Author Topic: Burning Man Culture  (Read 951 times)

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Offline JMT

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2019, 09:43:55 pm »
This is still some weird **** ****.
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Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #31 on: January 25, 2019, 03:26:06 am »
They really are pooping where they shouldn’t...  and creating more garbage than they’re allowed.   It’s certainly not a “no trace” event, despite what’s advertised.

"Leave no Trace" is an impossible goal, but by saying it you help ensure that there is hardly any garbage.

We camp on something like 100 ft X 400 ft and spend the last hours with a crew of people going through the entire site inch by inch picking up ANYTHING.  A toothpick is too much.  A cigarette filter is too much.  A sequin is too much.  All camping areas (really at all events) are reviewed this way.  Then after everyone is gone, they sweep the areas again with the official crew and note anything they find.  A few months later it gets posted on a huge map online with red/yellow/green markings.  If they found a beer can on the south west corner of your camp, there would be a red mark there.  Then next year, camps with red have to explain themselves, and find it difficult to be allowed back.

Compare this to something like a music festival.

There's nothing new in the Vice article.  The areas noted in the article are common areas far away from the site.  People are pigs, sure, but what is the degree of the problem ?  No mention, and just another dump-on by the media who can't convey the event properly.
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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #32 on: January 25, 2019, 01:12:03 pm »
I'm sure you and your friends are very clean....   but the festival is not.  Let's not pretend otherwise.  The hypocrisy of it is what people may find annoying...

Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #33 on: January 25, 2019, 07:04:57 pm »
Without an absolute measure of messiness you have nothing.

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #34 on: January 25, 2019, 09:18:28 pm »
Without an absolute measure of messiness you have nothing.

Nonsense.  That’s Burning Man apologetics! 

We have government reports of excessive garbage and people shitting where they shouldn’t. 

And you want to know how many litres of ****, or it never happened?   ::)

Offline kimmy

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #35 on: January 26, 2019, 03:45:32 am »
Without an absolute measure of messiness you have nothing.

Michael why your people poop in da sand?



I kid, I kid.

Being criticized for setting an ambitious goal and falling short is better than not being criticized because you didn't set a goal.  I gather that they're expected to be less than 1 square foot of MOOP per acre, and BLM found a couple of locations which exceeded that, in one place as high as 7 square feet per acre.  7 square feet of trash per acre at the worst point is hardly an ecological disaster.   Looking out the window on the way from Phoenix to Tucson, in some places I saw about 7 square feet of trash per 7 square feet.  A lot of people apparently like hucking stuff out the windows of their cars as they drive.

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Burners call litter of all types MOOP, an acronym for "matter out of place."



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Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #36 on: January 26, 2019, 05:13:20 am »
Nonsense.  That’s Burning Man apologetics! 

No it's actually logic.  I am 100% confident that our festival leaves a small fraction of the debris of non LNT festivals.

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We have government reports of excessive garbage and people shitting where they shouldn’t. 

And you want to know how many litres of ****, or it never happened?   ::)

You can't use words like 'excessive' without a baseline.  It's a relative measure.  I can accept it if you accept that 'excessive' actually means a single pop can left behind by 80K people, which is closer to the truth than anything you have said.

Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #37 on: January 26, 2019, 05:16:22 am »
Michael why your people poop in da sand?



I kid, I kid.

Ok, but it's actually pissing me off though. :(

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Being criticized for setting an ambitious goal and falling short is better than not being criticized because you didn't set a goal.

Or being criticized because it just bothers you.  I had a close friend who used to needle me about aspects of my Catholic upbringing.  It's something teenagers do - to say something because it specifically bothers you.  Adults learn that you lose friends that way.

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   I gather that they're expected to be less than 1 square foot of MOOP per acre, and BLM found a couple of locations which exceeded that, in one place as high as 7 square feet per acre.  7 square feet of trash per acre at the worst point is hardly an ecological disaster.   

Well, that sounds specific.  If we had one square foot of MOOP on our site it would be shameful.  I have spent hours on my knees in the hot sun after everyone is gone, so forgive me if I take my efforts in keeping the land beautiful a little seriously.

 

Offline kimmy

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #38 on: January 26, 2019, 01:36:56 pm »
Artist's impression of typical Burning Man attendees leaving garbage all over the desert:




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Offline kimmy

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2019, 08:23:56 pm »
Are the super-rich ruining Burning Man?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47203978

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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #40 on: February 18, 2019, 08:50:42 pm »
Only the organizers should be making money off this event, according to the organizers!   Several people employed year-round by Burning Man are pulling in 6 figure salaries. 

Offline Michael Hardner

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2019, 08:56:41 pm »
Uh.  They live in San Francisco.  6 figures isn't that much.

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2019, 09:00:49 pm »
Uh.  They live in San Francisco.  6 figures isn't that much.

Ok

Then they should be fine with others making money from the festival.

And why shouldn’t rich people be allowed to do what they want?   I thought the festival was all about freedom, man... 
« Last Edit: February 18, 2019, 09:07:50 pm by the_squid »

Offline kimmy

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2019, 09:22:17 pm »
I thought the festival was all about freedom, man...

Well, actually the festival's core principles are listed in the article:

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Burning Man's 10 principles
  •     Radical inclusion
  •     Gifting
  •     Decommodification
  •     Radical self-reliance
  •     Radical self-expression
  •     Communal effort
  •     Civic responsibility
  •     Leaving no trace
  •     Participation
  •     Immediacy

The idea of a "plug-and-play" luxury experience for people who can drop 6 figures on it seems to fly in the face of several of those principles... self reliance, decommodification, communal effort, participation, and immediacy.

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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: Burning Man Culture
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2019, 11:03:35 pm »
Where is  pooping all over the desert in that list??