Author Topic: The Donald Trump Thread  (Read 60312 times)

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guest78

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6315 on: October 20, 2020, 02:43:38 pm »
It seems it doesn't matter how often he makes an **** of himself there are those (such as you) who will continue to buy the BS. Let's see, today it was ridiculous criticism, in true trumpy boy fashion, of calling Dr. Faucci  an idiot and some other silly, unwarranted insult. Trump winning anything should worry any and all sane people.
Yeah I donít like his behaviour much either.  Most of the time itís childish and counter productive.  But Bidenís policies are terrible.  So unfortunately, itís not much of a choice.  Policy trumps personality.  Pun intended.
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Offline MH

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6316 on: October 20, 2020, 02:47:36 pm »
What about increasing the minimum wage ?  Surely a populists policy would there be one ever !

Offline Montgomery

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6317 on: October 20, 2020, 02:51:02 pm »
It is certainly true that in the one case where charges were most warranted (i.e. Nixon), that no criminal charges were laid. It is certainly possible that the same thing could happen with Stubby McBonespurs. (I could certainly see Biden using the same excuses used with Nixon... "we must heal the nation", etc.) This could either take the form of an actual pardon, or just a desire not to prosecute him

There are a few differences however:
- Nixon's pardon was granted by Ford (a fellow Republican). However, even though Biden is a moderate, he is still a Democrat (as would whomever he nominates to be his AG).
- The political system is much more polarized now than it was in the 70s. Nixon was forced out of office in part by Republicans who said "its time to go". In the current environment, the republican party is falling lock-step behind Trump, regardless of what he does. Its harder for the Democrats to justify extending an olive branch to the republicans in that situation.
- Nixon was a flawed president who engaged in criminal activity. But, he at least did SOME good that even the Democrats might have supported... started the EPA, opened relations with China. And at least he kept his racism a bit more discrete. Trump? Not so much. With his leading chants of "lock her up", calls for racists to "stand by", etc. its hard to have the same sort of sympathy for him.

You've made some good points! I'll still wager that Trump will only have to worry about civil suits and those will lack the positive sentiments of the people. It's America!
It was believed afterward that the man was a lunatic, because there was no sense in what he said. ~M.T.

Offline Montgomery

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6318 on: October 20, 2020, 02:54:45 pm »
What about increasing the minimum wage ?  Surely a populists policy would there be one ever !

No, it's not consistent with capitalist ideals. But too, disallowing unions with the power to negotiate and strike is not either. So the capitalist can't legitimately claim one without the other.
It was believed afterward that the man was a lunatic, because there was no sense in what he said. ~M.T.

Offline segnosaur

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6319 on: October 20, 2020, 02:56:21 pm »
Yeah I donít like his behaviour much either.  Most of the time itís childish and counter productive.  But Bidenís policies are terrible.  So unfortunately, itís not much of a choice.  Policy trumps personality.  Pun intended.
Policy? Like Trump's policy that saw a huge spike in the deficit in order to give tax breaks to millionaires? (And that was before Covid-19 started causing problems.)

Like Trump's big health care plan... no, wait a second, he didn't actually have one. Now of course millions of people in the U.S. lack health care. Oh well, too bad, so sad.

But at least we have Trump's economic record. Except we don't.... because job and employment growth actually slowed under Trump (compared to the way things were going under Obama).

But at least Trump managed to keep the coal miners employed. Except he didn't. Ooops, too bad, so sad.

Yup, I'm convinced... if you want a stagnating economy where people are dying because they can't get health care, Trump is the way to go! At least the white supremacists are happy. That's the most important thing, isn't it?
« Last Edit: October 20, 2020, 02:58:36 pm by segnosaur »
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Offline Montgomery

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6320 on: October 20, 2020, 03:05:48 pm »
Trump's answer, if he was smart enough to just say so, is that he believes in supplyside economics. Or just trickle down economics if it was still a popular term to use.
It was believed afterward that the man was a lunatic, because there was no sense in what he said. ~M.T.

guest78

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6321 on: October 20, 2020, 03:47:40 pm »
What about increasing the minimum wage ?  Surely a populists policy would there be one ever !
I'd be all in favour of indexing minimum wage to cost of living or something.  The problem is, that we need to get back to policies that make businesses compete for labour.  Biden wants big increases in immigration, to increase the pool of labour.  All that does is depress wages, for everyone.  Labour needs to be turned from a huge supply, to more of a demand.  You don't do that by flooding the market with low skilled labour.  It's counter productive.
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guest78

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6322 on: October 20, 2020, 03:52:07 pm »
Policy? Like Trump's policy that saw a huge spike in the deficit in order to give tax breaks to millionaires? (And that was before Covid-19 started causing problems.)

Like Trump's big health care plan... no, wait a second, he didn't actually have one. Now of course millions of people in the U.S. lack health care. Oh well, too bad, so sad.

But at least we have Trump's economic record. Except we don't.... because job and employment growth actually slowed under Trump (compared to the way things were going under Obama).

But at least Trump managed to keep the coal miners employed. Except he didn't. Ooops, too bad, so sad.

Yup, I'm convinced... if you want a stagnating economy where people are dying because they can't get health care, Trump is the way to go! At least the white supremacists are happy. That's the most important thing, isn't it?
No.  Big deficits came from increases in spending, particularly mandatory spending like Medicare and Social Security.  Under Trump the economy saw record unemployment, particularly for blacks and hispanics.  Also record wage increases.  4 years straight of decreases in the poverty rate too, and a shrinking of income inequality.  Under Obama, income inequality grew.  At least he's not actively trying to put them out of jobs, like Democrats.  Now Biden wants to do that to frackers.  Nah, you're convinced by lack of facts.  The economy was anything but stagnating.  The economy was booming.
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Offline Montgomery

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6323 on: October 20, 2020, 04:06:46 pm »
I'd be all in favour of indexing minimum wage to cost of living or something.  The problem is, that we need to get back to policies that make businesses compete for labour.  Biden wants big increases in immigration, to increase the pool of labour.  All that does is depress wages, for everyone.  Labour needs to be turned from a huge supply, to more of a demand.  You don't do that by flooding the market with low skilled labour.  It's counter productive.

You wannabe capitalists have nearly zero understanding of the priorities of true capitalism. You're supposed to be in favour of unions and against a minimum wage. Do you at least understand the reasons why?
It was believed afterward that the man was a lunatic, because there was no sense in what he said. ~M.T.

guest78

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6324 on: October 20, 2020, 05:03:08 pm »
But at least Trump managed to keep the coal miners employed. Except he didn't. Ooops, too bad, so sad.
You guys are absolutely clueless.  Too much echo chamber around here I suspect.

Mayors in the mining country, who once supported Democrats, say the party no longer advocates for the working class

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/oct/16/minnesota-democrat-switch-trump-election

Democrats used to be the party of the middle class.  Now theyíre the party of the wealthy and elites.
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Offline wilber

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6325 on: October 20, 2020, 05:34:19 pm »
It might have helped iron mining some but US coal production was up a bit in 2017 then declined each year since. 2019 was the worst year this century.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2020, 05:37:23 pm by wilber »
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Offline waldo

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6326 on: October 20, 2020, 06:32:27 pm »
Mayors in the mining country, who once supported Democrats, say the party no longer advocates for the working class

that letter was signed by 6 mayors... apparently there's a total of 20 mayors (20 towns) within the so-called Minnesota Iron Range area. What happened to the other 14 mayors, hey? Wait, what's this - a counter from the United Steelworkers Union (USW District 11):

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Recently, Vice President Mike Pence visited Duluth, Minnesota for a Trump campaign rally. Pence claimed that President Trump stood for American jobs, workers and miners and has made America great again.

On August 28th a group of six mayors from the Iron Range wrote an endorsement of Trumps reelection. Our union believes those mayors are misguided and donít fully understand the nature of the economics of the industry or the iron range. Just drive down the main streets of Virginia and Eveleth and count the shutdown businesses. It hardly seems like the ďroaring back to lifeĒ that these mayors describe.

Unfortunately, nothing could be further from the truth.

Our nation is in the deepest crisis since the Great Depression and 74,257 people in Minnesota have tested positive for COVID-19; 1,814 have died. President Trump refused to acknowledge the threat posed by the coronavirus, mobilize resources or show leadership in the face of the global pandemic.

As a result of the pandemic, almost half of the workers at the Iron Range's mines were laid off. USS Keetac is still idle and its 260 employees on layoff. Yet somehow, the president and Republican- controlled Senate donít care enough about Keetac workers or the other 16.3 million Americans who are unemployed to extend enhanced unemployment benefits through the end of the year.

The Trump administration did impose tariffs on imported steel. But for many workers, it was too little and too late. Since January 2017, 7,900 workers in the steel industry have lost their jobs due to shutdowns or cutbacks, including the shutdown of blast furnaces at USS Great Lakes Works.

So far this year, steel mills in the United States have operated at an average of 66% of capacity during 2020, steel production is down by 20% and steel prices are at their lowest point since President Trump took office.

President Trump has allied himself and his administration with the wealthy and powerful and against workers and the most vulnerable in our society.

Heís championed tax cuts for corporations and the wealthy, increasing the federal deficit to record levels, but heís failed to deliver the infrastructure program to rebuild our nationís crumbling bridges and roads. He has worked to undermine collective bargaining, workplace safety, environmental safeguards, the Affordable Care Act, government ethics, congressional oversight and voting rights.

Contract negotiations in the steel and iron ore industry were difficult in 2018 and are likely to be difficult again in 2022. The companies will seek to divide us and demand cuts and concessions. Our nation and our union need a leader in the White House that supports working people and labor unions.

Vice President Joe Biden has long been a friend of workers and our union. He will fight to raise the minimum wage, expand access to affordable health care, stabilize multiemployer pension plans, defend Medicare and Social Security and preserve and expand civil and labor rights.

The USW is proud to endorse Joe Biden for president, as he seeks to put our country back on a path toward shared prosperity through responsible leadership.

Democrats used to be the party of the middle class.  Now theyíre the party of the wealthy and elites.

 ;D geezaz member Shady! Now do Republicans... the party of???

Offline waldo

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6327 on: October 20, 2020, 06:36:31 pm »
c'mon member Shady - if you're gonna drop these gems, you can't just do a drive-by... here, have another look/go at this post, hey!

NBC: Say, you know who turned out to be right about forest fires?  Donald Trump.https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/decades-mismanagement-led-choked-forests-now-it-s-time-clear-n1243599?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma

Better late than never!

notwithstanding Trump's limited view/understanding of so-called forest management is a narrow focus represented by the many times he's talked about gettin' rakes out to clean-up the forest floor!  ;D

wait member Shady, what's this... the federal government owns 57% of the forest land in the state of California. What's Trump been waiting on, hey!

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ďYouíve got to take care of the floors. You know the floors of the forests, itís very important,Ē Trump said amid the charred ruins of Paradise ó his first stop on the tour.

Trump went on to explain that the president of Finland, whom he met on an overseas trip a week earlier, told him about raking the forest floors. ďHe called it a forest nation,Ē Trump said, ďand they spent a lot of time on raking and cleaning and doing things, and they donít have any problem.Ē

Finnish President Sauli Niinisto later disputed this. He told a local newspaper that he had briefed Trump on Finlandís efforts to surveil and care for its forests, The Associated Press wrote, ďbut said he canít recall anything being mentioned on raking.Ē

Raking for leaves and needles is not a normal feature of Finnish fire prevention, according to Rami Ruuska, a forest-fires expert at the Finnish Interior Ministry. Instead, Finns focus on removing dead trees from the forest floor ó where possible.

c'mon member Shady, what about Trump threatening to withhold federal funds to California... until Cali buys more rakes! (ok, ok, I kid, I kid). But really, what about prescribed burns - AND the climate change Trump claims is a hoax perpetrated by China... causing the other apparent drought and bark-beetle infestation hoaxes!

Offline waldo

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6328 on: October 20, 2020, 07:04:45 pm »
moot point! There's a reason for the recent uptick in articles/mentions/speculations on whether or not a sitting president can pardon himself!  ;D

of course there's always the weasel-around where Trump claims he's unable to continue and the "25th amendment" shifts Pence into the Presidency... and pardons flow from there!

by the by:


Hereís what 12 experts say about whether President Trump can pardon himself

Offline waldo

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Re: The Donald Trump Thread
« Reply #6329 on: October 20, 2020, 07:24:09 pm »
Trump trashes Fauci and makes baseless coronavirus claims in campaign call

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A frustrated and at times foul-mouthed President Donald Trump claimed on a campaign call that people are tired of hearing about the deadly pandemic which has killed more than 215,000 Americans and trashed Dr. Anthony Fauci as a "disaster" who has been around for "500 years."

Referring to Fauci and other health officials as "idiots," Trump declared the country ready to move on from the health disaster, even as cases are again spiking and medical experts warn the worst may be yet to come.

Baselessly claiming that if Fauci was in charge more than half a million people would be dead in the United States, Trump portrayed the recommendations offered by his own administration to mitigate spread of the disease as a burdensome annoyance.

"People are tired of Covid. I have the biggest rallies I've ever had, and we have Covid," Trump said, phoning into a call with campaign staff from his namesake hotel in Las Vegas, where he spent two nights amid a western campaign swing. "People are saying whatever. Just leave us alone. They're tired of it. People are tired of hearing Fauci and all these idiots."


wait, what? Oh my - awkward... National Academy of Medicine presents citation to Fauci!  ;D