Author Topic: Canada's Economy Has its Strongest Growth in 17 Years  (Read 2252 times)

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Offline SirJohn

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I think that government plays a part.  I think that most of it is external.  I still think it's great that the Trudeau Liberals, who were going to destroy Canada's economy, have arguably made enough of an impact to have the highest growth rate this millennium.

It takes time to destroy an economy. Just look at the Ontario Liberals, or what the BC NDP are doing. It doesn't happen overnight, and the reason the economy has momentum is because it fell so rapidly when oil plunged and is recovering. If you can point to what Liberal policies have improved the economy, well, be my guest.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline waldo

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Just look at the Ontario Liberals... If you can point to what Liberal policies have improved the economy, well, be my guest.

Alex, what are low Ontario Corporate Income Tax rates? --- http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/tax/cit/index.html
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Conference Board of Canada: Ontario’s Economy Will Continue to Do Well in 2017 --- http://www.conferenceboard.ca/press/newsrelease/16-12-08/ontario_s_economy_will_continue_to_do_well_in_2017.aspx

CBCNews: Ontario regaining status as economic engine for Canada --- http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-economy-provincial-economic-growth-forecast-1.4131428

Ontario Government News Release: Ontario's Economic Growth Continues to Lead G7 Countries --- https://news.ontario.ca/opo/en/2017/07/ontarios-economic-growth-continues-to-lead-g7-countries.html

Offline JMT

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It takes time to destroy an economy. Just look at the Ontario Liberals, or what the BC NDP are doing. It doesn't happen overnight, and the reason the economy has momentum is because it fell so rapidly when oil plunged and is recovering. If you can point to what Liberal policies have improved the economy, well, be my guest.

For starters, the decrease in the middle tax rate, the increased child benefit, increased GIS, and increased infrastructure spending.  I'm sure we could find more if we looked.

Offline SirJohn

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Alex, what are low Ontario Corporate Income Tax rates? --- http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/tax/cit/index.html

Waldo, don't even try. You clearly know nothing about Ontario.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline SirJohn

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For starters, the decrease in the middle tax rate, the increased child benefit, increased GIS, and increased infrastructure spending.  I'm sure we could find more if we looked.

And who's going to pay the bills for all that? How long do you think we should keep borrowing to pension benefits? I realize Trudeau plans to do it indefinitely, but even though Liberals can't look beyond the next election, sooner or later there's going to come a Greek style reckoning.

I don't know if the likes of Greenspan are correct about the bond bubble and how interest rates are going to shoot up, but if they do as he says and we get stagflation again as we did in the eighties, but with this high level of debt, it will be crushing. The federal government alone spends $30 billion a year servicing the interest on our existing debt.

"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline waldo

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Waldo, don't even try. You clearly know nothing about Ontario.

weak Argus, even for your standards! Sorry to burst your bubble while showcasing the relative strength of the current Ontario economy. Get back to me if you decide to rise beyond your talking-point prattle.

Offline JMT

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And who's going to pay the bills for all that? How long do you think we should keep borrowing to pension benefits?

Given the deficits that are smaller than originally predicted, I don't find myself worried.  The Canadian economy is literally booming.

Offline cybercoma

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I think that government plays a part.  I think that most of it is external.  I still think it's great that the Trudeau Liberals, who were going to destroy Canada's economy, have arguably made enough of an impact to have the highest growth rate this millennium.
If nothing else, it's literally the exact opposite of the fearmongering during and after the election.

"TRUDOPE IS GOING TO TAX US SO MUCH THE ECONOMY IS GOING TO BE DESTROYED!"

It's safe to say that forecasting was entirely wrong.

Offline JMT

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I still see it every day on Twitter and Facebook.  There is incessant fear mongering by the likes of Jason Kenney about money leaving Alberta and Canada - about foreign investment and growth drying up.  It's almost as if they don't realize that there are other sources of information that prove them to be very very wrong.

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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I think that government plays a part.  I think that most of it is external.  I still think it's great that the Trudeau Liberals, who were going to destroy Canada's economy, have arguably made enough of an impact to have the highest growth rate this millennium.

There's nothing specific here.  This is all guess-work.  What specific policies by the Trudeau gov have impacted specific sectors in Canada that have driven this big uptick in growth over the year before?  What about the provincial governments?

Correlation doesn't equal causation.

Crude oil price went from $110/bbl in mid-2014 down to a low of almost $30 at the beginning of 2016, and is now back up to around $52, which is a 70% increase.  That has to be a big factor.  But I haven't analyzed anything beyond that so I honestly don't know much about the growth.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

Offline JMT

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I've already pointed to some policies.  I think the CCB had a far bigger impact than it's total dollar amount, as did the GIS changes.  They both put money into the hands of people that tend to spend all of their money.  If you combine that with huge infrastructure spending and the drive to attract IT talent, you get a small influence in a much larger picture.

Offline SirJohn

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I've already pointed to some policies.  I think the CCB had a far bigger impact than it's total dollar amount, as did the GIS changes.  They both put money into the hands of people that tend to spend all of their money.  If you combine that with huge infrastructure spending and the drive to attract IT talent, you get a small influence in a much larger picture.

Huge infrastructure spending? You mean like Trump is doing? There is no huge infrastructure spending. All the Liberals have done is label literally ANYTHING they want to spend money on as 'social infrastructure'. Where are the roads, highways, bridges, port upgrades? Do you people even understand the difference between putting money into social welfare programs which are a continuing drain on the budget, and putting money into improving highways, which improve transportation and thus encourage more economic activity?

The CCB has not put much more money into peoples pockets than the previous Conservative child tax programs. But you carry on about how you believe your hero has boldly sent the economy into overdrive in just about a year and a half. According to studies of the actual economic incentive program the Tories launched it was two years before it did anything and that was with $64 billion of spending.

Which means the impact of Trudeau's higher taxes and exploding red tape and bureaucracy hasn't really begun to be felt yet. Especially since it's been offset by low oil/gas prices. But those are going to rise over the next year, and so are interest rates.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline JMT

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Huge infrastructure spending? You mean like Trump is doing? There is no huge infrastructure spending. All the Liberals have done is label literally ANYTHING they want to spend money on as 'social infrastructure'. Where are the roads, highways, bridges, port upgrades? Do you people even understand the difference between putting money into social welfare programs which are a continuing drain on the budget, and putting money into improving highways, which improve transportation and thus encourage more economic activity?

You can pretend that hospitals, parks, and prisons are not infrastructure.  It doesn't make it true.

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The CCB has not put much more money into peoples pockets than the previous Conservative child tax programs.

A low income person with 1 child gets $200 more per month than they used to.  That's huge. 

Offline Queefer Sutherland

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I've already pointed to some policies.  I think the CCB had a far bigger impact than it's total dollar amount, as did the GIS changes.  They both put money into the hands of people that tend to spend all of their money.  If you combine that with huge infrastructure spending and the drive to attract IT talent, you get a small influence in a much larger picture.

They didn't ie: raise taxes on rich people who save money to give to poor people who spend it, they ran a big deficit by borrowing money we're now paying interest on & will likely for a long time that future generations will have to pay off so current generations can have their goodies the country can't afford. Any government that does that is going to boost the economy in the short-term, but is this good policy for Canada in the longterm?  30 billion borrowed with interest payments likely for many decades.  Is it a net gain or net loss long-term?
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Offline SirJohn

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You can pretend that hospitals, parks, and prisons are not infrastructure.  It doesn't make it true.

The reason why spending on infrastructure (roads, bridges, ports, airports) is good for the economy is because they help make the distances that have to be travelled by people and goods smaller, faster and more efficient. Prisons, parks and hospitals don't do that.

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A low income person with 1 child gets $200 more per month than they used to.  That's huge.

Not when we have to borrow to pay it.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum