Author Topic: Government Day-to-Day  (Read 13175 times)

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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #210 on: February 12, 2020, 05:34:55 pm »
I wanted to call him Stinky Pete Von Buttfu*ker but I restrained myself!
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Offline JMT

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #211 on: February 12, 2020, 05:37:47 pm »
Never underestimate a Liberal government's (federal or provincial) willingness to buy off votes with other people's money.  Gerald Butts worked as Dalton McGuinty's principal advisor.  Straight outta the playbook.  Enough said.

Liberals are in fact not the primary drivers of Canada's current debt.

Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #212 on: February 12, 2020, 06:28:38 pm »
Liberals are in fact not the primary drivers of Canada's current debt.

The party in power is the only driver of federal debt, it makes the budget.
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Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #213 on: February 12, 2020, 06:50:15 pm »
Liberals are in fact not the primary drivers of Canada's current debt.

Technically true.  Good job Mulroney!  That guy was a dolt.  We he tried to tax for the goodies (GST) the voters threw him out.
I can tell how good of a person you are by how you treat the people you disagree with.
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Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #214 on: February 12, 2020, 07:30:25 pm »
Technically true.  Good job Mulroney!  That guy was a dolt.  We he tried to tax for the goodies (GST) the voters threw him out.

If it is all Mulroney's fault, I guess no government ever needs to balance a budget again.
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Offline Omni

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #215 on: February 12, 2020, 08:06:06 pm »
If it is all Mulroney's fault, I guess no government ever needs to balance a budget again.

Not all Mulroney's fault. Harper did even "better". I guess the term "fiscal conservative" has a different meaning when applied by... conservatives.

Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #216 on: February 12, 2020, 09:52:49 pm »
Not all Mulroney's fault. Harper did even "better". I guess the term "fiscal conservative" has a different meaning when applied by... conservatives.

Harper had the 2009 economic meltdown and the Afghan war to deal with, By the time he left office the budget was balanced again. The deficit declined every year after 2010 and in 2012 was the  same as the 2020 forecast deficit. Trudeau has had neither and has added more to the debt in his first four years than Harper did in his last four.  If you can fault Harper for anything it was lowering the GST but even that is 20/20 hindsight because it was done before 2008.
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Offline waldo

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #217 on: February 12, 2020, 10:19:41 pm »
caution: Conservative canard ahead!

Harper had the 2009 economic meltdown

not only did Canada enter the recession later than other G7 nations... its impact was milder and shorter than in other G7 countries, lasting but 7 months: Canada entered later; impact was mildest and shortest within G7 nations.

Offline Gorgeous Graham

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #218 on: February 12, 2020, 10:58:34 pm »
not only did Canada enter the recession later than other G7 nations... its impact was milder and shorter than in other G7 countries, lasting but 7 months: Canada entered later; impact was mildest and shortest within G7 nations.

True, but what's your point?

A Liberal can say well he had it a bit easier.  A Conservative can say well it was easier because of the CPC did the right things.  Wilbur could sit here and tell you that Harper was the greatest fiscal leader of the OECD/G7 because under his belt Canada weathered the storm better than virtually any other OECD/G7 country.  And if a Liberal gov were governing in 2008 you'd make the exact same argument.  But both you and waldo wouldn't really be right.

I think Chretien/Martin managed well fiscally and I think Harper did too.  Neither perfect by any means, or either always ethical, but did well.  Nobody can say i'm partisan for saying that.  They follow the basic Keynesian theory that you stimulate an economy during a recession and pay that debt back during the good times.  Rinse and repeat.
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Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #219 on: February 12, 2020, 11:36:58 pm »
caution: Conservative canard ahead!

not only did Canada enter the recession later than other G7 nations... its impact was milder and shorter than in other G7 countries, lasting but 7 months: Canada entered later; impact was mildest and shortest within G7 nations.

No doubt you would be giving a PM all the credit for that if they were a Liberal. Trudeau has had no recessions and no wars, just an economy that he claims is doing really well. So why do the deficits keep getting bigger every year?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 11:41:23 pm by wilber »
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Offline waldo

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #220 on: February 13, 2020, 12:52:59 am »
True, but what's your point?

that the ever-go-to of Harper having to deal with "theGreatDepression" is a Conservative/CPC canard... Canada entered later, the impact was milder and the duration shorter (just 7 months) than that of any other G7 nation.

Wilbur could sit here and tell you that Harper was the greatest fiscal leader of the OECD/G7

waldo linkee dump:

=> 6 charts show Stephen Harper has the worst economic record of any Prime Minister since World War II

=> Harper’s economic record the worst in Canada’s postwar history

=> Harper, Serial Abuser of Power: The Evidence Compiled

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #221 on: February 13, 2020, 10:24:48 am »
If you can fault Harper for anything it was lowering the GST but even that is 20/20 hindsight because it was done before 2008.

How about his tens of billions of dollar gift to [foreign] corporations with lowering corporate taxes so they could export their wealth out of Canada.

Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #222 on: February 13, 2020, 11:32:56 am »
But, but Harper.

Trudeau campaigned on a couple of modest 10 billion deficits returning to a balanced budget. The closest he has come is a 14.6 billion deficit last year.

Since elected he has added 50.8 billion to the debt. The government's own fall update is forecasting adding another 95.2 billion to the debt by the 2022/23 fiscal year with an additional 28 billion in borrowing for the two years after that. That will be an addition of 146 billion to the national debt by the end of the 2022/23 fiscal year and 174 billion forecast total by 2025. Nearly a 25% increase in the debt by 2023. He is on track to add more to the federal debt than any PM who has not had a major recession or war during their tenure.

Those are actual government figures, not from op eds

I hope waldo is a geezer like me because he will be paying interest on that for the rest of his life and so will his children and grand children.

I will state it again. If our federal debt doesn't change at all and interest rates remained the same, by the time they are 85 a child born today will see over 2.2 trillion dollars in interest spent on money borrowed before they were born.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 11:40:29 am by wilber »
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Offline the_squid

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #223 on: February 13, 2020, 12:08:35 pm »
2% GST = $14 Billion to federal revenues. 

Thanks Harper.

Add 3% and the deficit is gone. 

Trudeau won’t do this though as it is more politically expedient not to raise taxes. 

But suddenly all the “fiscal conservatives” would cheer a balanced budget?   Heck no...   I bet they’d be on this forum ranting and raving about the tax burden, rather than their current deficit rants. 
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Online wilber

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Re: Government Day-to-Day
« Reply #224 on: February 13, 2020, 12:21:20 pm »
2% GST = $14 Billion to federal revenues. 

Thanks Harper.

Add 3% and the deficit is gone. 

Trudeau won’t do this though as it is more politically expedient not to raise taxes. 

But suddenly all the “fiscal conservatives” would cheer a balanced budget?   Heck no...   I bet they’d be on this forum ranting and raving about the tax burden, rather than their current deficit rants.

Revenues were up by 21 billion last year and the government still borrowed 14.6 billion. They spent 36 billion more than the year before.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC