Author Topic: How the poor get screwed  (Read 138 times)

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Offline wilber

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2017, 12:24:52 pm »
I was just looking at RBC cards online. The interest rates are shown right at the top in large bold font. You don't have to go looking for them.

Credit cards are the easiest form of credit so they are the most abused. How many cards would you have to max out to carry 100K? Wow!
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Offline waldo

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2017, 12:31:09 pm »
No one of any intelligence would suggest that a bank PR sheet would be any sort of adequate response to the question about high interest rates.

that explains why you're suggesting it! Again, don't be afraid of information/facts... they can be your friend, lil' buddy.

unlike you, an open-minded person would recognize there may be business cost attachments associated with credit cards - who knew! That CBA list, along with the provided link to CreditCards Canada, offers insight into some of those cost attachments... while also highlighting there are many low(er) interest credit cards available - with some 30 of those with rates below 13%. Of course, as is your snot-snivelling way, instead of actually referring to the information/facts I provided to YOUR thread, you completely ignore them... you dismiss them; opting instead to personalize with your simple-minded responses intended to impugn the integrity of the waldo who only wishes to better the content references within your clearly one-sided and lame-assed thread attempt.

Offline TimG

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2017, 12:32:50 pm »
No one has to smoke crack, but we make crack illegal anyway. Why is that? Is it because we've determined that it's not good for our society to have people smoking crack?
We, as a society, have to find the right balance between protecting people from themselves and letting people make their own choices. When it comes to interest rates on loans we already have laws prohibiting 'usury' (laws which are regularly circumvented by paid day loan companies through the use of "fees"). So the issue is not whether rates should be regulated but whether the maximum allowable interest should be lowered. I think it would make sense to tie legal limit to the BOC rate and lower to 20% to reflect the drop interest rates over the last 20 years. I don't think it should go much further than that.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2017, 01:00:49 pm »
If you don't pay off your credit card monthly on a consistent basis you're an idiot
If you can't see how someone might need to put something on credit (Argus even gave examples) and not be able to pay it off fully at the end of the month, then it's not the working poor who are the idiots.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2017, 03:25:10 pm »
We, as a society, have to find the right balance between protecting people from themselves and letting people make their own choices. When it comes to interest rates on loans we already have laws prohibiting 'usury' (laws which are regularly circumvented by paid day loan companies through the use of "fees"). So the issue is not whether rates should be regulated but whether the maximum allowable interest should be lowered. I think it would make sense to tie legal limit to the BOC rate and lower to 20% to reflect the drop interest rates over the last 20 years. I don't think it should go much further than that.

Look, I'm not saying they shouldn't make a nice profit of this. But I've seen and read stories about the predatory practices of these credit card companies, which love to extend credit to poorer people, knowing they'll maintain monthly balances. I think the payday loans are a disgrace. There weren't any, that I can recall, when I was younger. Now they sprout like weeds, and the ones who use them the most are the ones who understand them the least. We need to educate people in high school about how loans and financing works. Because an astonishing number don't understand the additional money they are paying out. There was a story today about how so many car companies encourage people to extend their loans for seven years, emphasizing how low their bi-weekly payments are (bi-weekly is a relatively new term lenders use to make the cost seem lower). I experienced this myself when I bought a car recently, and when I bought one five years ago. The salesmen kept telling me the biweekly cost, and I had to keep insisting that they shut up about the biweekly payments and give me the final price.

The story of how the poor get poorer and the rich get richer is not entirely about salaries. It's also about how people get screwed over by business when they don't understand the legal jargon in sales agreements and don't understand how financing works against them.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 03:28:11 pm by SirJohn »
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline SirJohn

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2017, 03:40:04 pm »
nlike you, an open-minded person would recognize there may be business cost attachments associated with credit cards - who knew!

I own stock in banks and get their yearly reports. I also took Business Administration in school
And you?

Quote
That CBA list, along with the provided link to CreditCards Canada, offers insight into some of those cost attachments... while also highlighting there are many low(er) interest credit cards available - with some 30 of those with rates below 13%.

Low rates usually come with fine print. Why would a bank offer a rate at 2/3rd of its other rates? To be nice? No, there'll be heavy penalties for late payments, lower grace periods before interest applies, monthly/yearly fees. Etc.


« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 03:46:43 pm by JMT »
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2017, 08:20:49 pm »
Are you a libertarian ?

Because the principle of not protecting poor people (at all) leans that way.  Liberals want to protect people to an absurd degree, from the fright du jour.  Conservatives want to protect people from brown folks and socialism.  NDP is afraid of everything.

But Libertarians love the guy who is trying to steal my parents' retirement funds.

I'm not a libertarian.  Some people are predatory, especially banks & other financial companies.  I'm definitely for regulating the financial industry.  Now, the interest rates for credit cards shouldn't be in fine print, they should be up front and bolded so everyone knows what they're getting into.  Maybe the max interest rates could even be regulated a wee bit.

But as long as the terms of the agreement are there clearly in plain writing (which they may not be) then after that if you get in over your head that's your fault.  Even still, the terms of the contract should still be there and ultimately it's your fault, not the government's for signing a bad deal. I don't like credit card salesmen sucking in young & poor people though without telling them the whole story upfront though, they should be required to verbally tell them the interest rates when they're pushing to make the sale instead of leaving it to the fine print.
I can tell how good of a person you are by how you treat the people you disagree with.

Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2017, 08:25:13 pm »
There is an aspect of this I sympathize with, which is personal responsibility. I agree with all you've written above, and yet I also disagree. I think we have to recognize that not everyone was created with equal cognitive abilities, nor intellectual advantages, and that even those who are can be changed due to circumstances as they are raised. Then, too, our education system provides virtually no information to young people about finances and the long-term implications of taking on debt. Hell, even our prime minister doesn't understand it. Or at least, doesn't care. So it's easy to understand how people can fall into the trap of 'the minimum monthly payment', and see it gradually get bigger and bigger and take more and more of their salary every month. By the time you realize you're in trouble it can be hard to get out. I'm generally not in favour of the state trying to involve itself in the market, but I do think that some action needs to be taken here simply because it would be in society's interests to do so. And, frankly, because it offends my sense of fairness and justice to see large and wealthy institutions taking advantage of the poor and ignorant.

Well I agree with you.  If it's banks vs poor people, I choose the interests of poor people in this case.  There needs to be a minimum level of oversight here & disclosure verbally by the bank  I also don't think it takes much intelligence to understand the consequences of these cards, people are just really really stupid.  And it's certainly not just poor people who get into these debt problems, it's people who know better but just do it anyways.  Like people who smoke.

But there needs to be some minimum regulation here, because as you said, these debt problems can start to impact us all on a macro-economic level, like in the US mortgage crisis, so we all have an interest in this.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 08:26:58 pm by CuckFace »
I can tell how good of a person you are by how you treat the people you disagree with.

Offline wilber

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Re: How the poor get screwed
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2017, 09:42:48 pm »
I think credit is far too easy to get but credit card applications are very upfront about their interest rates, If those rates were cut in half, do you think those same people wouldn't still get themselves in trouble? Just curious.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 10:31:17 pm by wilber »
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC