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Offline SirJohn

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #75 on: November 11, 2018, 01:03:09 pm »
Quote from: John Mark Taylor on November 11, 2018, 10:25:04 am
And yet those 'difficult' states are the ones that contribute much more in the way of federal taxation per capita.  California is one of the largest economies on the planet.  It seems like it's doing okay.

On some metrics it is. On others, not so much. As a livable state it leaves much to be desired if you're a professional of some sort. You can get a similar paying job in Texas with much lower taxes and a much lower cost of living. For business, if your business interests are wide, and you deal/ship/service all over the US you will have lower costs and lower income taxes in Texas along with less of a regulatory burden.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #76 on: November 11, 2018, 01:39:46 pm »
Quote from: TimG on November 11, 2018, 12:01:06 pm
You have to read his blog to understand the insanity of the California regulatory environment (the cost of insurance is much higher for businesses in California because of the risks imposed by the regulatory environment). In his case he does not do business there because he has a choice. Lots of people have no choice.

But the point is not whether he is right about the state of California but how the democrats push people are sympathetic to many of their issues to vote GOP because the democrats are so deadly when it comes to regulations. Trump is cutting internal regulations while he engages in trade wars. The cuts to regulations offset the harm done by the trade wars for many businesses.

The thing is, his competition has to operate by the same rules in those states. Not doing business there is his problem. Trump is basically making the EPA toothless and dismantling the financial safeguards intended to prevent a repetition of 2008. This won't end well.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #77 on: November 11, 2018, 01:50:58 pm »
Quote from: SirJohn on November 11, 2018, 01:03:09 pm
On some metrics it is. On others, not so much. As a livable state it leaves much to be desired if you're a professional of some sort. You can get a similar paying job in Texas with much lower taxes and a much lower cost of living. For business, if your business interests are wide, and you deal/ship/service all over the US you will have lower costs and lower income taxes in Texas along with less of a regulatory burden.

Washington is a Democrat state. Amazon, Costco, Starbucks, Boeing, Microsoft, Nordstrom etc.

San Jose California is the worlds tech headquarters.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #78 on: November 11, 2018, 01:58:01 pm »
Quote from: wilber on November 11, 2018, 01:50:58 pm
Washington is a Democrat state. Amazon, Costco, Starbucks, Boeing, Microsoft, Nordstrom etc.

San Jose California is the worlds tech headquarters.

Nine of the top ten states by per capita income are blue, as are eight of the top ten in per capita GDP.

Texas is #21 in income and #12 in GDP.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2018, 02:02:38 pm by wilber »
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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #79 on: November 11, 2018, 01:58:51 pm »
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Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #80 on: November 11, 2018, 01:59:45 pm »
Quote from: wilber on November 11, 2018, 01:58:01 pm
Nine of the top ten states by per capita income are blue, as are eight of the top ten in per capita GDP.

It’s a right-wing fantasy that no regulation = economic powerhouse.   It’s simply untrue.  But SJ and TimG are repeating that easily countered narrative.
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Offline SirJohn

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #81 on: November 11, 2018, 02:16:15 pm »
Quote from: the_squid on November 11, 2018, 01:59:45 pm
It’s a right-wing fantasy that no regulation = economic powerhouse.   It’s simply untrue.  But SJ and TimG are repeating that easily countered narrative.

As is your wont, you completely abandon all nuance and pretend others have done the same.
It is not a lack of regulation which helps the economy, but only such regulation as is required. Singapore has regulations, but is an economic powerhouse in part because it kept government small, efficient and honest. California's government has grown far, far faster than its population. And taxes have grown to match. Higher taxes damage the profitability of business, as do too many regulations.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #82 on: November 11, 2018, 02:16:41 pm »
Quote from: the_squid on November 11, 2018, 01:58:51 pm


That differs a bit from Wikipedia's 2018 numbers which still show 7 of the top ten being blue.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_GDP_per_capita
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Offline SirJohn

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #83 on: November 11, 2018, 02:17:49 pm »
Quote from: wilber on November 11, 2018, 01:58:01 pm
Nine of the top ten states by per capita income are blue, as are eight of the top ten in per capita GDP.

Texas is #21 in income and #12 in GDP.

I'm not sure how great a measure of success this is. I mean, the per capita production in California is greater than Texas, but what does that do for me, a worker in California? Even if it means I make more money, well, the government has much higher taxes, and houses cost twice as much, so...
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Offline SirJohn

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #84 on: November 11, 2018, 02:25:53 pm »
Quote from: John Mark Taylor on November 10, 2018, 10:55:50 pm
To put that in context, that is the largest gain by Democrats in the House since the election immediately following Watergate.  It's also worth noting that the votes are not dune being counted, and the Dems are now ahead or elected in 35, with the possibility for it to go up because of where the count is still outstanding.  I thought like you earlier in the week, but now it appears that it in fact was the massive gain they needed.  Remember that the House is Republican even if the Dems get ~54% of the popular vote.

People should wonder about what would happen if the Republicans dumped Trump and Pence and put in a reasonable man, like say Bush instead. I mean, if the Democrats are underwhelming against a **** like Trump, what would happen to them if the Republicans suddenly put up a reasonable moderate in his place?
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Offline TimG

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #85 on: November 11, 2018, 02:35:17 pm »
Quote from: wilber on November 11, 2018, 01:50:58 pm
Washington is a Democrat state. Amazon, Costco, Starbucks, Boeing, Microsoft, Nordstrom etc.
The economy is built with small businesses. Big rich companies can shrug off a lot of regulation because they can afford the armies of compliance staff. In fact, big companies often benefit from excessive regulation because it keeps the upstart competition out.

You can see how the big players obscure the regulation disease that is killing the blue states:
https://lao.ca.gov/LAOEconTax/Article/Detail/265

Why is Texas attracting so many California residents if things are so great?
« Last Edit: November 11, 2018, 02:39:36 pm by TimG »
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #86 on: November 11, 2018, 02:41:33 pm »
Quote from: TimG on November 11, 2018, 02:35:17 pm
The economy is built with small businesses.

Repeat a statement a bizillion times, and people think it is true: empirical data be damned.

Regardless, it is lawyers that suck the lifeblood out of the economy. This happens in many instances, but intellectual property legislation is the biggest.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #87 on: November 11, 2018, 02:42:46 pm »
Quote from: SirJohn on November 11, 2018, 02:17:49 pm
I'm not sure how great a measure of success this is. I mean, the per capita production in California is greater than Texas, but what does that do for me, a worker in California? Even if it means I make more money, well, the government has much higher taxes, and houses cost twice as much, so...

Ya, that's what happens in places where incomes are higher, property prices go up. Go figure.
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Offline TimG

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #88 on: November 11, 2018, 02:45:43 pm »
Quote from: ?Impact on November 11, 2018, 02:41:33 pm
Regardless, it is lawyers that suck the lifeblood out of the economy.
Bingo. In California they outsource regulation enforcement to trial lawyers which means lawyers go out of their way to find companies that violate the largely useless regulations and sue them. It does not make a difference if the basis for the suit is logical - only that a company failed to comply. They reliance on lawyers to enforce regulations is one of the reasons California is a miserable place to do business.
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Offline TimG

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #89 on: November 11, 2018, 02:47:26 pm »
Quote from: wilber on November 11, 2018, 02:42:46 pm
Ya, that's what happens in places where incomes are higher, property prices go up. Go figure.
Except in California property prices are inflated by restrictive land use regulations. This creates a situation where the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
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