Author Topic: Gender Culture  (Read 56180 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12477
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1200 on: July 23, 2019, 09:10:34 am »
Why BS ?

Context is a human thing.  If human affairs were mathematics then black pride and white pride would be equal.

Offline kimmy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5033
  • Location: Kim City BC
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1201 on: July 23, 2019, 10:14:07 am »
Pointing out that violent threats come from some group isn't really germane to anything unless you are saying that the group is associated with violence ie. they are violent whether they are organized or not.

I am sure that some Belgians may threaten me online but unless Belgians as a group are known to do it then it's irrelevant.  If a lesbian threatens me, is it because she's a lesbian?  Probably not.

But it's a balancing act.  I wouldn't say Republicans are violent but maybe that Trump rallies CAN be?

I don't think we need to make a blanket statement about Republicans as a group to point out that if you're a reporter or a minority, a Trump rally can be a threatening and dangerous place to be.

I don't think we need to make a blanket statement about transwomen to acknowledge that many women who've turned down transwomen for sex have experienced intimidation, threats, doxxing, harassment, and even violence.  The survey from "Get the L Out" that I posted earlier makes that point, as does a plethora of personal stories I've read.  It's unknowable what portion of transwomen exhibit this entitled, narcissistic behavior. What is not unknowable is that many women have very negative experiences when transwomen approach them.

If I told you "don't flash your money around when you get to Craptown because a lot of people get robbed there", is your reaction "ok, thanks for the tip" or is it "not all Craptown residents are robbers. I don't think there's any firm linkage between Craptown and robbery..."

 ...and when you do get to Craptown, are you going to be cautious about flashing your money around?

 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City
Winner Winner x 2 View List

Offline cybercoma

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2956
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1202 on: July 23, 2019, 11:24:24 am »
trans incels. That's what they are.
Agree Agree x 1 View List

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12477
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1203 on: July 23, 2019, 12:23:59 pm »
1. I don't think we need to make a blanket statement about transwomen to acknowledge that many women who've turned down transwomen for sex have experienced intimidation, threats, doxxing, harassment, and even violence.  The survey from "Get the L Out" that I posted earlier makes that point, as does a plethora of personal stories I've read.  It's unknowable what portion of transwomen exhibit this entitled, narcissistic behavior. What is not unknowable is that many women have very negative experiences when transwomen approach them.

2. If I told you "don't flash your money around when you get to Craptown because a lot of people get robbed there", is your reaction "ok, thanks for the tip" or is it "not all Craptown residents are robbers. I don't think there's any firm linkage between Craptown and robbery..."

3.  ...and when you do get to Craptown, are you going to be cautious about flashing your money around?

 -k
1. Then why point out that it's a trans woman?  You may not be making a blanket statement but by pointing it out you are saying the detail is significant. 'I got robbed... And wouldn't you know it was a guy with a DIGITAL watch, just saying...' is not something people say.


2. Hmmm... Craptown eh?  I think that you may have undermined your point with that analogy.

3. Is Craptown where the trans women live.

I will give you this: saying ANYTHING controversial on Twitter is a bad idea.

Offline ?Impact

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2941
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1204 on: July 23, 2019, 12:35:15 pm »
Marginalized minorities often get away with a lot of BS that the majority can't.  Racist, sexist comments etc.  It's a BS double-standard

Yes, they can become President.

Offline kimmy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5033
  • Location: Kim City BC
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1205 on: July 23, 2019, 07:57:49 pm »
1. Then why point out that it's a trans woman?  You may not be making a blanket statement but by pointing it out you are saying the detail is significant. 'I got robbed... And wouldn't you know it was a guy with a DIGITAL watch, just saying...' is not something people say.

Funny but no.  Their being trans isn't incidental information. When these people are going around accusing people of transphobia for rejecting them, their being trans isn't just a pertinent detail, it's a crucial detail.  They're not handling rejection badly, they're Fighting Transphobia!


Again, Michael, read this and then tell me with a straight face that there isn't an issue specifically involving trans-women:

http://www.gettheloutuk.com/attachments/LesbiansAtGroundZeroFindings.pdf




2. Hmmm... Craptown eh?  I think that you may have undermined your point with that analogy.

3. Is Craptown where the trans women live.

Craptown is the east end of Kim City, which is a high-crime area.  If you want to substitute some other high crime location, feel free.

If you want to break down the analogy, it goes like this:

 -Michael receiving advice from Kimmy <---->  random lesbian receiving sage words of wisdom.

 -going to Craptown <----> going to gay bars, gay dating sites, or any other former lesbian social spaces that have turned into sausage-fests in recent years.

 -random Craptown robber <----> random "transbian" harassing women for sex (ie, a dangerous stranger who you could well encounter in your travels.)

 -flashing your money around in Craptown <----> giving a transbian any excuse to call you transphobic (ie, a behavior that could draw harmful attention from the aforementioned stranger.)

The main difference is that unlike the Craptown robber, the Woke Folx will be cheering the transbian on.


 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City

Offline waldo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 8715
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1206 on: July 23, 2019, 08:55:05 pm »
But now Canadian media is allowed to report on it as well.   JY is Jessica Yaniv, who was known as Jonathan Yaniv as late as November of last year.

Tucker invokes Occam's Razor - says Canada allows Yaniv's bullying because Canada's sick society hates itself!   ;D

Offline Omni

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 8563
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1207 on: July 23, 2019, 09:27:11 pm »
Tucker often looks like he just got hit between the eyes with a baseball bat, and then he opens his mouth and provides further evidence of that possibility. At least he is working for the appropriate "fake news" channel where it's actually all about entertainment.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12477
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1208 on: July 23, 2019, 09:49:27 pm »
Funny but no.  Their being trans isn't incidental information. When these people are going around accusing people of transphobia for rejecting them, their being trans isn't just a pertinent detail, it's a crucial detail.  They're not handling rejection badly, they're Fighting Transphobia!


So trans women are a violent group?

Quote
Michael, read this and then tell me with a straight face that there isn't an issue specifically involving trans-women:

http://www.gettheloutuk.com/attachments/LesbiansAtGroundZeroFindings.pdf




Craptown is the east end of Kim City, which is a high-crime area.  If you want to substitute some other high crime location, feel free.

Link doesn't work?


[Q


Quote
If you want to break down the analogy, it goes like this:

 -Michael receiving advice from Kimmy <---->  random lesbian receiving sage words of wisdom.

 -going to Craptown <----> going to gay bars, gay dating sites, or any other former lesbian social spaces that have turned into sausage-fests in recent years.

 -random Craptown robber <----> random "transbian" harassing women for sex (ie, a dangerous stranger who you could well encounter in your travels.)

 -flashing your money around in Craptown <----> giving a transbian any excuse to call you transphobic (ie, a behavior that could draw harmful attention from the aforementioned stranger.)

The main difference is that unlike the Craptown robber, the Woke Folx will be cheering the transbian on.


 -k

Does <---> mean equal or unequal ?
Dumb Dumb x 1 View List

Offline Goddess

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 817
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1209 on: July 24, 2019, 10:11:39 am »


Link doesn't work?


Worked for me.  :)
"A religion without a Goddess is half-way to atheism."
Like Like x 1 View List

Offline kimmy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5033
  • Location: Kim City BC
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1210 on: July 24, 2019, 10:30:43 am »
Tucker invokes Occam's Razor - says Canada allows Yaniv's bullying because Canada's sick society hates itself!   ;D

Yep, well, Tucker is a demagogue, and gogues gonna gogue.  I think a more reasonable explanation is that Canada is a well-meaning society that didn't give adequate thought to the potential downside of on-demand self-ID and that naively believed that it wouldn't be abused by unsavory individuals.  And in that context I think that makes this a significant news story.

Which makes it disappointing that while this case has attracted international attention, the silence from Canada's media-- other than the Waldo-derided "CONmedia"-- has been deafening.


 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City

Offline kimmy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5033
  • Location: Kim City BC
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1211 on: July 24, 2019, 10:33:49 am »
Worked for me.  :)

I think the link only works for people who want to read the article.

Nonetheless, for the benefit of Michael and others who might not be able to launch the PDF directly from the link, this is the webpage that links to the survey and its companion document.

http://www.gettheloutuk.com/blog/category/research/lesbians-at-ground-zero.html

 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City
Dislike Dislike x 1 View List

Offline kimmy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5033
  • Location: Kim City BC
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1212 on: July 24, 2019, 10:42:04 am »
So trans women are a violent group?

No? Yes? Maybe? It seems like you're hanging your hat on a pointless distinction.

Are (cisgender, heterosexual) men a violent group?  No? Yes? Maybe?  Does it matter?  If you're a woman alone with strange men, you better be cautious, regardless of whether you think men as a collective are violent.

Women have developed a collective lore for being safe around men, whether men as "a group" are violent or not.  A similar collective lore will need to develop for dealing with trans women.

Link doesn't work?

try this http://www.gettheloutuk.com/blog/category/research/lesbians-at-ground-zero.html

Does <---> mean equal or unequal ?

It means analogous to, but I think you already figured that out on your own.

 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City

Offline cybercoma

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2956
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1213 on: July 24, 2019, 11:07:22 am »
I feel like it's just imprecision of language here that's making the broader point lost.

kimmy feels attacked and so she should. There are trans-rights individuals who have advocated violence and it's reprehensible. They are the transgender version of alt-right incels and it's vile.

We should be intelligent enough to recognize trans rights and the oppression that transgender people face, while also being able to condemn those trangender persons who advocate **** and violence against those who do not want to have sexual relationships with them.

At the same time, trans people are trying to argue that they ought to have a space at the table for women's rights because they are women by socially-constructed gender hierarchies. Especially those who pass, face many of the same forms of discrimination and limitations that biologically assigned women face.

None of that makes it acceptable to call for raping lesbians who won't have sex with trans women or beating and murdering trans-exclusionary feminists. Both views can be held at once.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2019, 02:29:03 pm by cybercoma »
Like Like x 1 View List

Offline waldo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 8715
Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #1214 on: July 24, 2019, 11:43:30 am »
Yep, well, Tucker is a demagogue, and gogues gonna gogue.  I think a more reasonable explanation is that Canada is a well-meaning society that didn't give adequate thought to the potential downside of on-demand self-ID and that naively believed that it wouldn't be abused by unsavory individuals.  And in that context I think that makes this a significant news story.

is your declared 'well-meaning society'... self-correcting the unsavory individual abuse you speak of? If not - why not? If not - what would you like to occur; specifically occur?

Which makes it disappointing that while this case has attracted international attention, the silence from Canada's media-- other than the Waldo-derided "CONmedia"-- has been deafening.

a cursory googly just returned a CBC article that speaks to twitter bans - and goes into some detail concerning the exchanges between Yaniv and Lindsay Shepard. Not every outlet will sink to the depths of a NP Rex Murphy screed (for example)!

not sure what you're expecting... and in what timeframe! You yourself stated: "This week, as some of those complaints are heard by the BCHRC, the commission has removed the publication ban on JY's real name.  Some of us who have been following this tale for some time already know this individual's real name and disturbing history.  But now Canadian media is allowed to report on it as well."

I appreciate this is most topical for you; however, perhaps wait for than a "few days" before excoriating ALL Media for not following the ConMedia zeal - yes?