Author Topic: Cultural Marxism  (Read 2185 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12474
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2017, 05:38:32 pm »
Your claim:

Quote

With C-16 it makes it a hate crime to call them anything else other than the arbitrary moniker they give themselves on any day.

Here's a pretty good analysis:

https://politics.stackexchange.com/questions/20038/why-is-canadas-bill-c-16-believed-to-be-legislating-pronoun-use

It says you're wrong.

Another one:

https://torontoist.com/2016/12/are-jordan-petersons-claims-about-bill-c-16-correct/

So the fly in the ointment is the HRCs which are extrajudicial, and a cause of controversy all on their own...

Offline Queefer Sutherland

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10189
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2017, 06:09:33 pm »
Re: the OP & article, it's a pretty wild conspiracy theory.  I've heard the label before but didn't know about the conspiracy theory.  I know some on the right use the "cultural Marxism" term, which is ridiculous in itself.  I don't think this concept unites the right, only some.  My dad is a typical old conservatives crank and he has no idea what "cultural marxism" is

Quote
"And it distracts from the most important factor in these changes: capitalism, which demands mobility, whose crises have eroded living standards, and which thus, among other things, undermines the viability of conventional family structures and the traditional lifestyles that conservatives approve of."

How does capitalism explain things gay marriage, abortions etc?

Quote
Cultural Marxism': a uniting theory for rightwingers who love to play the victim by Jason Wilson

Some nutjobs may use this concept to claim victimhood, but many more of the right claim victimhood without any of this conspiracy nonsense.  The left claims victimhood, the right claims it, the Jews claim it, the Palestinians claim it, Nazis claimed it...victimhood is a part of any strong narrative usually.
"Nipples is one of the great minds of our time!" - Bubbermiley

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2017, 06:37:57 pm »
Nazis claimed it...

I watched a show last night that said the biggest ethnic cleansing in history was perpetrated on the Germans just after WWII. 


Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12474
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2017, 06:55:36 pm »
I watched a show last night that said the biggest ethnic cleansing in history was perpetrated on the Germans just after WWII.

You DO realize that posting something like that without explaining what you mean is a weird thing to do, right ?

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2017, 07:03:03 pm »
You DO realize that posting something like that without explaining what you mean is a weird thing to do, right ?

I didn't know it was the case.  I knew some Germans were persecuted after the war but I had no idea they were the subjects of the largest ethnic cleansing in history.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12474
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2017, 07:06:40 pm »
I didn't know it was the case.  I knew some Germans were persecuted after the war but I had no idea they were the subjects of the largest ethnic cleansing in history.

So now you've done it twice.

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2017, 07:27:29 pm »
So now you've done it twice.

I aim to please.  A little confusion is good for the soul.

Offline cybercoma

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2956
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #22 on: October 13, 2017, 08:24:22 am »
Your claim:

Here's a pretty good analysis:

https://politics.stackexchange.com/questions/20038/why-is-canadas-bill-c-16-believed-to-be-legislating-pronoun-use

It says you're wrong.

Another one:

https://torontoist.com/2016/12/are-jordan-petersons-claims-about-bill-c-16-correct/

So the fly in the ointment is the HRCs which are extrajudicial, and a cause of controversy all on their own...
That second article makes Peterson look strangely misinformed. There is no “free speech” in Canada. We have “free expression” but we also have “reasonable limits” on rights and, as an aside, a notwithstanding clause. However, we”re not talking about Charter rights. Every province has its own human rights legislation and it’s not difficult to see how being abused by a professor or teacher in a classroom could violate someone’s rights. Calling a transgender person or non-binary person by incorrect pronouns is not only psychologically harmful but reinforces public stigma of them in the classroom. Being a student is like a job and that kind of treatment in the job would land an employer in trouble because people deserve to be treated humanely. When Peterson uses the wrong pronouns intentionally he’s disregarding people’s right to whatever gender expression they choose to present. It’s inhumane because it’s abusive. To put an example out there in gender binary terms, it’s like a grade school teacher constantly calling your son a “little girl.” At some point it becomes mental abuse and when it comes from an authority figure like that and is done in front of the other children, it’s almost certainly immediately abusive. Peterson is in the wrong here 100%, and his stubbornness about linguistics blinds him to the bigger issue here.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12474
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #23 on: October 13, 2017, 08:45:09 am »
Ok, I feel I have caught up on this, and the points I see as important:

- You can't be charged with a hate-crime for using the wrong pronoun
- You could be called before a provincial HRC depending on context of where it was used, eg. workplace, public facility, classroom

I was siding with him, though, on the stipulation that the government shouldn't force you to USE language, versus prevent you from using language.  In other words  he was saying that the government can deem, say, the infamous 'n-word' as abusive language but shouldn't force you to use a pronoun.

Does this legislation effectively do that for him ?  If I say you can ONLY refer to me by this pronoun and you insist on using 'they' then it seems to me he's right.  It's an edge case but if he's protesting on the basis I stated then yes he is right. 

Offline gh0sthacked

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #24 on: October 13, 2017, 10:49:30 am »
I watched a show last night that said the biggest ethnic cleansing in history was perpetrated on the Germans just after WWII.

That would seem to not be well known if true.

The only stuff I know about was during the war. It was when Nazi Germany plowed inwards on the Soviet Union. They stretched their supply chain thin and made some large strategical errors. This allows the Soviets to surround a large number of German soldiers and massacre them. The Soviets retaliated hard. I guess Dresden could be another example, but in a much different way.

Offline Michael Hardner

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12474
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #25 on: October 13, 2017, 10:54:23 am »
That would seem to not be well known if true.
 

I concur.  BCS decided to just f*3K with us by not providing details.

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2017, 10:55:46 am »
That would seem to not be well known if true.

The only stuff I know about was during the war. It was when Nazi Germany plowed inwards on the Soviet Union. They stretched their supply chain thin and made some large strategical errors. This allows the Soviets to surround a large number of German soldiers and massacre them. The Soviets retaliated hard. I guess Dresden could be another example, but in a much different way.

A lot of people were killed, but it was more the forced eviction of Germans from Easter Europe that the programme was referencing.

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2017, 10:57:16 am »
I concur.  BCS decided to just f*3K with us by not providing details.

It was on the television.  What was I going to do?

Why would I f*3K with you?  I'm bored, but I'm not that bored.

Offline cybercoma

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2956
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #28 on: October 13, 2017, 02:29:44 pm »
Ok, I feel I have caught up on this, and the points I see as important:

- You can't be charged with a hate-crime for using the wrong pronoun
- You could be called before a provincial HRC depending on context of where it was used, eg. workplace, public facility, classroom

I was siding with him, though, on the stipulation that the government shouldn't force you to USE language, versus prevent you from using language.  In other words  he was saying that the government can deem, say, the infamous 'n-word' as abusive language but shouldn't force you to use a pronoun.

Does this legislation effectively do that for him ?  If I say you can ONLY refer to me by this pronoun and you insist on using 'they' then it seems to me he's right.  It's an edge case but if he's protesting on the basis I stated then yes he is right.
Think of it this way....what if an employer or co-worker constantly called you an "it" or better yet, your child?

guest7

  • Guest
Re: Cultural Marxism
« Reply #29 on: October 13, 2017, 02:33:36 pm »
Think of it this way....what if an employer or co-worker constantly called you an "it" or better yet, your child?

Should they be charged with a crime?