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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #45 on: November 07, 2018, 04:54:32 pm »
Quote from: Poonlight Graham on November 07, 2018, 04:51:38 pm
The US Framers did that specifically on purpose so larger states wouldn't dominate & run tyrannical-like in the senate and leave little voice or power for smaller states like in the House.  It's all checks and balances.

And it's broken.  California has 40M people.  That changes things.
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #46 on: November 07, 2018, 04:56:39 pm »
Didn't know that.  Maybe gerrymandering?  Dunno.
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Offline Omni

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #47 on: November 07, 2018, 04:57:31 pm »
Quote from: John Mark Taylor on November 07, 2018, 04:53:56 pm
The democrats have to have something like +5% in the popular vote to win the HoR in any election.  That's insane.

Republican gerrymandering has been very effective.
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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #48 on: November 07, 2018, 04:58:58 pm »
Quote from: Poonlight Graham on November 07, 2018, 04:56:39 pm
Didn't know that.  Maybe gerrymandering?  Dunno.

That and the underrepresented larger, mostly Democratic states.



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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #49 on: November 07, 2018, 05:02:55 pm »
Obama enjoyed Democratic control of the Senate and House during his first two years of office. But the Democratic party’s 40-year-reign in the House of Representatives came to a swift end in the 2010 mid-term elections. In 2012, Democratic candidates for the House received around 51 percent of the votes cast, yet still fell 15 seats short of reclaiming the majority.

https://psmag.com/news/the-future-of-redistricting-in-america
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #50 on: November 07, 2018, 05:20:36 pm »
What should be worrying is similar to what SJ was posting that article about, the Dems are going more and more left, there seems fewer and fewer centrist Dem candidates.  The problem with the 2 parties before is that they shared many of the same policies, party because they were paid off by corporate interests.  Now they're not even in the same area code.  Huge polarization.

Imagine a Bernie Sanders (or discipline) vs Trump.  2 polar opposite visions, when really most of the country probably wants something in between.  To the left of Trump but to the right of Obama.
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Offline wilber

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #51 on: November 07, 2018, 05:21:09 pm »
On the upside, Michigan passed an anti gerrymandering proposal. In future, boundaries will be determined by a panel of 4 Democrat, 4 Republican and 5 unaligned members. Not quite our system but getting closer.
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #52 on: November 07, 2018, 05:23:16 pm »
Our system is dramatically worse.  A majority with ~40% of the popular vote.
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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #53 on: November 07, 2018, 05:34:32 pm »
Quote from: Poonlight Graham on November 07, 2018, 05:23:16 pm
Our system is dramatically worse.  A majority with ~40% of the popular vote.

You're confusing things - our system is far better (no gerrymandering, more balanced representation, less money in politics).  The difference here is that you're not dealing with a 2 party system.
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Offline SirJohn

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #54 on: November 07, 2018, 05:56:10 pm »
Quote from: John Mark Taylor on November 07, 2018, 04:53:10 pm
Which still leaves Wyoming unfairly over represented.

So are all our Atlantic provinces.
The US system was designed to give every single state two senators, and then for the House to more closely reflect the population. It was a good idea, but it got screwed in 1929 when the size of the House was permanently fixed. That, of course, can be changed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyoming_Rule
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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #55 on: November 07, 2018, 06:31:09 pm »
Quote from: SirJohn on November 07, 2018, 05:56:10 pm
So are all our Atlantic provinces.

Not even close to the same - but that could be fixed by eliminating the Senate floor (or, given the cluster in the US, the Senate).  In Canada, only one province is significantly over represented - PEI.
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #56 on: November 07, 2018, 07:47:55 pm »
Quote from: Poonlight Graham on November 07, 2018, 05:23:16 pm
Our system is dramatically worse.  A majority with ~40% of the popular vote.

I agree that 40% should not get 100% of the power, but the US is still worse when the President loses by 3 million and still gets 100% of the power of his office.
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Offline Queefer Sutherland

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #57 on: November 07, 2018, 08:00:49 pm »
Quote from: ?Impact on November 07, 2018, 07:47:55 pm
I agree that 40% should not get 100% of the power, but the US is still worse when the President loses by 3 million and still gets 100% of the power of his office.

Well 3 million votes out 117 million was a difference of 2%.  Arguably flawed yes, but I dunno if worse.  Also, the POTUS doesn't control the legislature, while ~40% = a majority in the Canadian legislature, ie: power to table & pass laws, & also determines the executive: head of government (PM) & cabinet.
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Offline JMT

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #58 on: November 07, 2018, 08:18:47 pm »
Quote from: Poonlight Graham on November 07, 2018, 08:00:49 pm
Well 3 million votes out 117 million was a difference of 2%.  Arguably flawed yes, but I dunno if worse.  Also, the POTUS doesn't control the legislature, while ~40% = a majority in the Canadian legislature, ie: power to table & pass laws, & also determines the executive: head of government (PM) & cabinet.

Again - two party system is the difference.  If we only had Liberals and Conservatives running, it would take a lot more than 40% to get a majority.
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Offline Omni

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Re: US Congress Thread...
« Reply #59 on: November 07, 2018, 08:29:12 pm »
I guess math can be confusing to some.
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