Author Topic: The Donald Trump Thread  (Read 150312 times)

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Offline wilber

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #840 on: September 28, 2017, 07:16:32 pm »
Call me skeptical, but I gotta think that NFL owners care more about the $millions of dollars they've lost than the political beliefs of a guy who grew up in a ghetto, was dragged through a college degree and now makes $millions of dollars because he can run or catch a football.  Maybe they care out keeping their No.1 QB, RB or WR happy, but the rest are pretty much replaceable.   

NFL owners haven’t “lost” anything. So having money disqualifies you from having ethics. Well it sure has in Trump’s case.
"Never trust a man without a single redeeming vice" WSC

Offline Hal 9000

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #841 on: September 28, 2017, 08:28:32 pm »
So, the first domino goes by the name of "Denver Broncos".  Not that Trump or the fans had anything to do with, it's just what the players thought was the right thing.



http://www.dailycamera.com/broncos-nfl/ci_31339327/denver-broncos-plan-stand-together-national-anthem?source=rss

As an edit, I just want to point this comment out to Omni and cyber:  Joseph said the "platform was not working" and the original intent and message behind the silent protests were lost amid the mass demonstrations through the NFL.

"It was making this whole issue confusing to the fans, to the military, to the players, to the coaches. No one had clarity," he said. "So I think changing the platform in the future — I'm not sure what it is now — but changing it in the future will help us make positive change."
« Last Edit: September 28, 2017, 09:15:34 pm by Hal 9000 »

Offline SirJohn

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #842 on: September 28, 2017, 09:03:25 pm »
Still not a "criminal"

No more than Justine Damond, but **** happens when you've got scared cops with guns. At least one can say the cop feared for his life there, even if I don't think he should have shot so fast, but there's no excuse at all for her shooting.

You won't find many protests over it, though. She was the wrong colour to fit the leftist theme.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2017, 09:05:43 pm by SirJohn »
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Offline kimmy

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #843 on: September 28, 2017, 10:10:21 pm »
All this proves is that you can't look beyond your own nose.  You want everyone to care about what you care about, yet you look these people in the face and call them stupid, fools, uneducated rubes...deplorable.

The people who are stupid, fools, rubes, and deplorable are the ones who have allowed themselves to get riled up over a complete non-issue.  They're being played for suckers by a politician who specializes in playing suckers.


Patriotism may be a joke to you, I know it's phoney and a joke to lefties who take freedom and the western way of life for granted, but for many people it's deadly serious. 

I don't think patriotism is phony, but the NFL's on-field displays sure are. As already discussed, the Department of Defense and branches of the US Armed Forces have paid the NFL millions of dollars to put on patriotic displays and showcase members of the military in ceremonies at games.  To boost recruitment.   How is that not phony?


 "We're honoring our military today, because our military paid us to."  YAAAAY! Doesn't that make you feel all patriotic inside?


Many of the causes that the left want to promote get lost when you/they start burning, stomping on, spitting on...or otherwise disrespecting the flag. 

Oh. Ok. Which football players are burning, stomping on, or spitting on the flag? Because those guys are definitely jerks!  Have you got pictures of this happening?

On the other hand, if you're going to tell me that kneeling during the anthem is the same as burning, stomping on, or spitting on the flag, then no. You're wrong. That's silly.

I read a news article last week about a young kid in school who got roughed up by his teacher by not standing and saluting during the Pledge of Allegiance.  So what was the kid's problem. Was he a Muslim? A commie? Some kind of America-hating leftist?  As it turns out the kid was a fundamentalist Christian, whose religious beliefs dictate that he can't pledge allegiance to the flag because his religious beliefs only allow him to pledge allegiance to God.

Declining to participate in a ceremony honoring the flag is not the same as destroying or defacing the flag.   

Consider: every year at our office Christmas party, my boss leads a prayer and saying grace before dinner. And I don't pray along because I'm not religious, so I bow my head and sit quietly.

Now, if my boss were to react like Donald Trump has reacted to this anthem topic, he'd say something like "GOD DAMN YOU WHY ARE YOU DISRESPECTING JESUS WHY DO YOU HATE JESUS GOD DAMN YOU ARE GOD DAMNED FIRED!!!"

But because my boss is a normal person, he's capable of accepting that I don't share his beliefs and accepts that I sit quietly during the prayer without taking it as an offense to either himself or his religion. Because that's how normal people react in situations like that.

If you refuse to understand why veterans and families of veterans are patriotic, how can you expect them to see your point of view?  If you/they want to a serious discussion, showing contempt for the flag is not really a good starting point.   

I understand that veterans and non-veterans and all kinds of other people are patriotic. I don't have any issue with it.

The issue here isn't that people are intolerant of patriotism. The issue here is that some self-styled patriots are intolerant of those who don't share their patriotism.

 -k
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Offline Hal 9000

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #844 on: September 28, 2017, 10:46:31 pm »
The people who are stupid, fools, rubes, and deplorable are the ones who have allowed themselves to get riled up over a complete non-issue.  They're being played for suckers by a politician who specializes in playing suckers.


I don't think patriotism is phony, but the NFL's on-field displays sure are. As already discussed, the Department of Defense and branches of the US Armed Forces have paid the NFL millions of dollars to put on patriotic displays and showcase members of the military in ceremonies at games.  To boost recruitment.   How is that not phony?


 "We're honoring our military today, because our military paid us to."  YAAAAY! Doesn't that make you feel all patriotic inside?


Oh. Ok. Which football players are burning, stomping on, or spitting on the flag? Because those guys are definitely jerks!  Have you got pictures of this happening?

On the other hand, if you're going to tell me that kneeling during the anthem is the same as burning, stomping on, or spitting on the flag, then no. You're wrong. That's silly.

I read a news article last week about a young kid in school who got roughed up by his teacher by not standing and saluting during the Pledge of Allegiance.  So what was the kid's problem. Was he a Muslim? A commie? Some kind of America-hating leftist?  As it turns out the kid was a fundamentalist Christian, whose religious beliefs dictate that he can't pledge allegiance to the flag because his religious beliefs only allow him to pledge allegiance to God.

Declining to participate in a ceremony honoring the flag is not the same as destroying or defacing the flag.   

Consider: every year at our office Christmas party, my boss leads a prayer and saying grace before dinner. And I don't pray along because I'm not religious, so I bow my head and sit quietly.

Now, if my boss were to react like Donald Trump has reacted to this anthem topic, he'd say something like "GOD DAMN YOU WHY ARE YOU DISRESPECTING JESUS WHY DO YOU HATE JESUS GOD DAMN YOU ARE GOD DAMNED FIRED!!!"

But because my boss is a normal person, he's capable of accepting that I don't share his beliefs and accepts that I sit quietly during the prayer without taking it as an offense to either himself or his religion. Because that's how normal people react in situations like that.

I understand that veterans and non-veterans and all kinds of other people are patriotic. I don't have any issue with it.

The issue here isn't that people are intolerant of patriotism. The issue here is that some self-styled patriots are intolerant of those who don't share their patriotism.

 -k


What you have to understand is that we as Canadians usually couldn't give a **** about our flag or anything remotely close to patriotism, that's Canada, and most of hate pride.  However, I can understand that many, in fact most Americans do see any and all desecration of their flag/anthem ...whatever to be a strict nono.  So yes, for many Americans, kneeling before the anthem is equal to spitting on or burning the flag - you may not agree, but the majority of Americans do agree. 

Offline kimmy

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #845 on: September 28, 2017, 11:03:50 pm »
I honestly think that's a load of crap.

If Colin Kaepernick had told the media that he was kneeling during the anthem to pray to Jesus, people would not be offended, and many of them would be calling it a great thing. He'd have been the new Tim Tebow.

It's not the act of kneeling that people are mad at, it's his reason for kneeling.  People are mad at the message, not at how he delivered it.

 -k
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Offline Hal 9000

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #846 on: September 28, 2017, 11:20:49 pm »
I honestly think that's a load of crap.

If Colin Kaepernick had told the media that he was kneeling during the anthem to pray to Jesus, people would not be offended, and many of them would be calling it a great thing. He'd have been the new Tim Tebow.

It's not the act of kneeling that people are mad at, it's his reason for kneeling.  People are mad at the message, not at how he delivered it.

 -k

Wrong again!  There is a college coach who was fired for kneeling in prayer and as far as Tebow, he was made the laughing stock of the NFL (some say blacklisted) for "tebowing".  Atheletes have protested many times in many ways, just look at the NBA.  This protest was lost in the "perceived" disrespect of the flag - plain and simple.

Green Bay and Chicago stood for the anthem tonight

Offline kimmy

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #847 on: September 28, 2017, 11:40:11 pm »
Wrong again!  There is a college coach who was fired for kneeling in prayer and as far as Tebow, he was made the laughing stock of the NFL (some say blacklisted) for "tebowing". 
Tebow got "blacklisted" because he isn't very good. He was only a laughing-stock because the amount of hype put upon him was so out of proportion to his actual accomplishments... sort of a religious answer to Anna Kournikova.  Christian demogogues would have you believe he was run out of the league because the liberal media hates Christian, but lots of Christian players pray on the field during games.  Tebow isn't half the player that Kaepernick is, and Kaepernick isn't in the NFL anymore either.

Atheletes have protested many times in many ways, just look at the NBA.  This protest was lost in the "perceived" disrespect of the flag - plain and simple.

Ultimately the right to not salute the flag during the anthem is right at the top of the list of freedoms that real actual patriots fought and died for. 

Green Bay and Chicago stood for the anthem tonight

Good for them.

 -k
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Offline Hal 9000

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #848 on: September 29, 2017, 12:29:37 am »
Tebow got "blacklisted" because he isn't very good. He was only a laughing-stock because the amount of hype put upon him was so out of proportion to his actual accomplishments... sort of a religious answer to Anna Kournikova.  Christian demogogues would have you believe he was run out of the league because the liberal media hates Christian, but lots of Christian players pray on the field during games.  Tebow isn't half the player that Kaepernick is, and Kaepernick isn't in the NFL anymore either.

Ultimately the right to not salute the flag during the anthem is right at the top of the list of freedoms that real actual patriots fought and died for. 

Good for them.

 -k

Well, as I said, you're not able to look any further than your own nose. 

Until you realize that the delivery or venue is just as important as the issue itself, you people will remain ignorant to the way society works.  This was a simple case of "wrong place, wrong time".  And, that is why it failed.

Offline Omni

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #849 on: September 29, 2017, 01:13:46 am »
Well, as I said, you're not able to look any further than your own nose. 

Until you realize that the delivery or venue is just as important as the issue itself, you people will remain ignorant to the way society works.  This was a simple case of "wrong place, wrong time".  And, that is why it failed.

It seems more like you would rather be led by the nose. Your narrow minded idea of patriotism seems to be simply putting your hand over your heart and singing along with everybody else, no matter what. Racism clearly exists in the US to this day, perhaps if you had walked a mile in a black mans shoes you might be a little more aware of that fact.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2017, 07:31:55 am by JMT »

Offline SirJohn

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #850 on: September 29, 2017, 11:22:00 am »
I hate it when prissy leftist progressives make me side with the Trumps but they keep doing it.

As part of a program to send books to school libararies the White House picked out one high-achieving school in each state and they got a little package of books, in this case Dr. Seuss books, chosen by Melania Trump because she loved reading them to her kids. The school ibrarian rejected the books as racist, and sent a letter, which she duly made public, telling Trump she should send them to poor schools harmed by her husband's racist policies.

I know Trump is being a sometimes deliberately divisive figure, but the Left in the US is eagerly doing its share to add to that environment.

http://nationalpost.com/news/world/school-librarian-rejects-melania-trumps-gift-of-racist-dr-seuss-books
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Offline JMT

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #851 on: September 29, 2017, 01:37:19 pm »
That's not siding with Trump - that's siding against idiots.

Offline Squidward von Squidderson

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #852 on: September 29, 2017, 02:20:05 pm »
The librarian is an idiot...  Not everything is "taking sides"....  unless of course, taking a partisan viewpoint is what you do with most of your decisions/opinions.... 
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Offline kimmy

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #853 on: September 30, 2017, 01:13:50 pm »
Well, as I said, you're not able to look any further than your own nose. 

Until you realize that the delivery or venue is just as important as the issue itself, you people will remain ignorant to the way society works.  This was a simple case of "wrong place, wrong time".  And, that is why it failed.

If people were really that offended about the flag, Kid Rock would have been shot by now for wearing the flag as a wife-beater t-shirt. Turning the flag into bikini-bottoms and Speedos is more insulting to the flag than refusing to salute during the anthem.

Some people are mad at the players who did this because they feel the players are attacking America itself.  The people who have booed the players for this are the same kind of people who shouted "Love it or leave it!" at people protesting the Vietnam war or the Iraq war. These are the shallow thinkers who believe that speaking out against a policy or a problem in America is the same as denouncing America itself.


You make it sound like these folks would be willing to talk about this issue if only those darned football players would stop insulting the flag. The truth is that those people aren't booing because they want to have that conversation in some other venue at some other time, they are booing because they don't want to have that conversation, period.   People have been trying to have this conversation for years, and the only time it ever actually comes to the fore is when somebody creates a controversy too big to ignore.  Riots in Ferguson? Ok, let's talk... just please stop destroying the city.  Riots in Baltimore? Ok, let's talk... just please stop destroying the city.  Athletes protesting at football games? Ok, let's talk... just please stop destroying -- wait, what were they destroying? Nevermind, just please stop doing that, and then we can talk. The truth is they don't want to talk, they just want to go back to ignoring the problem.  The supposed indignation over the flag is just an effort to rationalize opposition to these protests. "We can't say we oppose their right to express themselves, because that would be unAmerican. We can't say that race isn't an issue in America, because that would be stupid. We need an excuse to explain why we're so mad about this."

You think these protests have alienated people who might otherwise be willing to listen to the issue.

I think these protests have angered people who would otherwise completely ignore the issue.



 -k
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Offline BC_cheque

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #854 on: September 30, 2017, 01:24:13 pm »

The truth is they don't want to talk, they just want to go back to ignoring the problem. 


Very good post.

Re the quote above, I would say the issue is deeper than ignoring it, they outright deny it and blame black people for getting themselves killed.

I don't even participate in this debate anymore because it infuriates me so much when I read that it's ok to kill innocent black people because some other black people commit crimes.