Author Topic: Gender Culture  (Read 56144 times)

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guest4

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #75 on: July 24, 2017, 12:12:07 pm »
Maybe you should come to terms with the reality that a lot of your beliefs, cares and concerns are pretty far out there, by comparison with the greater population, and that it isn't everyone else who is the extremist, but you. If you think any substantial portion of the population ever even thinks about, much less cares about trans whatever people you're kidding yourself.

Since when did majority opinion automatically equal the correct thing to do?  If it weren't for people pushing boundaries against the status quo, the generally accepted and the majority opinion, we'd be approximately as socially advanced as the Muslims you love to criticize for their backwardness.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #76 on: July 24, 2017, 12:32:15 pm »
Since when did majority opinion automatically equal the correct thing to do?  If it weren't for people pushing boundaries against the status quo, the generally accepted and the majority opinion, we'd be approximately as socially advanced as the Muslims you love to criticize for their backwardness.

You mean the Muslims you spend all your time defending for their peacefulness? All the time defending for their progressive nature and how kind they are to everyone, and their wonderful feminist beliefs? Even criticizing the way women are treated in the middle east draws you out to shriek that they're just as well off as Canadian women.

In any event, you are using the same argument MH put only far less coherently. Admiring our modern, sophisticated culture does not mean embracing every stupid fashionable idea the Left embraces.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

guest4

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #77 on: July 24, 2017, 12:46:33 pm »
You mean the Muslims you spend all your time defending for their peacefulness? All the time defending for their progressive nature and how kind they are to everyone, and their wonderful feminist beliefs? Even criticizing the way women are treated in the middle east draws you out to shriek that they're just as well off as Canadian women.

I've had posts removed on Muslim discussion lists for criticizing those very things you mention.   The problem you have with me is that you fail to see how xenophobic and Islamaphobic you are.  You bring up good points, but then you haughtily ascribe behaviors to everyone Muslim, pretend you can read an individual's mind based on what she is wearing, and support unequal treatment for them.  While you claim to be supporting women in this endeavor, in other posts you complain about any iota of political status given to women because "Surely there was a guy more qualified" and bemoaning female empowerment generally.

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In any event, you are using the same argument MH put only far less coherently. Admiring our modern, sophisticated culture does not mean embracing every stupid fashionable idea the Left embraces.
It's just fun for me to point our your hypocrisy.

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Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #78 on: July 24, 2017, 12:49:40 pm »
This is actually one of the reasons that the courts are independent, so that they can assess such questions independent of the whims of politics.  Just thought I would point that out.
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #79 on: July 24, 2017, 01:39:42 pm »
That's also not true. There's examples in nature of genetic mutations occurring changing an animal's sex.

Show me examples of it occurring in humans.  I want to see vaginas turning into penises.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

guest4

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #80 on: July 24, 2017, 01:48:16 pm »
Show me examples of it occurring in humans.  I want to see vaginas turning into penises.

Not penises turning into vaginas?

https://stillselecting.wordpress.com/2013/04/30/natural-human-sex-change/

Offline Goddess

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #81 on: July 24, 2017, 02:11:52 pm »
Not a dogmatic opinion, as I'm aware there could be exceptions, but my general feeling when assessing these things is:

Gender/Sexual orientation is not a choice.

Your religion is a choice.

Accomodating gender/sexual orientation/people with disabilities, etc. should be done as much as possible to include as many people as possible.  Trans people are becoming more accepted and perhaps one day there will be 4 types of bathrooms - men's, women's, trans men's and trans female's.

Accomodating religious beliefs is another beast, IMO.  Your religion is a choice.  If your religion demands you only eat halal food (for example), then that is your choice.  Find restaurants, grocery stores that offer it or do without.  I don't agree with forcing restaurants (or any other type of business) to accomodate religious beliefs.  If your religion is against homosexuals, then that is your choice.  Don't open a bakery, if you feel that strongly about not baking a cake for a gay wedding.

I think accomodating people who have no choice in what they are - such as those with disabilities is the compassionate way to go.

Accomodating ridonkulous religious beliefs.....well, where would that end?
"A religion without a Goddess is half-way to atheism."

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #82 on: July 24, 2017, 03:40:45 pm »
Not penises turning into vaginas?

https://stillselecting.wordpress.com/2013/04/30/natural-human-sex-change/

These appear like disorders that change output of hormones so they change mainly secondary sex characteristics, like males growing breasts or females growing facial hair.  But secondary sex characters do not change the biological sex/chromosomes.  Similar to things that happen during puberty when hormones rage & change, but during puberty you don't become "male " or "female" or whatnot, your sex and chromosomes are determined when you're in the womb.

Unless there's a disorder that can go back in time, stick you back in the womb, and make your **** into a **** & switch up your chromosomes I'll maintain that biological sex is unchangeable. 

Trans people and whomever else can take hormones and have surgeries that change secondary sex characteristics, or even cosmetically alter parts of primary sex organs, and more power to them I think people should be free to look & feel who they want to be.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

guest4

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #83 on: July 24, 2017, 03:50:52 pm »
These appear like disorders that change output of hormones so they change mainly secondary sex characteristics, like males growing breasts or females growing facial hair.  But secondary sex characters do not change the biological sex/chromosomes.  Similar to things that happen during puberty when hormones rage & change, but during puberty you don't become "male " or "female" or whatnot, your sex and chromosomes are determined when you're in the womb.

Unless there's a disorder that can go back in time, stick you back in the womb, and make your **** into a **** & switch up your chromosomes I'll maintain that biological sex is unchangeable. 

Trans people and whomever else can take hormones and have surgeries that change secondary sex characteristics, or even cosmetically alter parts of primary sex organs, and more power to them I think people should be free to look & feel who they want to be.

Fair enough.   I was being a little bit tongue in cheek with that cite.   So how about intersex people?  If someone is born with a **** and then grows breasts at puberty, should they be required to remove one or the other in order to satisfy the majority expectations of male and female?

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #84 on: July 24, 2017, 04:04:18 pm »
I've had posts removed on Muslim discussion lists for criticizing those very things you mention.

Which shows how intolerant they are, that even the most diffident, obsequious questioning of their rigid cultural codes gets your post deleted.

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The problem you have with me is that you fail to see how xenophobic and Islamaphobic you are.

On the contrary. The problem I have with you is you're a typical self-hating, hand-wringing progressive awash in guilt over what you imagine are white sins against 'brown people' and desperate to make it up to them all by being their great protector. Your own innate racism causes you to turn your eyes aside at their blemishes and problems and make excuses for them as if they were little children who couldn't stick up for or protect themselves.

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You bring up good points, but then you haughtily ascribe behaviors to everyone Muslim,

You make this complaint all the time, despite the fact that the discussion is not about individuals but about "THE MUSLIM WORLD", and so is with regard to THE MUSLIM WORLD and its cultural mores and behavior. But you refuse to accept evidence and polls about beliefs within that world as expressed by 70%-80%-90% of respondents, and blithely dismiss such views as if they're only that of an occasional extremist. All because your earnest belief that you must defend brown people from any and all criticism. Ninety two percent of women in Egypt have been subjected to FGM but to you, Egypt is a wonderful land of gender equality where women walk the streets proudly. Oh, perhaps there's a little occasional harassment, but hey, nothing like the den of **** and abuse that is Canada, eh!

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pretend you can read an individual's mind based on what she is wearing,

Uh, yeah, if someone is wearing a KKK hood I have a pretty good idea what they think of Jews and black people. And if someone is wearing Islamist headgear I have a pretty good idea of what they think of Jews and infidels and gays  and women. It's not rocket science. There is no one wearing a KKK outfit who believes in racial equality and there is no one wearing a burka who believes in gender equality.

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in other posts you complain about any iota of political status given to women because "Surely there was a guy more qualified" and bemoaning female empowerment generally.

Because I believe in equality of opportunity, not equality of results. I believe in gender equality - clearly unlike you - I think that giving women jobs because they're women, and not because they're the better person for the job, is stupid, demeaning and also inefficient. I'm a firm believer in meritocracy and self reliance, whereas you're a firm believer in identity politics and in doing things FOR people because you believe they're too stupid to do it for themselves.

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It's just fun for me to point our your hypocrisy.

My opinions are never hypocritical. Just like yours never contain much thought or intelligence.

See, I don't discriminate. I'll call a person a moron whether they're male or female, black or white.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 04:07:08 pm by SirJohn »
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Michael Hardner

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Offline SirJohn

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #86 on: July 24, 2017, 06:00:39 pm »
A thoughtful and illuminating cartoon series:
http://bust.com/arts/16202-artist-drags-sexism-toxic-masculinity-and-double-standards-in-epic-comic-takedowns.html

I would suggest that your approval of it is more about it agreeing with you than being either quality drawing (it's not) or insightful (it's not).
It's simply more of the sneers progressives like to make towards the people they hate the most - straight white males.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 06:04:26 pm by SirJohn »
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

guest4

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #87 on: July 24, 2017, 07:02:08 pm »
Which shows how intolerant they are, that even the most diffident, obsequious questioning of their rigid cultural codes gets your post deleted.
You think I'm diffident and obsequious?  Wow.  Anyway, yeah - they don't like to be criticized.  Neither do you; you and they are rather the same, but you can't delete my posts. 

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On the contrary. The problem I have with you is you're a typical self-hating, hand-wringing progressive awash in guilt over what you imagine are white sins against 'brown people' and desperate to make it up to them all by being their great protector. Your own innate racism causes you to turn your eyes aside at their blemishes and problems and make excuses for them as if they were little children who couldn't stick up for or protect themselves.
Hogwash.  You make so many assumptions about people you know nothing about.   

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You make this complaint all the time, despite the fact that the discussion is not about individuals but about "THE MUSLIM WORLD", and so is with regard to THE MUSLIM WORLD and its cultural mores and behavior. But you refuse to accept evidence and polls about beliefs within that world as expressed by 70%-80%-90% of respondents, and blithely dismiss such views as if they're only that of an occasional extremist. All because your earnest belief that you must defend brown people from any and all criticism. Ninety two percent of women in Egypt have been subjected to FGM but to you, Egypt is a wonderful land of gender equality where women walk the streets proudly. Oh, perhaps there's a little occasional harassment, but hey, nothing like the den of **** and abuse that is Canada, eh!
They seem to walk the streets proudly, at least when I was there.  Yeah, I am aware of the incidence of FGM in Egypt, and also that it applies equally to Christians in Egypt.  That is the part that you consistently ignore:  FGM and many other practices within the Middle East are cultural and not specifically Islamic.   That is what I object to when you go on about how barbaric Muslims are.  And objecting to ignorance that you spew constantly, your xenophobic comments doesn't mean I'm oblivious to the issues or the problems that women and minorities have in the Middle East or even that some of them bring those same practices to Western Countries.   

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Uh, yeah, if someone is wearing a KKK hood I have a pretty good idea what they think of Jews and black people. And if someone is wearing Islamist headgear I have a pretty good idea of what they think of Jews and infidels and gays  and women. It's not rocket science. There is no one wearing a KKK outfit who believes in racial equality and there is no one wearing a burka who believes in gender equality.

If the only time these people wore a burka was to oppress woman, your analogy might stand.  But sadly for you, a woman in a burka may actually not follow the agenda you've set out for her.   But again, you make assumptions about people because you are too lazy to look at people as individuals.  Instead you put them in groups:  lefties, Muslims, Aboriginals, feminists, etc.

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Because I believe in equality of opportunity, not equality of results. I believe in gender equality - clearly unlike you -
Nah.  You proved that wrong when you argued passionately that the women JT chose for his cabinet could not have been as qualified as any male available. 

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I think that giving women jobs because they're women, and not because they're the better person for the job, is stupid, demeaning and also inefficient. I'm a firm believer in meritocracy and self reliance, whereas you're a firm believer in identity politics and in doing things FOR people because you believe they're too stupid to do it for themselves.
Nope.  You assume that if JT appointed a woman, then it was for political reasons, not because she merited it.  You assume that a better-qualified man was available and was passed over in favor of a woman.  That is gender-bias right there.   You reject the notion that perhaps in previous administrations, fully-qualified women were passed over in favor of men - because in your world, men are the natural recipients of status and power. 




Offline kimmy

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #88 on: July 24, 2017, 07:16:27 pm »
simply more of the sneers progressives like to make towards the people they hate the most - straight white males.

 whaaaa???

 -k
Paris - London - New York - Kim City

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Gender Culture
« Reply #89 on: July 24, 2017, 07:36:20 pm »
whaaaa???

 -k

You didn't know white males were so hard done by?