Author Topic: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez  (Read 646 times)

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Offline waldo

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2019, 01:02:16 pm »
Genuinely curious-- can you point to any examples that demonstrate that she's actually a dumb-person who thinks she's smart?

sure, she's an easy target for the FoxNews morons to attack - but she drives a lot of that critical attention (deserved or not) through her over-confidence/cockiness that does require a modicum of being factually accurate; to me, her failings around the 'Green Deal' are a highlight. Other noted critiqued points that have helped fuel right-wing animosity to her: here & here
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Offline MH

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2019, 01:15:11 pm »
She's a symbol.  I still don't see why I have to listen to what she says to comment on her fame.

Offline Poonlight Graham

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2019, 02:50:06 pm »
She seems genuinely nice, charming, and ethical, but her naive idealism is off the charts and the Green New Deal is utterly unrealistic cow manure with no real plan whatsoever, and her comments surrounding it are embarrassing.

She is what happens when you want to save the world but you don't know wtf you're talking about, which is very dangerous.  She's the progressive version of Trump, but a border wall costs ~20 billion vs her proposals costing tens of trillions.
"The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth"  - African proverb
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Offline kimmy

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2019, 03:33:02 pm »
sure, she's an easy target for the FoxNews morons to attack - but she drives a lot of that critical attention (deserved or not) through her over-confidence/cockiness that does require a modicum of being factually accurate; to me, her failings around the 'Green Deal' are a highlight. Other noted critiqued points that have helped fuel right-wing animosity to her: here & here

This is genuinely informative. Coverage of AOC should focus more on this kind of thing, and less on her age or her looks or her background.

This is where politics is falling short. People aren't actually talking about what she has said.  Her cheerleaders, of which there are many, love her because of who she is and some pithy sound-bites she's made.  Her haters, of which there are also many, are attacking a cartoon-- they've made her a figurehead for everything they hate about "the left" in general.   Neither group seems to pay much attention to issues of substance... it's all about her.  As Michael said early in the thread:
Quote
personality and surface perceptions over ideas and critical discussion and collaboration, candidate as product.

 -k
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Offline ?Impact

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2019, 03:36:45 pm »
She seems genuinely nice, charming, and ethical, but her naive idealism is off the charts and the Green New Deal is utterly unrealistic cow manure with no real plan whatsoever, and her comments surrounding it are embarrassing.

She is what happens when you want to save the world but you don't know wtf you're talking about, which is very dangerous.  She's the progressive version of Trump, but a border wall costs ~20 billion vs her proposals costing tens of trillions.

You sound like a believer in the status quo, and don't want any change.

I believe ethics are very important, and as you point out distinguish her from Trump.
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Offline Poonlight Graham

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2019, 04:05:12 pm »
You sound like a believer in the status quo, and don't want any change.

What gave you that idea? Change is good, the US needs lots of change, but if you're going to propose massive changes you need to have a specific plan, and if it sounds like it's going to cost tens of trillion of dollars you had better cost your plan and tell people exactly how it will be paid for.  You need to be more than a dreamer.
"The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth"  - African proverb
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Offline Poonlight Graham

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2019, 04:07:08 pm »
I believe ethics are very important, and as you point out distinguish her from Trump.

I totally agree, but you need more than ethics too, you need good policy.
"The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth"  - African proverb

Offline Omni

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2019, 04:53:39 pm »
She seems genuinely nice, charming, and ethical, but her naive idealism is off the charts and the Green New Deal is utterly unrealistic cow manure with no real plan whatsoever, and her comments surrounding it are embarrassing.

She is what happens when you want to save the world but you don't know wtf you're talking about, which is very dangerous.  She's the progressive version of Trump, but a border wall costs ~20 billion vs her proposals costing tens of trillions.

I would agree that achieving all of what is suggested in the Green New Deal is, certainly currently, out of reach. However wasting billions on a wall to solve a problem which we know doesn't really exist, would be a lot stupider than spending the same amount for at least some small steps toward dealing with a problem which we know actually does exist.

Offline Pinus or Vid or...?????

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2019, 05:19:20 pm »
I would agree that achieving all of what is suggested in the Green New Deal is, certainly currently, out of reach. However wasting billions on a wall to solve a problem which we know doesn't really exist, would be a lot stupider than spending the same amount for at least some small steps toward dealing with a problem which we know actually does exist.

Yes the Wall is ridiculous. However, there is only one way to battle GHG and Global Warming- War.

You see, human beings are selfish and will wait until most mammals are extinct, and it threatens their way of life. Humans will kill each other off. Anyone who thinks we will all join hands, and play fair is naive. The USA is moving backward on the issue, and China and India are emitting more and more pollutants as they become more industrialized. There is no hope for us.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2019, 05:24:15 pm by Pinus »
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Offline Omni

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2019, 05:43:53 pm »
Yes the Wall is ridiculous. However, there is only one way to battle GHG and Global Warming- War.

You see, human beings are selfish and will wait until most mammals are extinct, and it threatens their way of life. Humans will kill each other off. Anyone who thinks we will all join hands, and play fair is naive. The USA is moving backward on the issue, and China and India are emitting more and more pollutants as they become more industrialized. There is no hope for us.

Certainly the US is moving backwards on the issue currently but that has to do with the fact it's current POTUS knows nothing about science, or doesn't care because he has his hands deep in the pockets of the likes of Robert Murray et al. China and India are both making serious strides toward reducing fossil fuel dependence even though they have much larger populations to deal with. If we continue to ignore science and proceed with stupid political issues like building walls, then you're probably right, no hope.

Offline Pinus or Vid or...?????

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2019, 05:51:58 pm »
Certainly the US is moving backwards on the issue currently but that has to do with the fact it's current POTUS knows nothing about science, or doesn't care because he has his hands deep in the pockets of the likes of Robert Murray et al. China and India are both making serious strides toward reducing fossil fuel dependence even though they have much larger populations to deal with. If we continue to ignore science and proceed with stupid political issues like building walls, then you're probably right, no hope.

The wall is pretty much irrelevant in the big picture. All we can hope for is the ability of the Earth to absorb any man made destruction we impose on it.
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Offline Poonlight Graham

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2019, 08:18:44 pm »
I would agree that achieving all of what is suggested in the Green New Deal is, certainly currently, out of reach. However wasting billions on a wall to solve a problem which we know doesn't really exist, would be a lot stupider than spending the same amount for at least some small steps toward dealing with a problem which we know actually does exist.

Depends what that policy is I guess.  Certainly possible.  We'll see what she proposes as legislation/policy.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2019, 08:20:34 pm by Poonlight Graham »
"The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth"  - African proverb

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #27 on: March 11, 2019, 05:39:03 pm »
if you're going to propose massive changes you need to have a specific plan

It seems a former Prime Minister talked a lot about making Canada an energy superpower, but had no specific plan. He started saying that day one on the job, and got re-elected a couple of more times. I do remember our manufacturing base being decimated, but nothing about becoming an energy superpower.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 05:41:24 pm by ?Impact »

Online TimG

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2019, 07:26:42 pm »
It seems a former Prime Minister talked a lot about making Canada an energy superpower, but had no specific plan.
A lot depends on the inclinations of the politician. In Harper's case becoming an energy superpower would involve encouraging private business. The same rhetoric coming from politician with an inclination towards nationalizing the oil industry would be a huge concern. i.e. the problem with vagueness comes from the fear of what that politician might actually do and AOC's there is a fell founded fear that she would see to kill off the economy by saddling businesses with so many regulations and taxes that they could no longer function.

Offline Bubbermiley

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Re: Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
« Reply #29 on: March 15, 2019, 07:31:16 am »
Or perhaps it depends on the inclinations of the opposition to make up whatever BS they can to serve Big Oil interests.