12:16 am »
For all you fans of the Karate Kid movies of the 80s, I watched a series last year called "Cobra Kai."  Stars the two main characters of the Original Karate Kid, but this time it makes Johnny the protagonist.  Well written and I urge anyone who is a fan to watch it.  Unfortunately, it is not on Netflix, but YouTube version of Netflix.
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Offline kimmy

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #54 on: May 29, 2019, 10:40:52 pm »
  Stars the two main characters of the Original Karate Kid, but this time it makes Johnny the protagonist. 

Obviously Johnny was the protagonist!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wAtEBbYhv8


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrzqc7F-Ans

 -k
« Last Edit: May 29, 2019, 10:46:18 pm by kimmy »
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Offline MH

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #55 on: June 03, 2019, 08:55:30 pm »
Chernobyl ?  No one ?

Sheesh it's a word of mouth hit people !

Offline TimG

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #56 on: June 03, 2019, 09:53:03 pm »
Chernobyl ?  No one ?
Anti nuclear propaganda designed to make it even harder for us to use the only useful non-CO2 emitting power source? No thanks. Not much different than a show celebrating anti-vaxxers.

Offline JMT

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #57 on: June 03, 2019, 10:24:44 pm »
Chernobyl ?  No one ?

Sheesh it's a word of mouth hit people !

Literally a masterpiece.  I've never understood that word until Chernobyl.

Offline JMT

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #58 on: June 03, 2019, 10:25:05 pm »
Anti nuclear propaganda designed to make it even harder for us to use the only useful non-CO2 emitting power source? No thanks. Not much different than a show celebrating anti-vaxxers.

Lets pretend it didn't happen.

Offline TimG

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Re: New TV Season
« Reply #59 on: June 03, 2019, 10:41:56 pm »
Lets pretend it didn't happen.
There is a difference between learning the facts so we can learn from them and an emotion laden drama designed to attract viewers. The latter will always sacrifice facts for entertainment and, in this case, to support the ideology of the makers.

You argument is like saying a movie about the horrible consequences that rarely occur from vaccinations should be celebrated because it is good drama despite the anti-vax propaganda. Why is Chernobyl any different?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2019, 10:44:26 pm by TimG »