Author Topic: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism  (Read 1269 times)

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Offline TimG

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #90 on: October 31, 2017, 09:08:38 pm »
A teacher buys a poor student a winter jacket because his father lost his job and his family can’t afford it this year. That’s equity. That’s fair.
That is charity - not equity.

The rich kid in the class whines to the principal that the teacher should buy ALL the students in the class a winter coat because that’s equality. That’s your position right now.
Bad analogy: being rich is a tangible benefit which confers clearly recognizable advantages on individuals no matter what their skin colour. It does not support the argument that you would like to make which is that simply having a particular skin colour confers advantages. If people have "privilege" it is because of wealth or connections - not skin colour.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2017, 09:52:47 pm by TimG »

Offline Omni

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #91 on: October 31, 2017, 11:00:33 pm »
That is charity - not equity.
Bad analogy: being rich is a tangible benefit which confers clearly recognizable advantages on individuals no matter what their skin colour. It does not support the argument that you would like to make which is that simply having a particular skin colour confers advantages. If people have "privilege" it is because of wealth or connections - not skin colour.
Wealth is not always achievable if you don't have the "right" skin color. Have you never traveled much?
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Offline TimG

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #92 on: November 01, 2017, 11:29:11 am »
Wealth is not always achievable if you don't have the "right" skin color.
That is a myth you choose to believe. It has no basis in fact. If particular groups seem to be disadvantaged it is invariably due to a history of poverty - not skin colour. Eliminate the poverty and the toxic family structures that go with it and people from these groups can succeed as much as anyone else.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #93 on: November 01, 2017, 11:50:57 am »
A teacher buys a poor student a winter jacket because his father lost his job and his family can’t afford it this year. That’s equity. That’s fair.

The rich kid in the class whines to the principal that the teacher should buy ALL the students in the class a winter coat because that’s equality. That’s your position right now.

No, that's your weird analogy which has little or nothing to do with my position. Let's leave aside your belief that all people who are not white males are poverty stricken, helpless and in need of help - which is amazingly paternalistic, btw - we're talking here about letting people get away with disrespecting others due to race because they have a favored skin pigmentation.

Your proper analogy would be if two boys punch two other boys without provocation. Teacher ignores the black boy who punched the white boy but gasps in horror at the white boy who punched a black boy and drags him down to the Vice Principal to demand he be expelled.

"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline Omni

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #94 on: November 01, 2017, 02:03:17 pm »
Your proper analogy would be if two boys punch two other boys without provocation. Teacher ignores the black boy who punched the white boy but gasps in horror at the white boy who punched a black boy and drags him down to the Vice Principal to demand he be expelled.

Is that what you think happens in the real world?
« Last Edit: November 01, 2017, 04:24:35 pm by JMT »

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #95 on: November 01, 2017, 10:04:24 pm »

Offline Omni

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #96 on: November 01, 2017, 10:25:49 pm »
He probably does because facts don’t matter to people like him.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/feb/26/hillary-clinton/hillary-clinton-says-blacks-more-likely-be-arreste/

I suspect he hasn't traveled much. I was lucky enough to have roamed the far corners which opened my eyes and my mind. Different skin color doesn't frighten me.

Offline TimG

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #97 on: November 02, 2017, 02:09:11 am »
He probably does because facts don’t matter to people like him.
From your own link:

Quote
What surveys have shown "is that the levels of self-reported drug sales are about the same for blacks and whites, especially under age 20," said Michael Tonry, professor of law at the University of Minnesota. "But the big differences are that whites are more likely to sell to people they know, and they much more often sell behind closed doors. Blacks sell to people they don't know and in public, which makes them vastly easier to arrest."
IOW - there are differences between the groups that can explain the differential. Of course facts don't matter to you if they undermine the nonsensical notion that skin colour is causal factor rather than a spurious correlation.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 05:36:03 am by TimG »

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #98 on: November 02, 2017, 12:46:37 pm »
He probably does because facts don’t matter to people like him.

I'm still waiting for you or any other progressive here to condemn this blatant act of racism.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #99 on: November 02, 2017, 12:47:10 pm »
I suspect he hasn't traveled much. I was lucky enough to have roamed the far corners which opened my eyes and my mind.

Having no brain in there probably makes an open mind pretty much a matter of course.
"When liberals insist that only fascists will defend borders then voters will hire fascists to do the job liberals won't do." David Frum

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #100 on: November 02, 2017, 01:10:23 pm »
From your own link:
IOW - there are differences between the groups that can explain the differential. Of course facts don't matter to you if they undermine the nonsensical notion that skin colour is causal factor rather than a spurious correlation.
Smselling drugs to your friends is legal then?

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #101 on: November 02, 2017, 01:11:07 pm »
I'm still waiting for you or any other progressive here to condemn this blatant act of racism.
Im still waiting for you to understand the difference between discrimination and racism.

Offline TimG

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #102 on: November 02, 2017, 01:58:10 pm »
Smselling drugs to your friends is legal then?
If a group of people engage in illegal activity privately they are much less likely to be caught when compared to another group that engages in the same activity in public. This is sufficient to explain the difference in arrest rates and it has nothing to do with skin colour. It is frankly absurd to argue that the arrests should be proportionate across groups when there is a material difference between how the crimes are conducted.

 
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 02:15:53 pm by TimG »

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #103 on: November 02, 2017, 03:53:19 pm »
It’s absolutely not sufficient. You’ve ignored 90% of the article for one point that’s barely relevant to the overall point.

Offline cybercoma

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Re: Fran Lebowitz on Race and Racism
« Reply #104 on: November 02, 2017, 03:57:22 pm »
When Muslims kill Herrera terrorists.
When blacks kill they’re thugs.
When whites kill they’re mentally ill and in need of help.

That’s racism.