Canadian Political Events

Beyond Canada => American Politics => Topic started by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:13:55 pm

Title: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:13:55 pm
Did Donald Trump say something a bit off the wall today?  Probably.  This is the place.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:14:36 pm
In all honesty though, I think Trump could have done far worse when it came to picking a supreme court nominee.  It was the most normal thing he's done thus far.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 01, 2017, 09:36:54 pm
He's put Iran on notice, and told the Mexican president that he'll send in the troops to take care of their 'bad hombres'.   What does being put on notice mean, anyway?   I can't imagine a leader saying "oh, Trump has put me on notice.  Guess I better go sit in the corner". 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:38:19 pm
Iran isn't going to get a gold star on its report card.

In all honesty, that, combined with Bannon's place on the National Security Council should be very concerning.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:48:50 pm
Today, Trump hung up on the Prime Minister of Australia.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 01, 2017, 09:50:04 pm
He's making friends around the world, has apparently ripped the Australian PM a new one.   http://globalnews.ca/news/3221634/donald-trump-phone-call-australia/?sf54054445=1
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 01, 2017, 09:50:59 pm
Off the wall today?

He threatened to send troops into Mexico to deal with the "bad hombres." So much for political sovereignty.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 09:53:27 pm
I'm more worried about bad omelettes when I'm in Mexico.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 01, 2017, 10:09:16 pm
Did he actually hang up on Australia's PM today?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 10:11:40 pm
Apparently so:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-02/donald-trump-shared-worst-call-with-malcolm-turnbull/8234904
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 01, 2017, 10:17:01 pm
Yep, Trump is unable to hold a civil conversation with a centre right PM from an ally nation.

12 days in and time to consider the 25th amendment. 

 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution  (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 01, 2017, 11:24:38 pm
For those keeping score, I just saw a tweet - Donald Trump has in 12 days threatened action against 2 countries - Iran and Mexico.

They don't have to threaten to invade Australia.  Lucky for them, Obama left them 1500 (and growing) troops there.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 02, 2017, 01:52:34 am
Yep, Trump is unable to hold a civil conversation with a centre right PM from an ally nation.

12 days in and time to consider the 25th amendment. 

 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution  (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution)

We both know that there is more to the story than trump blowing up and hanging up the phone.  What provoked him, what was Aussie pm's tone, etc. 

Then again part of me thinks it's trump making an example out of the Aussie pm to show adversaries whoever they may be that trump plays hardball.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 02, 2017, 07:12:30 am
Apparently Trump was tired. 

That this got leaked from the White House (again) shows that Trump doesn't really engender a lot of loyalty.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 02, 2017, 08:41:43 am
When the aussie PM stood up to the American bully the bully acted like a child.

No surprise there.

The man is unfit to be President.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: poochy on February 02, 2017, 09:55:44 am
It's gonna be a long, hopefully less than 4 years.  I thought this guy was supposed to be less interested in playing world policeman, except in all of the same places they always have and now maybe in Mexico.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 02, 2017, 01:14:37 pm
Today, Donald Trump decided that he can't wait 90 days to start NAFTA negotiations, as required by US law.  He can't even wait, in fact, for the US Trade Representative to be confirmed:

Quote
"I would like to speed it up if possible. You're the folks who can do it," Trump said during a meeting in the White House with a bipartisan group of politicians from the U.S. Senate and the House of Representatives.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trump-nafta-negotiations-1.3963544
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 02, 2017, 01:42:06 pm
Today, Donald Trump decided that he can't wait 90 days to start NAFTA negotiations, as required by US law.  He can't even wait, in fact, for the US Trade Representative to be confirmed:

Quote
"I would like to speed it up if possible. You're the folks who can do it," Trump said during a meeting in the White House with a bipartisan group of politicians from the U.S. Senate and the House of Representatives.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trump-nafta-negotiations-1.3963544

Thank god I got rid of the cows years ago.  This is my issue with trump.  As much as I like his stance on pipelines, taxes, and saving money, I am not a fan of excessive micromanaging of an economy.  It has been proven that free trade makes societies richer and I'm happier that Mexico is richer as it's more customers with money for products.  What the American people fail to realize is that being anti trade is a bandaid solution as they are going to handcuff their economy by cutting out a lot of customers. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 02, 2017, 01:44:00 pm
Today, Donald Trump decided that he can't wait 90 days to start NAFTA negotiations, as required by US law.  He can't even wait, in fact, for the US Trade Representative to be confirmed:

Quote
"I would like to speed it up if possible. You're the folks who can do it," Trump said during a meeting in the White House with a bipartisan group of politicians from the U.S. Senate and the House of Representatives.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trump-nafta-negotiations-1.3963544

Thank god I got rid of the cows years ago.  This is my issue with trump.  As much as I like his stance on pipelines, taxes, and saving money, I am not a fan of excessive micromanaging of an economy.  It has been proven that free trade makes societies richer and I'm happier that Mexico is richer as it's more customers with money for products.  What the American people fail to realize is that being anti trade is a bandaid solution as they are going to handcuff their economy by cutting out a lot of customers.

I was actually listening to the radio and the talk was about how much power Mexico actually has in these negotiations.  They can decided to make it so the capital and jobs can't just leave, just as easy as Trump can decide he wants them back.  They also have a lot of power over the fresh food supply moving north.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 02, 2017, 07:10:35 pm
Whether or not its particularly significant I am not sure, but there are an awful lot of memes making fun of Trump.   Haven't seen any other political figures so mocked on social media.   
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 02, 2017, 07:33:38 pm
Whether or not its particularly significant I am not sure, but there are an awful lot of memes making fun of Trump.   Haven't seen any other political figures so mocked on social media.

GW bush presidency ended as social media became mainstream or he would have been hammered more
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 02, 2017, 07:46:34 pm
There are a lot of Conservatives on my Facebook.  Trudeau gets it about as much as Trump on my feed.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 02, 2017, 08:09:57 pm
BTW, when Trump was talking to the Prime Minister of Australia, he spent much of his time bragging about his electoral college margin....
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 02, 2017, 10:18:33 pm
I give the Australian PM credit for his tact and diplomacy in answering questions about the call then.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 02, 2017, 10:34:30 pm
I give the Australian PM credit for his tact and diplomacy in answering questions about the call then.

The Australian PM has a bit more leverage than other countries in dealing with the USA as they have a very strategic location and two very large customers for their products a short boy ride away.  So turnbull can get away with it.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 03, 2017, 05:16:51 am
I'm not sure what you mean "get away with it." What I meant was that he showed a lot of restraint in talking about the situation. He could have gone to the media and just trashed Trump, but he chose his words carefully. He gave Trump a lot more respect than he probably deserved after that phone call.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 03, 2017, 07:37:55 am
Don't forget, there are US troops in Darwin - he's probably sacred Trump will threaten to invade him next.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 03, 2017, 11:51:41 am
I'm not sure what you mean "get away with it." What I meant was that he showed a lot of restraint in talking about the situation. He could have gone to the media and just trashed Trump, but he chose his words carefully. He gave Trump a lot more respect than he probably deserved after that phone call.

Getting away with getting under trump's skin to cause trump to have a blow.  Trump has a lot of political capital right now.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 03, 2017, 12:23:32 pm
Trump can't take a bit of criticism or contrary opinion without going off the rails. In less than two weeks since he jumped on his bully pulpit, he has managed to get two allies to give him the finger, together with a botched raid in Yemen that the former administration wouldn't approve and appointed an ambassador to the EU who has publicly declared he would like to see the EU to disappear. How long until Vlad is his only "friend" left. Trump may have political capital at home but he seems intent on alienating all those countries which have supported the US for decades.

Australia is the biggest western power in the region. It's military while not large compared to China and a few other countries in the region, is well equipped, capable and in the process of being made even more capable. Australia has just signed a defence agreement with Japan. Next to the US, Australia is the biggest contributor to the fight against ISIL and if the US goes head to head with China in the South China Sea, it will need Australia's support bigly.

Dumb ass Trump jeopardizes all that, for what?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 03, 2017, 01:38:23 pm
Well so far we have Kellyanne Conway with her "alternative facts", Trumps press secretary and some of his cabinet spouting outright lies, bans on immigration, and an Attorney General fired for for pointing out the illegality of an Exec. Order. What's next, 2+2 equals 5? Things look a little grim, unlesss of course you happen to own the copyright to 1984.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 03, 2017, 03:52:59 pm
Well so far we have Kellyanne Conway with her "alternative facts", Trumps press secretary and some of his cabinet spouting outright lies, bans on immigration, and an Attorney General fired for for pointing out the illegality of an Exec. Order. What's next, 2+2 equals 5? Things look a little grim, unlesss of course you happen to own the copyright to 1984.

The attorney general was fired for not enforcing the executive order.  There is consensus that she had to go.  Whether or not she was in the right is up for debate.

All press secretaries conjure up malarkey.  Trump is at war with the press and the press is dancing to his music.  If the press wants to beat trump, they have to pick their fights with him or they lose credibility.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 03, 2017, 04:04:31 pm
The attorney general was fired for not enforcing the executive order.  There is consensus that she had to go.  Whether or not she was in the right is up for debate.

I have to go with you here.  She should have just carried out the order, or resigned.  I was wrong when I said differently. 

It's also in fact true that her department was consulted before the EO was signed. 

Quote
All press secretaries conjure up malarkey.  Trump is at war with the press and the press is dancing to his music.  If the press wants to beat trump, they have to pick their fights with him or they lose credibility.

Not like the crowd thing.  He ruined any credibility there.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 03, 2017, 05:21:56 pm
I have to go with you here.  She should have just carried out the order, or resigned.  I was wrong when I said differently. 

It's also in fact true that her department was consulted before the EO was signed. 

Not like the crowd thing.  He ruined any credibility there.

Everyone knows a lot of what comes out of trumps mouth is fluff and/or made up.  I think his game is to get the media to bite on his made up fluff and to big themselves down in it so he rams his policy thru.  He has had a very active first 14 days and by having the press be outraged at every little thing he does is take their credibility away.  The press should pick their fights.  Trump is at war with the media and his goal is to turn people off of them, part of that is to paint them as crying wolf.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 03, 2017, 10:23:23 pm
The attorney general was fired for not enforcing the executive order.  There is consensus that she had to go.  Whether or not she was in the right is up for debate.

All press secretaries conjure up malarkey.  Trump is at war with the press and the press is dancing to his music.  If the press wants to beat trump, they have to pick their fights with him or they lose credibility.

The AG was fired because she provided her learned opinion as to the lagality of the Muslim ban. That's her job. Wimpy boy just got his nose out of joint.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 04, 2017, 12:39:34 am
Except there was consensus that trump was fine to can her for not doing her job. 

She is free to act on her beliefs and trump is free to can her
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 04, 2017, 07:44:27 am
Except there was consensus that trump was fine to can her for not doing her job. 

She is free to act on her beliefs and trump is free to can her
She wasn't acting on her "beliefs" though. She was acting on her professional understanding of the law and upholding the constitution according to her oath of office.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 04, 2017, 09:30:24 am
CNN head warns Trump. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/19/cnns-president-has-fired-a-warning-shot-at-donald-trump/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na&utm_term=.9e1f5b5eaa45 (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/19/cnns-president-has-fired-a-warning-shot-at-donald-trump/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na&utm_term=.9e1f5b5eaa45)

Wonder how this will play out. He has a point, when I was flying overseas the two networks you could always seem to count on in hotels were CNN and BBC World, not FOX. Neither are going to be intimidated by Trump.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 04, 2017, 11:05:10 am
The Obama years were extremely good for Fox News.

And if CNN becomes known as the news network that's not going to be intimidated by Trump, the Trump years will be very good for CNN.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 04, 2017, 11:13:56 am
Trump administration had a draft of an executive order to overturn Obama's protection for LGBT federal workers...  Ivanka Trump and her husband campaigned against it, leading to last week's White House statement that the protections will remain in place.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/ivanka-trump-jared-kushner-lgbt-order-234617

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 04, 2017, 01:31:00 pm
So heading into week 2  we have a fired AG and now a federal judge putting a restraining order against a Trump EO. (travel plan) So the fight with the judicial branch seems to be simmering away, so I wonder how things are going over in Congress. Is this the start of 4 years of turmoil?

 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-immigration-idUSKBN15I1CM
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 04, 2017, 01:33:12 pm
CNN head warns Trump. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/19/cnns-president-has-fired-a-warning-shot-at-donald-trump/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na&utm_term=.9e1f5b5eaa45 (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/19/cnns-president-has-fired-a-warning-shot-at-donald-trump/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na&utm_term=.9e1f5b5eaa45)

Wonder how this will play out. He has a point, when I was flying overseas the two networks you could always seem to count on in hotels were CNN and BBC World, not FOX. Neither are going to be intimidated by Trump.

Nobody will be intimidated by anyone.  Trump has pulled a fast one by getting the head of CNN to admit that if trump doesn't play nice there is to be biased coverage.  Now trump can yell fake news till he's blue in the face.  Given what streaming video online is doing to the tv industry there is no monopoly on news which is good as there are many people holding the whitehouse accountable and a lot of competition holding the press corps accountable.

The problem with too many talking heads is that there will never be a "free to choose" series which was fantastic. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 04, 2017, 01:59:44 pm
I think you give trump far too much credit.  I don't get any sense of organization of knowledge from this White House.  All I can see is chaos.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 04, 2017, 03:58:54 pm
Nobody will be intimidated by anyone.  Trump has pulled a fast one by getting the head of CNN to admit that if trump doesn't play nice there is to be biased coverage.  Now trump can yell fake news till he's blue in the face.  Given what streaming video online is doing to the tv industry there is no monopoly on news which is good as there are many people holding the whitehouse accountable and a lot of competition holding the press corps accountable.

The problem with too many talking heads is that there will never be a "free to choose" series which was fantastic.

One problem with Trump as he keeps putting out fake news (such his inauguration attendance #'s etc.) until he is, well, orange in the face. And there are those that buy it simply because he said it. And then when he does get caught out, he just says he didn't say it, and conjures up another illegal EO.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 04, 2017, 04:35:54 pm
I think you give trump far too much credit.  I don't get any sense of organization of knowledge from this White House.  All I can see is chaos.

Yea, every time one of his supporters says "It's a plan", I just shake my head.   
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 04, 2017, 05:00:46 pm
Nobody will be intimidated by anyone.  Trump has pulled a fast one by getting the head of CNN to admit that if trump doesn't play nice there is to be biased coverage.  Now trump can yell fake news till he's blue in the face.  Given what streaming video online is doing to the tv industry there is no monopoly on news which is good as there are many people holding the whitehouse accountable and a lot of competition holding the press corps accountable.

The problem with too many talking heads is that there will never be a "free to choose" series which was fantastic.

Yay, quote function works.

CNN International and BBC World Service are different animals from their domestic kin. If people see their reporting and it is backed up by their own and other media sources, Trump can scream fake all he wants but the rest of the world won't be buying it. They don't have to be biased, all they need are facts.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 04, 2017, 05:11:01 pm
Yay, quote function works.

CNN International and BBC World Service are different animals from their domestic kin. If people see their reporting and it is backed up by their own and other media sources, Trump can scream fake all he wants but the rest of the world won't be buying it. They don't have to be biased, all they need are facts.

The problem being that trump simply doesn't care what foreigners have to say or think.  The USA has been playing nice for quite some time and a lot of people are in for a rude awakening.

Trump doesn't care if the things he puts out are fake.  If he keeps getting the media and the left to keep taking the bait, he makes the media and left look like people who aren't to be taken seriously. 

It's too bad that trump is such a meddler in the free market as otherwise it's nice to have the media and extreme leftisits start eating crow.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 04, 2017, 05:21:13 pm
The problem being that trump simply doesn't care what foreigners have to say or think.  The USA has been playing nice for quite some time and a lot of people are in for a rude awakening.

Trump doesn't care if the things he puts out are fake.  If he keeps getting the media and the left to keep taking the bait, he makes the media and left look like people who aren't to be taken seriously. 

It's too bad that trump is such a meddler in the free market as otherwise it's nice to have the media and extreme leftisits start eating crow.

If you live in a bubble and only watch FOX news, you would be quite correct. Trump may not care what the rest of the world thinks but the US is continually asking for support to legitimize its foreign adventures. Expect that support to dry up. His insulting the Australian PM is a good example. Australia has supported the US in every conflict since WW2, it had boots on the ground in Viet Nam and both Gulf wars. It still has troops in Afghanistan and is the US's biggest supporter against ISIL in the Middle East. What do they get but their head of government being trashed by Trump over a deal a US government made. "Make America Great" will become, "Make America Alone". All because of one single narcissist.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 04, 2017, 05:50:35 pm
If you live in a bubble and only watch FOX news, you would be quite correct. Trump may not care what the rest of the world thinks but the US is continually asking for support to legitimize its foreign adventures. Expect that support to dry up. His insulting the Australian PM is a good example. Australia has supported the US in every conflict since WW2, it had boots on the ground in Viet Nam and both Gulf wars. It still has troops in Afghanistan and is the US's biggest supporter against ISIL in the Middle East. What do they get but their head of government being trashed by Trump over a deal a US government made. "Make America Great" will become, "Make America Alone". All because of one single narcissist.

The last president was a narcissist too which makes trump replacing him all the more ironic.

Obama was also quite successful at pissing off his allies as well.  Obama didn't care and trump doesn't either.  Trump is wanting to show the American voters he is acting in their interests and not of foreign leaders.

The Americans wanted trump and they decided that they are willing to put up with his schtick if he gets their economy going.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 04, 2017, 07:38:30 pm
The last president was a narcissist too which makes trump replacing him all the more ironic.

Obama was also quite successful at pissing off his allies as well.  Obama didn't care and trump doesn't either.  Trump is wanting to show the American voters he is acting in their interests and not of foreign leaders.

The Americans wanted trump and they decided that they are willing to put up with his schtick if he gets their economy going.

A certain degree of narcissism is probably present in most leaders but comparing Obama to Trump as a narcissist is ridiculous. Name one box that Trump doesn't tick. The only thing I would question is bragging. There is nothing subtle about Trump's bragging.

Traits and signs of narcissism.


An obvious self-focus in interpersonal exchanges
Problems in sustaining satisfying relationships
A lack of psychological awareness (see insight in psychology and psychiatry, egosyntonic)
Difficulty with empathy
Problems distinguishing the self from others (see narcissism and boundaries)
Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults (see criticism and narcissists, narcissistic rage and narcissistic injury)
Vulnerability to shame rather than guilt
Haughty body language
Flattery towards people who admire and affirm them (narcissistic supply)
Detesting those who do not admire them (narcissistic abuse)
Using other people without considering the cost of doing so
Pretending to be more important than they actually are
Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements
Claiming to be an "expert" at many things
Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people
Denial of remorse and gratitude
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 04, 2017, 07:40:23 pm
It's all part of Trump's plan. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on February 04, 2017, 09:15:07 pm
The last president was a narcissist too which makes trump replacing him all the more ironic.

Obama was also quite successful at pissing off his allies as well.  Obama didn't care and trump doesn't either. 
That's like a terrible regurgitation of the "two equally terrible candidates" meme of the election. It was BS then too.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 04, 2017, 10:14:50 pm
That's like a terrible regurgitation of the "two equally terrible candidates" meme of the election. It was BS then too.

Lol that's not my problem the Americans are having trouble nominating candidates for president.  I was a walker and Rubio guy.

At least bill Clinton knew enough to work with congress.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 05, 2017, 10:56:44 am
Lol that's not my problem the Americans are having trouble nominating candidates for president.  I was a walker and Rubio guy.

At least bill Clinton knew enough to work with congress.
I wouldn't say they're having trouble. The people with the money and power are giving the peons a "choice" between their lapdogs. So they're not having trouble at all; it's the rest of America that's in trouble.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 05, 2017, 01:35:38 pm
David Axelrod wondering if the Churchill bust in the Oval office has demanded to be removed upon learning of Trump's likening US practices to Russian practices, has to be the tweet of the morning.

Nevermind this bizarro world where even the VP is unwilling to clearly state that the US is morally superior to Russia: https://twitter.com/ryanlizza/status/828293834253688832

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 05, 2017, 10:34:13 pm
The last president was a narcissist too which makes trump replacing him all the more ironic.

Obama was also quite successful at pissing off his allies as well.  Obama didn't care and trump doesn't either.  Trump is wanting to show the American voters he is acting in their interests and not of foreign leaders.

The Americans wanted trump and they decided that they are willing to put up with his schtick if he gets their economy going.

Obama couldn't hold a candle to Trump in terms of narcissism. Just ake a quick look back at the debates and you will see what I mean. And cozying up to Putin tends to counter your comment on foreign leaders. And tax cuts to the wealthy combined with huge spending plans, well, we'll see what effect that has on the economy. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 06, 2017, 02:16:10 pm
Any bad polls are fake news.  Any good polls are obviously not fake news.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 06, 2017, 02:34:38 pm
Obama couldn't hold a candle to Trump in terms of narcissism. Just ake a quick look back at the debates and you will see what I mean. And cozying up to Putin tends to counter your comment on foreign leaders. And tax cuts to the wealthy combined with huge spending plans, well, we'll see what effect that has on the economy.

Obama is narcissistic as is trump.  Full stop.

Trump is promising tax cuts across the board and looking at Ireland tax cuts seem to be working.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 06, 2017, 02:45:07 pm
Some of you have probably seen this Mencken quote from 1920, so has the land finally reached its hearts desire?

Quote
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 06, 2017, 03:05:49 pm
Now the media are not reporting terrorist attacks for "their own reasons."

Yes, it has come to this: if they are not fortunate enough to have a terrorist attack occur so they can justify policy then they will lie about them (Bowling Green Massacre) or tell lies about the media suppressing them.

Wilber is right that the morons have won.

Maybe we should hope so because the next step would be to have a black ops terrorist attack since the real terrorists and media are not cooperating with the state thus far (well, Fox and Breitbart are playing ball).
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Peter F on February 06, 2017, 03:57:04 pm
Now the media are not reporting terrorist attacks for "their own reasons."

Yes, it has come to this: if they are not fortunate enough to have a terrorist attack occur so they can justify policy then they will lie about them (Bowling Green Massacre) or tell lies about the media suppressing them.

'''

It's awful convenient for the 'We're in great danger!' people.  Even if you never hear about terrorist attacks know that they are happening all the time anyways!   Apparently it is unconstitutional or something for the state mention all these terror attacks once the MSM decree's they shall not be reported.  Even courts can't mention them it seems. Why the terrorists are running rampant and the poor helpless President can't do a thing about all that terrorist-stuff happening right now.  He tried the feeble ExOrder that would stop terrorists from flowing in for 90/120 days - which did nothing for all the terroristing that we don't hear about anymore - and a mere judge pulled the rug out from under that! Powerful man, that Prez.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 06, 2017, 03:58:40 pm
Now the media are not reporting terrorist attacks for "their own reasons."

Did he actually say terrorist attacks, or is he referring to the behavior of certain European media, police and governments to downplay Muslim crime, esp sexual attacks on non-Muslims, lest it be seen as racist, or cause people to think less highly of multiculturalism?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 06, 2017, 04:09:39 pm
Let me google that for you: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2017/02/06/president-trump-is-now-speculating-that-the-media-is-covering-up-terrorist-attacks/?utm_term=.8a069277da0b

There is even a video for all to see his lips move.

I would like to know which terrorist attacks have not been reported but it is far easier to claim some have not been reported than to demonstrate whoch have occurred and have been reported.

Perhaps that Bowling Green Massacre one Anne Conway keeps talking about to Cosmo Magazine and to TMZ?

You know that one, right? It's the one that never happened.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 06, 2017, 04:22:04 pm
Quote
Obama is narcissistic as is trump.

Really?  LOL

That comment actually made me laugh at my computer screen!   Your cognitive dissonance when it comes to Trump (or Obama) is hilarious!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 06, 2017, 09:29:16 pm
I'm saying they are both narcissistic. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 06, 2017, 09:41:10 pm
I'm saying they are both narcissistic.

I'd say one is a lot more so though, wouldn't you?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Peter F on February 06, 2017, 11:12:37 pm
Now the media are not reporting terrorist attacks for "their own reasons."

Yes, it has come to this: if they are not fortunate enough to have a terrorist attack occur so they can justify policy then they will lie about them (Bowling Green Massacre) or tell lies about the media suppressing them.

Wilber is right that the morons have won.

Maybe we should hope so because the next step would be to have a black ops terrorist attack since the real terrorists and media are not cooperating with the state thus far (well, Fox and Breitbart are playing ball).

and Here's the list of Under-reported terrorist attacks. Kindly provided by the white-house to NPR (amongst others)Here's the entire unedited list of 78 attacks from September 2014 to December 2016 provided by the White House:
[url]http://www.npr.org/2017/02/06/513777052/trump-says-media-fail-to-report-terrorist-attacks-white-house-promises-list/[url]
also Washington Post here: [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/02/06/here-are-the-78-terrorist-attacks-the-white-house-says-were-largely-under-reported/?utm_term=.76db65d70ec8/[url]

MELBOURNE, AUSTRALIA
September, 2014
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Abdul Numan Haider

TIZI OUZOU, ALGERIA
September, 2014
TARGET: One French citizen beheaded
ATTACKER: Jund al-Khilafah in Algeria

QUEBEC, CANADA
October, 2014
TARGET: One soldier killed and one wounded in vehicle attack
ATTACKER: Martin Couture-Rouleau

OTTAWA, CANADA
October, 2014
TARGET: One soldier killed at war memorial; two wounded in shootings at Parliament building
ATTACKER: Michael Zehaf-Bibeau

NEW YORK CITY, NY, USA
October, 2014
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: US person
RIYADH, SAUDI ARABIA
November, 2014
TARGET: One Danish citizen wounded in shooting
ATTACKERS: Three Saudi Arabia-based ISIL members

ABU DHABI, UAE
DATE: December 2014
TARGET: One American killed in knife attack
ATTACKER: Dalal al-Hashimi

SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA
December, 2014
TARGET: Two Australians killed in hostage taking and shooting
ATTACKER: Man Haron Monis

TOURS, FRANCE
December, 2014
TARGET: Three police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Bertrand Nzohabonayo

PARIS, FRANCE
January, 2015
TARGET: One police officer and four hostages killed in shooting at a kosher supermarket
ATTACKER: Amedy Coulibaly

TRIPOLI, LIBYA
January, 2015
TARGET: Ten killed, including one US citizen, and five wounded in bombing and shooting at a hotel frequented by westerners
ATTACKERS: As many as five ISIL-Libya members

RIYADH, SAUDI ARABIA
January, 2015
TARGET: Two US citizens wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Saudi Arabia-based ISIL supporter

NICE, FRANCE
February, 2015
TARGET: Two French soldiers wounded in knife attack outside a Jewish community center
ATTACKER: Moussa Coulibaly

COPENHAGEN, DENMARK
February, 2015
TARGET: One civilian killed in shooting at a free-speech rally and one security guard killed outside the city's main synagogue
ATTACKER: Omar Abdel Hamid el-Hussein

TUNIS, TUNISIA
March, 2015
TARGET: 21 tourists killed, including 16 westerners, and 55 wounded in shooting at the Bardo Museum
ATTACKERS: Two ISIL-aligned extremists

KARACHI, PAKISTAN
April, 2015
TARGET: One US citizen wounded in knife attack
ATTACKERS: Pakistan-based ISIL supporters

PARIS, FRANCE
April, 2015
TARGET: Catholic churches targeted; one civilian killed in shooting, possibly during an attempted carjacking
ATTACKER: Sid Ahmed Ghlam

ZVORNIK, BOSNIA
April, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed and two wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Nerdin Ibric

GARLAND, TX, USA
May, 2015
TARGET: One security guard wounded in shooting at the Prophet Muhammad cartoon event
ATTACKERS: Two US persons

BOSTON, MA, USA
June, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; one police officer attacked with knife
ATTACKER: US person

EL GORA (AL JURAH), EGYPT
June, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; camp used by Multinational Force and Observers (MFO) troops attacked in shooting and bombing attack
ATTACKERS: Unknown number of ISIL-Sinai members

LUXOR, EGYPT
June, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed by suicide bomb near the Temple of Karnak
ATTACKER: Unidentified

SOUSSE, TUNISIA
June, 2015
TARGET: 38 killed and 39 wounded in shooting at a beach frequented by westerners
ATTACKERS: Seifeddine Rezgui and another unidentified attacker

LYON, FRANCE
June, 2015
TARGET: One civilian killed in beheading and explosion at a chemical plant
ATTACKER: Yasin Salhi

CAIRO, EGYPT
July, 2015
TARGET: One killed and nine wounded in VBIED attack at Italian Consulate
ATTACKER: Unidentified ISIL operatives
CAIRO, EGYPT
July, 2015
TARGET: One Croatian national kidnapped; beheaded on August 12 at an unknown location
ATTACKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operative

PARIS, FRANCE
August, 2015
TARGET: Two civilians and one US soldier wounded with firearms and knife on a passenger train
ATTACKER: Ayoub el-Khazzani

EL GORA, EGYPT
September, 2015
TARGET: Four US and two MFO troops wounded in IED attack
ATTACKER: Unidentified

DHAKA, BANGLADESH
September, 2015
TARGET: One Italian civilian killed in shooting
ATTACKER: Unidentified

COPENHAGEN, DENMARK
September, 2015
TARGET: One police officer wounded in knife attack
ATTAKER: Palestinian national

EL GORA, EGYPT
October, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; airfield used by MFO attacked with rockets
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operatives

PARRAMATTA, AUSTRALIA
October, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Farhad Jabar

RANGPUR, BANGLADESH
October, 2015
TARGET: One Japanese civilian killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Unidentified

HASANAH, EGYPT
October, 2015
TARGET: 224 killed in downing of a Russian airliner
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operatives
MERCED, CA, US
November, 2015
TARGET: Four wounded in knife attack on a college campus
ATTAKER: US person

PARIS, FRANCE
November, 2015
TARGET: At least 129 killed and approximately 400 wounded in series of shootings and IED attacks
ATTAKERS: Brahim Abdelslam, Saleh Abdeslam, Ismail Mostefai, Bilal Hadfi, Samy Amimour, Chakib Ahrouh, Foued Mohamed Aggad, and Abdelhamid Abaaoud

DINAJPUR, BANGLADESH
November, 2015
TARGET: One Italian citizen wounded in shooting
ATTAKER: Unidentified

RAJLOVAC, BOSNIA
December, 2015
TARGET: Two Bosnian soldiers killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Enes Omeragic

SAN BERNADINO, CA, US
December, 2015
TARGET: 14 killed and 21 wounded in coordinated firearms attack
ATTAKERS: Two US persons

LONDON, ENGLAND, UK
December, 2015
TARGET: Three wounded in knife attack at an underground rail station
ATTAKER: Muhyadin Mire

DERBENT, RUSSIA
December, 2015
TARGET: One killed and 11 wounded in shooting at UN World Heritage site
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Caucasus operative

CAIRO, EGYPT
January, 2016
TARGET: Two wounded in drive-by shooting outside a hotel frequented by tourists
ATTAKERS: Unidentified ISIL operatives

PARIS, FRANCE
January, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; attacker killed after attempted knife attack on Paris police station
ATTAKER: Tarek Belgacem

PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA
January, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in shooting
ATTAKER: US person

HURGHADA, EGYPT
January, 2016
TARGET: One German and one Danish national wounded in knife attack at a tourist resort
ATTAKER: Unidentified

MARSEILLES, FRANCE
January, 2016
TARGET: One Jewish teacher wounded in machete attack
ATTAKER: 15 year-old Ethnic Kurd from Turkey

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
January, 2016
TARGET: 12 German tourists killed and 15 wounded in suicide bombing
ATTAKER: Nabil Fadli

JAKARTA, INDONESIA
January, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians killed and more than 20 wounded in coordinated bombing and firearms attacks near a police station and a Starbucks
ATTAKERS: Dian Joni Kurnaiadi, Muhammad Ali, Arif Sunakim, and Ahmad Muhazan bin Saron

COLUMBUS, OH, US
February, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians wounded in machete attack at a restaurant
ATTAKER: US person

HANOVER, GERMANY
February, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in knife attack
ATTAKER: Safia Schmitter

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
March, 2016
TARGET: Four killed and 36 wounded in suicide bombing in the tourist district
ATTAKER: Mehmet Ozturk

BRUSSELS, BELGIUM
March, 2016
TARGET: At least 31 killed and 270 wounded in coordinated bombings at Zaventem Airport and on a subway train
ATTAKERS: Khalid el-Bakraoui, Ibrahim el-Bakraoui, Najim Laachraoui, Mohammed Abrini, and Osama Krayem

ESSEN, GERMANY
April, 2016
TARGET: Three wounded in bombing at Sikh temple
ATTAKERS: Three identified minors

ORLANDO, FL, US
June, 2016
TARGET: 49 killed and 53 wounded in shooting at a nightclub
ATTAKER: US person

MAGNANVILLE, FRANCE
June, 2016
TARGET: One police officer and one civilian killed in knife attack
ATTAKER: Larossi Abballa

KABUL, AFGHANISTAN
June, 2016
TARGET: 14 killed in suicide attack on a bus carrying Canadian Embassy guards
ATTAKER: ISIL-Khorasan operative

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
June, 2016
TARGET: 45 killed and approximately 240 wounded at Ataturk International Airport
ATTACKERS: Rakhim Bulgarov, Vadim Osmanov, and an unidentified ISIL operative

DHAKA, BANGLADESH
July, 2016
TARGET: 22 killed, including one American and 50 wounded after hours-long siege using machetes and firearms at holy Artisan Bakery
ATTACKERS: Nibras Islam, Rohan Imtiaz, Meer Saameh Mubasheer, Khairul Islam Paye, and Shafiqul Islam Uzzal

NICE, FRANCE
July, 2016
TARGET: 84 civilians killed and 308 wounded by an individual who drove a truck into a crowd
ATTACKER: Mohamed Bouhlel

WURZBURG, GERMANY
July, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians wounded in axe attack on a train
ATTACKER: Riaz Khan Ahmadzai

ANSBACH, GERMANY
July, 2016
TARGET: At least 15 wounded in suicide bombing at a music festival
ATTACKER: Mohammad Daleel

NORMANDY, FRANCE
July, 2016
TARGET: One priest killed in knife attack
ATTACKERS: Adel Kermiche and Abdel Malik Nabil Petitjean

CHALEROI, BELGIUM
August, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in machete attack
ATTACKER: Khaled Babouri

QUEENSLAND, AUSTRALIA
August, 2016
TARGET: Two killed and one wounded in knife attack at a hostel frequented by Westerners
ATTACKER: Smail Ayad

COPENHAGEN, DENMAKR
September, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers and a civilian wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Mesa Hodzic

PARIS, FRANCE
September, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in raid after VBIED failed to detonate at Notre Dame Cathedral
ATTACKERS: Sarah Hervouet, Ines Madani, and Amel Sakaou

SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA
September, 2016
TARGET: One civilian wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Ihsas Khan

CLOUD, MN, US
September, 2016
TARGET: 10 wounded in knife attack in a mall
ATTACKER: Dahir Ahmed Adan

NEW YORK, NY; SEASIDE PARK AND ELIZABETH, NJ, US
September, 2016
TARGET: 31 wounded in bombing in New York City; several explosive devices found in New York and New Jersey; one exploded without casualty at race in New Jersey; one police officer wounded in shootout
ATTACKER: Ahmad Khan Rahami

BRUSSELS, BELGIUM
October, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in stabbing
ATTACKER: Belgian national

KUWAIT CITY, KUWAIT
TARGET: No casualties; vehicle carrying three US soldiers hit by a truck
ATTACKER: Ibrahim Sulayman

MALMO, SWEDEN
October, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; mosque and community center attacked with Molotov cocktail
ATTACKER: Syrian national

HAMBURG, GERMANY
October, 2016
TARGET: One killed in knife attack
ATTACKER: Unknown

MANILA, PHILIPPINES
November, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; failed IED attempt near US Embassy
ATTACKERS: Philippine nationals aligned with the Maute group

COLUMBUS, OH, US
November, 2016
TARGET: 14 wounded by individuals who drove a vehicle into a group of pedestrians and attacked them with a knife
ATTACKER: US person

N'DJAMENA, CHAD
November, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; attacker arrested after opening fire at entrance of US Embassy
ATTACKER: Chadian national

KARAK, JORDAN
December, 2016
TARGET: 10 killed and 28 wounded in shooting at a tourist site
ATTACKERS: Several gunmen

BERLIN, GERMANY
December, 2016
TARGET: 12 killed and 48 wounded by individual who drove truck into a crowded market
ATTACKER: Anis Amri
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Peter F on February 06, 2017, 11:13:59 pm
Holy Moly! These guys in the Whitehouse are absolutely Loopy!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 07, 2017, 12:23:54 am
I'm saying they are both narcissistic.

Obama was the first black dude to hold the highest office in the US, and he was far from narcissistic as one can get. Trump is probably the most narcissistic I can recall. Who but a narcissist would plant a raccoon on top of their head and then paint their skin orange, before talking about how cool it is to grab womens genitals? But there are dolts who buy this shyte.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 07, 2017, 12:41:27 am
Obama was the first black dude to hold the highest office in the US, and he was far from narcissistic as one can get. Trump is probably the most narcissistic I can recall. Who but a narcissist would plant a raccoon on top of their head and then paint their skin orange, before talking about how cool it is to grab womens genitals? But there are dolts who buy this shyte.

So because obama is black he gets a pass on narcissm?  Nobody is saying trump is not narcissistic.  I agree trump is narcissistic, however so is obama which makes it poetic justice that he got replaced by someone like Donald trump even though Rubio/walker would have been better.

You can google obama is narcissistic and find multiple articles.  If there's smoke there's fire...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 07, 2017, 08:07:49 am
You can google obama is narcissistic and find multiple articles.  If there's smoke there's fire...
I can Google "Elvis Lives" or "Sasquatch Sighted" and get a bunch of articles too.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on February 07, 2017, 12:32:29 pm

PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA
January, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in shooting
ATTAKER: US person

HURGHADA, EGYPT
January, 2016
TARGET: One German and one Danish national wounded in knife attack at a tourist resort
ATTAKER: Unidentified

MARSEILLES, FRANCE
January, 2016
TARGET: One Jewish teacher wounded in machete attack
ATTAKER: 15 year-old Ethnic Kurd from Turkey

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
January, 2016
TARGET: 12 German tourists killed and 15 wounded in suicide bombing
ATTAKER: Nabil Fadli

JAKARTA, INDONESIA
January, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians killed and more than 20 wounded in coordinated bombing and firearms attacks near a police station and a Starbucks
ATTAKERS: Dian Joni Kurnaiadi, Muhammad Ali, Arif Sunakim, and Ahmad Muhazan bin Saron
That's not how you spell attacker.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 07, 2017, 04:27:45 pm
and Here's the list of Under-reported terrorist attacks. Kindly provided by the white-house to NPR (amongst others)Here's the entire unedited list of 78 attacks from September 2014 to December 2016 provided by the White House:
[url]http://www.npr.org/2017/02/06/513777052/trump-says-media-fail-to-report-terrorist-attacks-white-house-promises-list/[url]
also Washington Post here: [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/02/06/here-are-the-78-terrorist-attacks-the-white-house-says-were-largely-under-reported/?utm_term=.76db65d70ec8/[url]

MELBOURNE, AUSTRALIA
September, 2014
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Abdul Numan Haider

TIZI OUZOU, ALGERIA
September, 2014
TARGET: One French citizen beheaded
ATTACKER: Jund al-Khilafah in Algeria

QUEBEC, CANADA
October, 2014
TARGET: One soldier killed and one wounded in vehicle attack
ATTACKER: Martin Couture-Rouleau

OTTAWA, CANADA
October, 2014
TARGET: One soldier killed at war memorial; two wounded in shootings at Parliament building
ATTACKER: Michael Zehaf-Bibeau

NEW YORK CITY, NY, USA
October, 2014
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: US person
RIYADH, SAUDI ARABIA
November, 2014
TARGET: One Danish citizen wounded in shooting
ATTACKERS: Three Saudi Arabia-based ISIL members

ABU DHABI, UAE
DATE: December 2014
TARGET: One American killed in knife attack
ATTACKER: Dalal al-Hashimi

SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA
December, 2014
TARGET: Two Australians killed in hostage taking and shooting
ATTACKER: Man Haron Monis

TOURS, FRANCE
December, 2014
TARGET: Three police officers wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Bertrand Nzohabonayo

PARIS, FRANCE
January, 2015
TARGET: One police officer and four hostages killed in shooting at a kosher supermarket
ATTACKER: Amedy Coulibaly

TRIPOLI, LIBYA
January, 2015
TARGET: Ten killed, including one US citizen, and five wounded in bombing and shooting at a hotel frequented by westerners
ATTACKERS: As many as five ISIL-Libya members

RIYADH, SAUDI ARABIA
January, 2015
TARGET: Two US citizens wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Saudi Arabia-based ISIL supporter

NICE, FRANCE
February, 2015
TARGET: Two French soldiers wounded in knife attack outside a Jewish community center
ATTACKER: Moussa Coulibaly

COPENHAGEN, DENMARK
February, 2015
TARGET: One civilian killed in shooting at a free-speech rally and one security guard killed outside the city's main synagogue
ATTACKER: Omar Abdel Hamid el-Hussein

TUNIS, TUNISIA
March, 2015
TARGET: 21 tourists killed, including 16 westerners, and 55 wounded in shooting at the Bardo Museum
ATTACKERS: Two ISIL-aligned extremists

KARACHI, PAKISTAN
April, 2015
TARGET: One US citizen wounded in knife attack
ATTACKERS: Pakistan-based ISIL supporters

PARIS, FRANCE
April, 2015
TARGET: Catholic churches targeted; one civilian killed in shooting, possibly during an attempted carjacking
ATTACKER: Sid Ahmed Ghlam

ZVORNIK, BOSNIA
April, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed and two wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Nerdin Ibric

GARLAND, TX, USA
May, 2015
TARGET: One security guard wounded in shooting at the Prophet Muhammad cartoon event
ATTACKERS: Two US persons

BOSTON, MA, USA
June, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; one police officer attacked with knife
ATTACKER: US person

EL GORA (AL JURAH), EGYPT
June, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; camp used by Multinational Force and Observers (MFO) troops attacked in shooting and bombing attack
ATTACKERS: Unknown number of ISIL-Sinai members

LUXOR, EGYPT
June, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed by suicide bomb near the Temple of Karnak
ATTACKER: Unidentified

SOUSSE, TUNISIA
June, 2015
TARGET: 38 killed and 39 wounded in shooting at a beach frequented by westerners
ATTACKERS: Seifeddine Rezgui and another unidentified attacker

LYON, FRANCE
June, 2015
TARGET: One civilian killed in beheading and explosion at a chemical plant
ATTACKER: Yasin Salhi

CAIRO, EGYPT
July, 2015
TARGET: One killed and nine wounded in VBIED attack at Italian Consulate
ATTACKER: Unidentified ISIL operatives
CAIRO, EGYPT
July, 2015
TARGET: One Croatian national kidnapped; beheaded on August 12 at an unknown location
ATTACKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operative

PARIS, FRANCE
August, 2015
TARGET: Two civilians and one US soldier wounded with firearms and knife on a passenger train
ATTACKER: Ayoub el-Khazzani

EL GORA, EGYPT
September, 2015
TARGET: Four US and two MFO troops wounded in IED attack
ATTACKER: Unidentified

DHAKA, BANGLADESH
September, 2015
TARGET: One Italian civilian killed in shooting
ATTACKER: Unidentified

COPENHAGEN, DENMARK
September, 2015
TARGET: One police officer wounded in knife attack
ATTAKER: Palestinian national

EL GORA, EGYPT
October, 2015
TARGET: No casualties; airfield used by MFO attacked with rockets
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operatives

PARRAMATTA, AUSTRALIA
October, 2015
TARGET: One police officer killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Farhad Jabar

RANGPUR, BANGLADESH
October, 2015
TARGET: One Japanese civilian killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Unidentified

HASANAH, EGYPT
October, 2015
TARGET: 224 killed in downing of a Russian airliner
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Sinai operatives
MERCED, CA, US
November, 2015
TARGET: Four wounded in knife attack on a college campus
ATTAKER: US person

PARIS, FRANCE
November, 2015
TARGET: At least 129 killed and approximately 400 wounded in series of shootings and IED attacks
ATTAKERS: Brahim Abdelslam, Saleh Abdeslam, Ismail Mostefai, Bilal Hadfi, Samy Amimour, Chakib Ahrouh, Foued Mohamed Aggad, and Abdelhamid Abaaoud

DINAJPUR, BANGLADESH
November, 2015
TARGET: One Italian citizen wounded in shooting
ATTAKER: Unidentified

RAJLOVAC, BOSNIA
December, 2015
TARGET: Two Bosnian soldiers killed in shooting
ATTAKER: Enes Omeragic

SAN BERNADINO, CA, US
December, 2015
TARGET: 14 killed and 21 wounded in coordinated firearms attack
ATTAKERS: Two US persons

LONDON, ENGLAND, UK
December, 2015
TARGET: Three wounded in knife attack at an underground rail station
ATTAKER: Muhyadin Mire

DERBENT, RUSSIA
December, 2015
TARGET: One killed and 11 wounded in shooting at UN World Heritage site
ATTAKER: Unidentified ISIL-Caucasus operative

CAIRO, EGYPT
January, 2016
TARGET: Two wounded in drive-by shooting outside a hotel frequented by tourists
ATTAKERS: Unidentified ISIL operatives

PARIS, FRANCE
January, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; attacker killed after attempted knife attack on Paris police station
ATTAKER: Tarek Belgacem

PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA
January, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in shooting
ATTAKER: US person

HURGHADA, EGYPT
January, 2016
TARGET: One German and one Danish national wounded in knife attack at a tourist resort
ATTAKER: Unidentified

MARSEILLES, FRANCE
January, 2016
TARGET: One Jewish teacher wounded in machete attack
ATTAKER: 15 year-old Ethnic Kurd from Turkey

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
January, 2016
TARGET: 12 German tourists killed and 15 wounded in suicide bombing
ATTAKER: Nabil Fadli

JAKARTA, INDONESIA
January, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians killed and more than 20 wounded in coordinated bombing and firearms attacks near a police station and a Starbucks
ATTAKERS: Dian Joni Kurnaiadi, Muhammad Ali, Arif Sunakim, and Ahmad Muhazan bin Saron

COLUMBUS, OH, US
February, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians wounded in machete attack at a restaurant
ATTAKER: US person

HANOVER, GERMANY
February, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in knife attack
ATTAKER: Safia Schmitter

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
March, 2016
TARGET: Four killed and 36 wounded in suicide bombing in the tourist district
ATTAKER: Mehmet Ozturk

BRUSSELS, BELGIUM
March, 2016
TARGET: At least 31 killed and 270 wounded in coordinated bombings at Zaventem Airport and on a subway train
ATTAKERS: Khalid el-Bakraoui, Ibrahim el-Bakraoui, Najim Laachraoui, Mohammed Abrini, and Osama Krayem

ESSEN, GERMANY
April, 2016
TARGET: Three wounded in bombing at Sikh temple
ATTAKERS: Three identified minors

ORLANDO, FL, US
June, 2016
TARGET: 49 killed and 53 wounded in shooting at a nightclub
ATTAKER: US person

MAGNANVILLE, FRANCE
June, 2016
TARGET: One police officer and one civilian killed in knife attack
ATTAKER: Larossi Abballa

KABUL, AFGHANISTAN
June, 2016
TARGET: 14 killed in suicide attack on a bus carrying Canadian Embassy guards
ATTAKER: ISIL-Khorasan operative

ISTANBUL, TURKEY
June, 2016
TARGET: 45 killed and approximately 240 wounded at Ataturk International Airport
ATTACKERS: Rakhim Bulgarov, Vadim Osmanov, and an unidentified ISIL operative

DHAKA, BANGLADESH
July, 2016
TARGET: 22 killed, including one American and 50 wounded after hours-long siege using machetes and firearms at holy Artisan Bakery
ATTACKERS: Nibras Islam, Rohan Imtiaz, Meer Saameh Mubasheer, Khairul Islam Paye, and Shafiqul Islam Uzzal

NICE, FRANCE
July, 2016
TARGET: 84 civilians killed and 308 wounded by an individual who drove a truck into a crowd
ATTACKER: Mohamed Bouhlel

WURZBURG, GERMANY
July, 2016
TARGET: Four civilians wounded in axe attack on a train
ATTACKER: Riaz Khan Ahmadzai

ANSBACH, GERMANY
July, 2016
TARGET: At least 15 wounded in suicide bombing at a music festival
ATTACKER: Mohammad Daleel

NORMANDY, FRANCE
July, 2016
TARGET: One priest killed in knife attack
ATTACKERS: Adel Kermiche and Abdel Malik Nabil Petitjean

CHALEROI, BELGIUM
August, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in machete attack
ATTACKER: Khaled Babouri

QUEENSLAND, AUSTRALIA
August, 2016
TARGET: Two killed and one wounded in knife attack at a hostel frequented by Westerners
ATTACKER: Smail Ayad

COPENHAGEN, DENMAKR
September, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers and a civilian wounded in shooting
ATTACKER: Mesa Hodzic

PARIS, FRANCE
September, 2016
TARGET: One police officer wounded in raid after VBIED failed to detonate at Notre Dame Cathedral
ATTACKERS: Sarah Hervouet, Ines Madani, and Amel Sakaou

SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA
September, 2016
TARGET: One civilian wounded in knife attack
ATTACKER: Ihsas Khan

CLOUD, MN, US
September, 2016
TARGET: 10 wounded in knife attack in a mall
ATTACKER: Dahir Ahmed Adan

NEW YORK, NY; SEASIDE PARK AND ELIZABETH, NJ, US
September, 2016
TARGET: 31 wounded in bombing in New York City; several explosive devices found in New York and New Jersey; one exploded without casualty at race in New Jersey; one police officer wounded in shootout
ATTACKER: Ahmad Khan Rahami

BRUSSELS, BELGIUM
October, 2016
TARGET: Two police officers wounded in stabbing
ATTACKER: Belgian national

KUWAIT CITY, KUWAIT
TARGET: No casualties; vehicle carrying three US soldiers hit by a truck
ATTACKER: Ibrahim Sulayman

MALMO, SWEDEN
October, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; mosque and community center attacked with Molotov cocktail
ATTACKER: Syrian national

HAMBURG, GERMANY
October, 2016
TARGET: One killed in knife attack
ATTACKER: Unknown

MANILA, PHILIPPINES
November, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; failed IED attempt near US Embassy
ATTACKERS: Philippine nationals aligned with the Maute group

COLUMBUS, OH, US
November, 2016
TARGET: 14 wounded by individuals who drove a vehicle into a group of pedestrians and attacked them with a knife
ATTACKER: US person

N'DJAMENA, CHAD
November, 2016
TARGET: No casualties; attacker arrested after opening fire at entrance of US Embassy
ATTACKER: Chadian national

KARAK, JORDAN
December, 2016
TARGET: 10 killed and 28 wounded in shooting at a tourist site
ATTACKERS: Several gunmen

BERLIN, GERMANY
December, 2016
TARGET: 12 killed and 48 wounded by individual who drove truck into a crowded market
ATTACKER: Anis Amri

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/02/07/usa-today-white-house-donald-trump-terrorist-attacks/97584176/
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 07, 2017, 06:18:35 pm
The media have been covering up that murder is at a 47 year high in the United States!

Damn MSM! They can't be trusted!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 07, 2017, 07:13:13 pm
Damn MSM! They can't be trusted!

FBI neither, since that is based on their UCR data.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 07, 2017, 11:02:47 pm
Trump complains about the media not talking about terrorist attacks...

Meanwhile, no mention from the WH about the terrorist attack at a mosque in Quebec. 

Guess Trump doesn't want to gloat and take credit for inspiring the attack?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on February 07, 2017, 11:40:43 pm
So because obama is black he gets a pass on narcissm?  Nobody is saying trump is not narcissistic.  I agree trump is narcissistic, however so is obama which makes it poetic justice that he got replaced by someone like Donald trump even though Rubio/walker would have been better.

You can google obama is narcissistic and find multiple articles.  If there's smoke there's fire...

You make a claim and 'google it' is your argument?  How about you explain it to us.

Here's an example - Trump is a narcissist because...

He creates one monstrosity after another and immortalizes them with his name.  He has created his palace in the sky with everything gold plated and in the style of a dead gluttonous french King.  He believes the rules don't apply to him, and he doesn't have to release taxes or pay attention to other branches of government.  He is obsessed with his image and agonizes over what SNL says about him.  He has referred to himself in the third person. 

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 08, 2017, 12:27:20 am
Meanwhile, no mention from the WH about the terrorist attack at a mosque in Quebec. 

Guess Trump doesn't want to gloat and take credit for inspiring the attack?

Sorry BC_cheque but the above is proof that Trump is not a narcissist.  ;D
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 08, 2017, 09:35:29 am
The media have been covering up that murder is at a 47 year high in the United States!

Damn MSM! They can't be trusted!

This goes back to Newt Gingrich's "feelings vs facts" thing.  The irony is Trump claiming that the media is trying to cover up violent crime, when the primary reason that people feel less safe is heavy media coverage of violent crime.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnhJWusyj4I

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 08, 2017, 03:33:42 pm
If Donald Trump tweets in the woods, and no one listens, does it really matter?

Investors didn't have much of a reaction to the U.S. president's latest Twitter tirade on Wednesday, as shares in retailer Nordstrom, which Donald Trump accused of treating his daughter unfairly, barely budged.

"My daughter Ivanka has been treated so unfairly by @Nordstrom. She is a great person — always pushing me to do the right thing! Terrible," Trump said.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/nordstrom-trump-tweet-1.3972337
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 08, 2017, 03:39:25 pm
If Donald Trump tweets in the woods, and no one listens, does it really matter?

Investors didn't have much of a reaction to the U.S. president's latest Twitter tirade on Wednesday, as shares in retailer Nordstrom, which Donald Trump accused of treating his daughter unfairly, barely budged.

"My daughter Ivanka has been treated so unfairly by @Nordstrom. She is a great person — always pushing me to do the right thing! Terrible," Trump said.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/nordstrom-trump-tweet-1.3972337

Nordstrom is a  high end retailer. I would wager most of Trump's ardent followers have barely heard of the place, and certainly don't shop there.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 08, 2017, 03:51:41 pm
A tweet like that would heave really unsettled the markets two weeks ago.  Today, no one really cares.  We've already come to that point.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 08, 2017, 05:19:37 pm
Nordstrom is a  high end retailer. I would wager most of Trump's ardent followers have barely heard of the place, and certainly don't shop there.

Nordstorm? Isn`t that the French Canadian company that makes a sou'wester?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 08, 2017, 05:23:31 pm
Today Donald Trump's pick for the SCOTUS spoke out against his attack on the 9th circuit judge that ruled against his ban:

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/318573-trump-scotus-pick-called-the-presidents-attack-on-judiciary
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 08, 2017, 05:26:17 pm
Trump bashes Nordstrom on Twitter, stock jumps 2%.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 09, 2017, 12:19:11 pm
Trump's surrogates continue to make up fake terrorist attacks to justify their twisted ideology.

http://www.newsy.com/stories/spicer-cites-attack-by-foreign-nationals-that-didn-t-happen/?utm_content=inf_11_3490_2&utm_source=whm_fb&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=influencers&tse_id=INF_0c866b80eeeb11e6a03c354c456e1db2
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 09, 2017, 01:19:31 pm
No longer good enough to just ignore attacks by white supremacists, now they are blaming them on someone else.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 09, 2017, 05:35:31 pm
You make a claim and 'google it' is your argument?  How about you explain it to us.

Here's an example - Trump is a narcissist because...

He creates one monstrosity after another and immortalizes them with his name.  He has created his palace in the sky with everything gold plated and in the style of a dead gluttonous french King.  He believes the rules don't apply to him, and he doesn't have to release taxes or pay attention to other branches of government.  He is obsessed with his image and agonizes over what SNL says about him.  He has referred to himself in the third person.

http://www.dailywire.com/news/12724/press-concerned-trump-insecure-narcissist-here-are-aaron-bandler

A case for narcissism
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on February 10, 2017, 03:51:53 pm
A link is no better than 'google it'.

Can't you form your own arguments?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 10, 2017, 03:59:15 pm
A link is no better than 'google it'.

Can't you form your own arguments?

I was saying that a google search showed multiple hits of how obama can be a narcissist, then I showed a link with a page with points showing how they think obama is a narcissist.  Like I said if there's smoke there's fire. I also said trump is a narcissist as well.  With a number of articles articulating why obama is a narcissist I can reasonably suggest that obama is in fact a narcissist as is trump.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 10, 2017, 08:32:02 pm
Now Putin is offering up Snowden to distract from the fact that Flynn is as traitorous as Trump: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/official-flynn-sanctions-talk-russia-45400179

And : https://www.engadget.com/2017/02/10/nbc-russia-considers-sending-snowden-back-to-us/

But, um, yeah, keep discussing who the bigger narcissist is....  ;D  ::)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 10, 2017, 10:34:05 pm
Now Putin is offering up Snowden to distract from the fact that Flynn is as traitorous as Trump: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/official-flynn-sanctions-talk-russia-45400179

And : https://www.engadget.com/2017/02/10/nbc-russia-considers-sending-snowden-back-to-us/

But, um, yeah, keep discussing who the bigger narcissist is....  ;D  ::)

The more the left keeps crying wolf, the less voters take them seriously...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 12:32:04 am
 A majority of Americans are smart (smrt!) enough to know that the world is laughing at them:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/203834/americans-world-standing-worst-decade.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication

29% of Americans think world leaders respect Trump. ( Hint: no, world leaders think he is a jack ass).
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 01:18:17 am
Tonight Imwas reminded that Trump would like to put an American company (Nordstrom) out of business because they won't peddle his daughters clothes which are made in China. 

No wonder the world is laughing. Whatta Joke!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 11, 2017, 03:17:26 am
https://www.google.ca/amp/thehill.com/homenews/media/318514-trump-admin-seen-as-more-truthful-than-news-media-poll%3Famp?client=safari

😬  You know it's bad when trump is more trusted than the media...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 11, 2017, 03:20:32 am
A majority of Americans are smart (smrt!) enough to know that the world is laughing at them:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/203834/americans-world-standing-worst-decade.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication

29% of Americans think world leaders respect Trump. ( Hint: no, world leaders think he is a jack ass).

Yet Shinzo Abe has been to the USA twice to cement relations with trump.  Doesn't seem like Abe is wanting to get on his bad side.  America doesn't have to be liked, obama tried that and it was a disaster.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 11, 2017, 05:02:24 am
Trump thinks he knows more about everything than everybody and keeps presenting flat-out false information to support his claims of greatness.  But, Obama said "I" a lot in his speeches. So, they're both narcissists... one's the same as the other.

This is a textbook example of false equivalency.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 08:52:17 am
Yet Shinzo Abe has been to the USA twice to cement relations with trump.  Doesn't seem like Abe is wanting to get on his bad side.  America doesn't have to be liked, obama tried that and it was a disaster.

It is not about being liked. It is about being respected. One can be loved and respected or feared and respected.

Trump is mocked and not respected because he is a joke.

Lets hope that he doesn't turn people's views of the US into assuming: joke Prez, joke country.

Because when that happens is when you will see wars and other significant challenges to American hegemony and I would prefer that to not happen in my lifetime.

At least Trump was wise enough to come back to the "one China" policy after his earlier gaffe with Taiwan.

Xi put him in his place, probably gently like Sun Tzu would have taught him to.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 08:55:04 am
Trump thinks he knows more about everything than everybody...
 -k

This is known as the Dunning-Kruger effect: The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which low-ability individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly assessing their ability as much higher than it really is.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on February 11, 2017, 09:18:07 am
The more the left keeps crying wolf, the less voters take them seriously...
You just said that where there's smoke there's fire. How about where there is a corroborated dossier?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 09:21:42 am
Think this sums up Trump so far:

 
https://mobile.twitter.com/IvanTheK/status/830406704923869184/photo/1


Except one could exchange Trump's quote with so many others: Grab women by the pussy....


Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 11, 2017, 10:44:16 am
This is known as the Dunning-Kruger effect: The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which low-ability individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly assessing their ability as much higher than it really is.
This effect has a lot more to it than that. You don't have to be low ability in general, it just means not having the necessary skills for a particular task or position. The added problem with DKE is that these individuals don't seek out new knowledge or ways to improve because they think to themselves, "I've got this" when really they don't. Confirmation bias then comes into play; they'll only look at things that confirm their ability and dismiss anything that suggests they're struggling or incapable.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 11, 2017, 12:53:01 pm
You just said that where there's smoke there's fire. How about where there is a corroborated dossier?

There's a difference between smoke and crying wolf all the time.  The media has a 39% believability vs 49% for trump. 

Are people talking about the dossier now?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 11, 2017, 12:56:44 pm
There's a difference between smoke and crying wolf all the time.  The media has a 39% believability vs 49% for trump. 

Are people talking about the dossier now?
That says more about the survey respondents themselves than the media.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 11, 2017, 05:29:51 pm
I have stated on another forum that if Trump was elected then I would enjoy certain things about his election.

The SNL comedy, for example.

Watching people freak out as they discover "Obama care" is really ACA is another.  And, no, I don't feel bad for people losing healthcare to the extent that if they voted for Trump then too bad, so very very sad.

Abortion rights and planned parenthood - same thing. I support a woman's right to choose (up to 9 months for all I care) but, again, if you're a woman who couldn't understand that Trump and Clinton were not morally equivalent then too bad, so sad.

Here we see rural areas that may get screwed over from Trump: http://money.cnn.com/2017/02/10/news/economy/visa-ban-rural-doctor-shortage/index.html

Again, too bad, so sad, go forth and multipy with yourself.

Don't like it? Then vote next time or vote for a better candidate.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 11, 2017, 07:42:28 pm
Trying to add a picture, did not go as expected

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 13, 2017, 09:55:45 pm
I will add to my list of "too bad, so sad, go forth and multiply with yourself" this:

Allegedly some guy in Texas building a $1.5 million boathouse has hit a dely because some of his workers have been deported.

Awww, poor guy.

When I was in Cambodia in December, our tour leader mentioned how Thailand kicked out tens of thousands of Cambodians.

A year later they were all back and thankfully so: the Thai economy required their cheap labour.

Trump's America will figure this out too. But how long?

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 13, 2017, 10:19:39 pm
I will add to my list of "too bad, so sad, go forth and multiply with yourself" this:

Allegedly some guy in Texas building a $1.5 million boathouse has hit a dely because some of his workers have been deported.

Awww, poor guy.

When I was in Cambodia in December, our tour leader mentioned how Thailand kicked out tens of thousands of Cambodians.

A year later they were all back and thankfully so: the Thai economy required their cheap labour.

Trump's America will figure this out too. But how long?

When the prices for stuff rise.

It's a delicate balancing act as we have now seen what happens when an economy indebts itself so much that it is needing to put caps on foreigners and foreign made goods as a matter of national security as being indebted like they have been has been troublesome.  They are literally trying any solution to get their economy churning again. Protectionism is their latest experiment.

It's a curious experiment to balance the national security of making products while balancing investing in other countries to expand markets and get a return on capital.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 13, 2017, 10:22:44 pm
Russian spy Michael Flynn has resigned.  Maybe some sanity is taking over?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 13, 2017, 10:23:00 pm
Putin has accepted Flynn's resignation....

Man, what a gong show.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 13, 2017, 10:25:50 pm
Americans didn't care about Trudeau.  Probably best for them not to as they have to compare competence.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 14, 2017, 02:16:39 am
Americans didn't care about Trudeau.  Probably best for them not to as they have to compare competence.

As foolish as Trudeau is, he knew enough to not poke the bear and will just let trump do his thing and worry about Canada which will net him another election win.

The media can actually take a lesson from Trudeau as much as that pains me to say.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 14, 2017, 11:09:13 pm
Tonight I wonder two things:

1) Why did the FBI not warn about this Russian crap like they did with "the letter?"

2) Does Putin have buyers remorse?

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 15, 2017, 06:40:17 am
1) Why did the FBI not warn about this Russian crap like they did with "the letter?"
Probably because Comey is in their pockets too.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 15, 2017, 09:52:16 am
Something I read regarding Comey's handling of the Weiner situation (lol!) is that Rudy Giuliani gave Comey an ultimatum that either Comey goes public with it, or Rudy's friends in the New York office of the FBI would leak it.  That information was getting out there... Rudy gave Comey the choice of how. I think that was sourced from "anonymous sources", so take it with a grain of salt, obviously.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 16, 2017, 05:15:30 am
Here's a recap of Trump's first month courtesy of a Reddit user.

* Declared the “court system” a threat to national security.

* Insisted that his Supreme Court pick had no problem with attacks on the judiciary, in the face of blatant evidence to the contrary.

* Trashed New START during a call with Putin — after putting the phone aside to ask his advisers what that (nuclear-arms treaty) was.

* Publicly condemned a private company for dropping his daughter’s (increasingly unpopular) fashion line.

* Suggested that publicly criticizing his military decisions is tantamount to aiding “the enemy.”

* Got angry at his press secretary for being impersonated by a woman.

* Used the executive branch’s immense authority over border control to inflict arbitrary cruelty on thousands of Muslim immigrants, create chaos at airports all across America, and sour diplomatic relations with the rest of the world.

* Violated court orders against his travel ban.

* Created a diplomatic crisis with Australia — and threatened to invade Mexico.

* Allowed his press secretary to falsely claim that Iran had committed an act of war against the United States.

* Retained the author of a reactionary screed that likened the 2016 election to Flight 93 as a national-security staffer.

* Suggested that Frederick Douglass is still alive in speech on Black History Month.

* Told a demonstrable lie about the size of the crowd at his inauguration — and predicted that the media would “pay a big price” for refusing to repeat it.

* Told congressional leaders at a private meeting that he only lost the popular vote because undocumented immigrants cast millions of ballots against him.

* Suggested America might once again have the opportunity to confiscate Iraq’s oil.

* Allowed his company to leverage the cachet of his election into a massive expansion of its hotel empire.

* Ordered the Department of Homeland Security to issue a weekly list of crimes (allegedly) committed by undocumented immigrants in sanctuary cities.

* Prepared to radically reduce American funding to the United Nations.

* Signed a bevy of executive orders that were drafted by the White House’s Breitbart wing — and no one else.

* Declared that his election had restored American democracy, in an angry, authoritarian inaugural address.

* Replaced the White House website’s page on climate change with a vow to drill for oil on federal lands.

* Defamed a hero of the civil-rights movement in a series of racist tweets.

* llowed his secretary of State nominee to pledge that America would block China’s access to its disputed islands in the South China Sea — a promise that, if kept, would almost certainly mean war.

* Named his son-in-law a senior White House adviser, in defiance of norms (and, very likely, laws) against nepotism.

* Called NATO obsolete.

* Repeatedly denigrated America’s intelligence agencies, then leaked plans to downsize them.

* Declared his openness to reviving a nuclear arms race.

* Disparaged the sitting American president, while praising a hostile foreign autocrat.

* Continued to use Twitter as a tool for souring diplomatic relations with the world’s second-greatest power.

* Named a billionaire investor — with an enormous, personal financial interest in deregulating certain sectors of the economy — as his special adviser on regulatory reform.

* Declared the American intelligence community to be inherently untrustworthy, after it produced information that he did not like.

* Said he would continue skipping daily intelligence briefings when he becomes president because he’s smart enough to get by without them.

* Said he doesn’t know why he should be bound by the One China Policy.

* Invited his adult sons — who are slated to run the Trump Organization next year — to a policy meeting with the leading lights of Silicon Valley.

* Picked a man who once tried to call for the abolition of the Energy Department — but couldn’t remember the department’s name — as secretary of Energy.

* Named his bankruptcy lawyer — who thinks liberal Jews are “worse” than Nazi collaborators — as his pick for ambassador to Israel.

* Provoked heightened diplomatic tensions with two nuclear-armed states.

* Handed the Environmental Protection Agency to a climate denialist.

* Handed the Labor Department to a serial violator of labor law. Although he quit like a loser today.

* Requested security clearance for a conspiracy theorist who claims that the Clintons operate a Satanic child-sex ring out of a popular D.C. pizzeria.

* Questioned the legitimacy of the election he just won.

* Appointed Ben Carson secretary of Housing and Urban Development — despite the fact that Carson has no relevant experience and recently declared himself unqualified for any cabinet position.

* Allowed his D.C. hotel to actively court the patronage of foreign diplomats.

* Invited the manager of his blind trust onto a phone call with the president of Argentina.

* Met with Indian business partners who have publicly declared their intention to capitalize on his status as president-elect.

* Tried to coerce Britain into appointing a right-wing extremist as its ambassador to the United States.

* Berated the media at a closed-door meeting for publishing unflattering photos of his double chin.

* Admitted that his charity was guilty of self-dealing.

* Derided protestors as paid professionals whose acts of free speech are fundamentally “unfair.”

* Invited the manager of his “blind trust” to a meeting with the prime minister of Japan.

* Assembled a team of racists to lead his White House.

* Took credit for the fact that Ford will not be relocating a plant to Mexico (which they never had any intention of relocating to Mexico).

* Declared America’s leading newspaper a “failing” institution.

* Took calls from foreign leaders on unsecured phone lines, without consulting the State Department.

* Referred to his White House transition as though it were the next season of The Apprentice.

http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/5ubnzs/admit_it_trump_is_unfit_to_serve/ddt81h7
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 16, 2017, 05:20:35 am
And let's not forget the raid in Yemen

http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/5ubnzs/admit_it_trump_is_unfit_to_serve/ddt43oi

It's noteworthy that, while making the case that Trump is unfit to serve, they didn't even mention Trump's fiasco in Yemen.  Let's go over that one again.

The Obama administration had been contemplating a raid in Yemen.  To gather intel?  To capture or kill an ISIS leader?  Who knows.  They never committed to executing the raid because they determined it was too dangerous.

Trump becomes the (p)Resident and some knucklehead in his administration convinces him to go for it.  Aaaaaaaaaaaand it proved to be too dangerous.

* A U.S. Navy Seal was killed during the raid.

* 23 civilians were killed, including women and children.

* U.S. servicemen were injured during the raid.

* A 75 Million Dollar U.S. aircraft was destroyed.  In fact, it had to be destroyed by the U.S. military, meaning, we paid for the missile used to destroy our own $75 million aircraft.  *Awesome!?*  ...oh, hell no.

Shortly after the raid, a press conference was scheduled to show off a key piece of intel gathered during the raid.  A video.  It was quickly debunked as being at least 10 years old and already available on the goddamn mother fucking internet.

For me, the most amazing aspect of the raid in Yemen is that Trump didn't even go to the situation room to be briefed before approving the raid.  What was Trumple Thinskin so busy doing that he couldn't be thoroughly briefed in order to make the best possible decision?

**...He was eating.**

And here's a question nobody seems to have asked about the Yemen raid: Who actually WAS in the Situation Room for the Yemen raid?  Was it Skeletor himself, Steve Bannon?

There's a lot of talk about Trump being a Russian Puppet, but there's more than one hand up that clown's ass making his fish faced mouth move.  Trump is just as much Bannon's puppet, and lives have already been lost because of it.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 16, 2017, 08:21:13 am
It has surprised me that the raid in Yemen has had so little coverage, especially given that a US soldier was killed.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 16, 2017, 08:42:09 am
Meanwhile, Benghazi.....
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 16, 2017, 09:17:18 pm
2017 - "I have nothing to do with Russia"
1998 - "I did not have sexual relations with that woman"
1972 - "I am not a crook"
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 16, 2017, 10:39:07 pm
I thought he'd do fine.  I'm now convinced he won't make it through his first term.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 17, 2017, 05:30:40 am
Just some comments from Trump supporters to give you an idea of what some people think:

"We Trumpsters know-President Trump is the best thing since Abe Lincoln!🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸"

"Yes indeed he is "crazy like a fox" & cannot be contained by the usual methods.
Remember when the media and the GOP laughed and said he's a joke? People underestimate this man - our President all the time and he uses it to his advantage. Who's laughing now? God bless President Trump! 👍🇺🇸"

"I fully agree , the man is a genius!! Sit back and watch him in action , The media won't control or define him , FANTASTIC! I knew what I was doing when I placed my ballot 👏👏👏❣💥"

"I agree with you how sick America is right now, [NAME], for the exact opposite reason you would think. The far left liberals have not only destroyed our freedoms, society, and culture, they are trying to destroy any chance we may have to make things so much better for all people. Too many people have been told on what to think, and not how to have a mind and ideas of their own. It is frowned upon to be an individual and have your own thoughts and ideas. The far left is trying to destroy our country, because they are not into individual freedoms. They are into a herd mentality."

All of these are in response to this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFcbQFHLptQ

They actually think Trump is playing 4D chess.

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on February 17, 2017, 08:52:55 am
I thought he'd do fine.  I'm now convinced he won't make it through his first term.
What made you think he'd do fine? Your crazymeter sometimes doesn't work?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 17, 2017, 09:04:34 am
What's with Trump and Deutsche Bank? Why do they keep lending him and the other Trumps money after he refused to repay a 300M loan?

No wonder he doesn't want to release his tax returns.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/feb/16/how-donald-trump-became-deutsche-bank-biggest-headache
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 17, 2017, 09:38:07 am
I find it pretty interesting that one of the comments up above I posted said:

"It is frowned upon to be an individual and have your own thoughts and ideas. The far left is trying to destroy our country, because they are not into individual freedoms. They are into a herd mentality."

I find myself becoming less judgmental of religious identities as I study them, so i want to address this point and why it's so strange; however, in order to do so I need to lead up to it. First I will need to describe some of the history of Protestantism in the United States.

Protestantism in the US had two ideological strands throughout most of the 20th century: mainline and evangelical. Mainline Protestant churches were more liberal; they believed the believe in the social welfare message of Christ and sought to go out and aid others, as Jesus preached to do in the sermon on the mount. Evangelical Protestant churches were the conservative strand of Protestantism, which offered a strict guidelines for a healthy and moral life. They strictly controlled their congregations lifestyles and sought to have others join them, so that they too may be saved. As opposed to going out, allowing others to be what they are and simply providing assistance and care, evangelism sought to spread the word of God under the notion that people who accept him will join their fold.

The key difference between these two strands of Protestantism is that one values individualism and looks to synthesize its teachings and beliefs with an increasingly pluralistic society, whilst the other looked out for themselves. Conservative religions held traditionalist values. Politically, they are intent on creating an evangelical Protestant America. Traditionalism values subdues the individual in favour of the group. In fact, straying from the program is very much considered a threat, not to just the religion but society as a whole. You see, the prescribed life of conservative religion is a response to the fractured identities we suffer from the radical individualism associated with modernity. Modernity might be seen as nihilistic in the sense that if we can be anything, then we are nothing. The modern condition is one of having no place, role, or position in society or time. Anything goes.

Evangelical conservative Christianity is a response to this modern condition. Throughout the 60s and 70s as society became more liberal, attendance in the Mainline Protestant churches (read: liberal Protestant churches) rapidly declined. People could be spiritual or faithful without church. Religious identities were becoming fragmented just as our social identities were. People began observing religions like they were in a cafeteria picking and choosing their dishes, keeping and discarding the parts that had the most meaning for them. Attending weekly services is one of the things that suffered, even though many continued to have a personal devotion. Paradoxically, while all of this was happening, conservative evangelical churches were holding onto their membership. These "stricter" churches that prescribed guidelines for their members lifestyles and enforced them may seem anachronistic but they serve a very important purpose. They give people a sense of purpose and identity. They prescribe for them a role in society that allows them to understand their place in space and time. Individualism led to the rise of many mental health issues, such as depression and anxiety, precisely because it has become harder to find your place and role in this world. So many turned to or stayed with evangelical or more traditionalist religions as a way of finding meaning, purpose, and simply a place in an increasingly fragmented society.

What this commenter above characterized as an assault on society by liberals is not correct. "Liberalism" is the idea of individual freedoms and liberties, so it makes absolutely no sense to characterize liberal ideology as the subjugation of the individual. Liberal ideology is literally the exact opposite. It is conservative ideology that wants everyone to join their fold because they think the path to social well-being is a prescriptive program of faith that provides lifestyle guidelines to give everyone a place and sense of purpose in society. If it seems that Evangelical Christians are trying to take over the government and make everyone follow their beliefs, it is because that is exactly what they are doing and they strongly believe it is not just the right thing to do, but it is the moral thing to do. This doesn't just go for Christians, this is any traditionalist religion. The welfare of society and people's entire sense of purpose are bound up in the prescription of a conservative religious life that strictly values the group over the individual. Any deviation from the group is such a problem that there have been times where the group calls for the death of the person who doesn't subjugate their individuality before their faith. This is what happened to Salman Rushdie after publishing The Satanic Verses. This is what happened when conservative Christians justify the murder of abortion doctors.

So to put it simply, it is not liberals who are denying individual liberties and freedoms. It is very much a Christian conservative ideology that looks to subjugate the individual in favour of the group, one very specific group that all are invited to join and those who don't are seen as a threat to the group's very existence.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 17, 2017, 09:56:10 am
Oh and another thing, Western society set out on the liberal project back during the Enlightenment when it was no longer acceptable to cite tradition, but rather we embarked on a journey where reason was the path to truth. The Reformation was just a milestone on that journey, where individuals could now interpret the Bible and the word of God. However, this project reaches into all aspect of people's lives. Conservative ideology is one that seeks to "conserve" the old traditions, deny reason, and thereby deny individuality and individual liberty. Conservatism is about tradition and society as the body organic, where everyone has a role and a function as part of the group. Those who do not want to fulfill their role are to be exiled or are otherwise a threat to society.

Long story short, people on Facebook haven't got a fucking clue what they're talking about.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 17, 2017, 10:11:17 am
What made you think he'd do fine? Your crazymeter sometimes doesn't work?

I thought he'd have smart people around him to make up for his nonsense.  I was wrong.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 17, 2017, 03:44:50 pm
Just some comments from Trump supporters to give you an idea of what some people think:

"We Trumpsters know-President Trump is the best thing since Abe Lincoln!🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸"

"Yes indeed he is "crazy like a fox" & cannot be contained by the usual methods.
Remember when the media and the GOP laughed and said he's a joke? People underestimate this man - our President all the time and he uses it to his advantage. Who's laughing now? God bless President Trump! 👍🇺🇸"

"I fully agree , the man is a genius!! Sit back and watch him in action , The media won't control or define him , FANTASTIC! I knew what I was doing when I placed my ballot 👏👏👏❣💥"

"I agree with you how sick America is right now, [NAME], for the exact opposite reason you would think. The far left liberals have not only destroyed our freedoms, society, and culture, they are trying to destroy any chance we may have to make things so much better for all people. Too many people have been told on what to think, and not how to have a mind and ideas of their own. It is frowned upon to be an individual and have your own thoughts and ideas. The far left is trying to destroy our country, because they are not into individual freedoms. They are into a herd mentality."

All of these are in response to this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFcbQFHLptQ

They actually think Trump is playing 4D chess.

He did win an election, and his attack on the press is proving effective in the eyes of a large portion of Americans, they believe him more than the press...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 17, 2017, 03:53:54 pm
This says more about those people than it does the press. It tells me they're ignorant and impressionable combined with being opinionated. When people buy into Trump's bullying of the media, what are they left with? Only the government message with zero accountability to the public. These ignorant fools would be beside themselves with rage if a democrat treated the media like this. A free press is the keystone of democracy. Without it you're left with nothing but government propaganda.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on February 17, 2017, 04:35:08 pm
Yes, but they're victims!  Victims of a vast left-wing media!  Of affirmative action and immigrants stealing their jobs.  Now Heil Trump is finally going to have their backs.

Funny how these knuckle draggers love throwing around phrases like snowflake, triggered... yet they're the biggest bunch of whiny victims I ever saw.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on February 18, 2017, 11:22:45 am
I thought he'd have smart people around him to make up for his nonsense.  I was wrong.

It is hard to guess which way things like this go.

In Canada we continue to see conservatives underestimate Trudeau's intelligence, charm, and judgement.

He has, generally, surrounded himself with people who are doing a good job.

Trump, in light of this Flynn incident, is demonstrating just how little respect he is getting: Harward has declined the NSC job on the basis of Trump's meltdown news conference from the other day.

Now, that is a loss. He probably would have been a good fit for the job but now a lesser candidate who is willing to work with a lunatic boss will get the job instead.

It's a self-reinforcing downward spiral into an incompetent abyss.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 18, 2017, 01:44:41 pm
This says more about those people than it does the press. It tells me they're ignorant and impressionable combined with being opinionated. When people buy into Trump's bullying of the media, what are they left with? Only the government message with zero accountability to the public. These ignorant fools would be beside themselves with rage if a democrat treated the media like this. A free press is the keystone of democracy. Without it you're left with nothing but government propaganda.

Trump is as free to make his crude remarks about the press as the press is just as free to make their jabs at trump.  They are quite allowed to bully each other and let the public decide who they believe based on both sides arguements.  Unless trump explicitly starts passing laws hindering the press and their ability to cover the news and express an opinion; the press is just being sore losers.

The press is just as capable of spreading propaganda as politicians and what keeps everyone accountable is multitude of avenues of getting information, determining if the reports corroborate, and not paying attention to the source of information one doesn't agree with.

its far easier to hold the president and his party accountable at election time than it is to hold the editor of a media outlet.

Don't worry obama slammed Fox News on the regular.  The press is having a hard time understanding that freedom is a two way street and that they are allowed to be criticized.  Donald trump criticizing the media is not oppressing them.  Unless trump passes a law hindering there rights, they can't complain if he doesn't take their questions or calls them out.

Unless you show a law where the press is having their rights trampled, they still have their rights in tact
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 18, 2017, 02:19:34 pm
the press is just being sore losers.

It is funny you would say that, and not acknowledge that Trump is also being a sore loser because he doesn't have the press eating out of his hands.

I agree he is free to say what he wants, but so is the press and the fact is they are far more accountable than he has ever been. The press do hold themselves, and each other to account. Trump has been given a free ride, and by deluging the airwaves with continual alternative facts he is trying to bury his worst ones among the others. The press should hold him to account.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 18, 2017, 02:45:16 pm
It is funny you would say that, and not acknowledge that Trump is also being a sore loser because he doesn't have the press eating out of his hands.

I agree he is free to say what he wants, but so is the press and the fact is they are far more accountable than he has ever been. The press do hold themselves, and each other to account. Trump has been given a free ride, and by deluging the airwaves with continual alternative facts he is trying to bury his worst ones among the others. The press should hold him to account.

Trump has not been given a free ride and at the same time he hasn't given the press a free ride either.  The difference with trump and the press is that trump is making no small bones that he's upset at the press and giving it back to them.  Please explain how the press is far more accountable than trump.  Voters can end trumps presidency, but they can't silent some guy writing a blog in his parents basement.

What trump is doing with his "alternative facts" is essentially trolling the media.  By then howling about everything and saying that everything he does is the worst scandal than watergate is really cutting into their credibility.

As for trump going at it with the media, he has to.  All he has to look at is how the media has reported on bush jr., McCain, and Romney.  None of those people pushed back and it hurt the republicans with voters.  Every editor is a human and they have their preferences and a lot of the news is reporting facts and they express their opinions, tone, and delivery based on their preferences which is fine as it's human nature.  Trump is just calling them on it. 

The media is used to having republicans twist in pretzels to try and get their message out whereas trump is now driving the media nuts.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 18, 2017, 03:23:02 pm
Trump has not been given a free ride and at the same time he hasn't given the press a free ride either.  The difference with trump and the press is that trump is making no small bones that he's upset at the press and giving it back to them.  Please explain how the press is far more accountable than trump.  Voters can end trumps presidency, but they can't silent some guy writing a blog in his parents basement.

Trump was a no-name reality show hollywood type that was given months and months of free coverage. Trump has to be accountable once in 4 years, the press has to be accountable nightly. This is not about some guy in his basement with a readership of 3 and a mommy to support him, this is about the main stream press that must make payroll every two weeks and if they are not accountable then their financial supporters (advertisers) will walk away.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 18, 2017, 04:18:31 pm
Trump is as free to make his crude remarks about the press as the press is just as free to make their jabs at trump.

Unless you show a law where the press is having their rights trampled, they still have their rights in tact
No one suggested that Trump isn't allowed to be an idiot and nobody said the press was having their rights trampled. I certainly never said that, so I don't know why you're even quoting me at all.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 18, 2017, 04:44:55 pm
Yes, but they're victims!  Victims of a vast left-wing media!  Of affirmative action and immigrants stealing their jobs.  Now Heil Trump is finally going to have their backs.

Funny how these knuckle draggers love throwing around phrases like snowflake, triggered... yet they're the biggest bunch of whiny victims I ever saw.

Trumplethinskin is snowflake in chief.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 18, 2017, 09:00:36 pm
I get a kick out of this "Winter White House" thing. Must drive the ranks of the CIA and Secret Service nuts. Sitting around chatting with unauthorized people, no knowledge whether the place could be bugged, talking about North Korea and other important security issues. Wow!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 18, 2017, 10:41:20 pm
Trump was a no-name reality show hollywood type that was given months and months of free coverage. Trump has to be accountable once in 4 years, the press has to be accountable nightly. This is not about some guy in his basement with a readership of 3 and a mommy to support him, this is about the main stream press that must make payroll every two weeks and if they are not accountable then their financial supporters (advertisers) will walk away.

Trump's party is accountable every two years and he knows if he rocks the boot too much it's he bye House and senate. 

The mainstream should probably find a new strategy of reporting the news as their ratings are dropping and more people believe trump than the press.  I don't think their shareholders would like that.

Trump has trolled the press for over 30 yrs and they keep taking the bait.

The press should wait until a real quantifiable scandal comes about, unfortunately since they keep crying wolf, he may be able to squeeze one through which would not be good for anybody.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 18, 2017, 11:30:34 pm
The mainstream should probably find a new strategy of reporting the news as their ratings are dropping and more people believe trump than the press.  I don't think their shareholders would like that.

Saturday Night Live is doing their best ratings in decades thanks to Trump. I'm sure the news media are taking note.

The Obama presidency was extremely beneficial to Fox News, and I fully expect the Trump presidency will be the same for CNN.  People don't want to watch news media shill for the president. They know that when Trump takes a shit, Fox News and Breitpravda are going to call it ice-cream. That's not what people watch the news for.  The press is a check on the power of government. They know that Fox and Breitpravda aren't going to provide that check.  CNN, the New York Times, and the Washington Post are doing gold star work.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 18, 2017, 11:44:01 pm
I get a kick out of this "Winter White House" thing. Must drive the ranks of the CIA and Secret Service nuts. Sitting around chatting with unauthorized people, no knowledge whether the place could be bugged, talking about North Korea and other important security issues. Wow!

It's hilarious... Trump and many conservatives criticized Obama for going golfing too often. Trump goes golfing at his private club every weekend. Conservative reaction: *crickets*

Many conservatives criticized Obama for spending too much taxpayer money on his vacations. Obama's travel cost the US taxpayer on average $12 million per year-- just under $100 million during his 8 years as president.  Trump's trips to Mar-a-Lago have cost the US taxpayer $11 million over the past 3 WEEKS.  Conservative reaction: *crickets*

It's costing approximately $300,000 per DAY that Melania Trump and Barron Trump live in Trump Tower.  The security cost of having separate residences for Mr Trump and Mrs Trump will come to over $30 million by the time Barron's school year is up.  Conservative reaction: *crickets*

Republicans were all over this stuff when Obama was in charge. Now? They have nothing to say.  Hypocrites.  SAD! LOW ENERGY!  PATHETIC!

Also, what's with calling his golf club the "Winter White House"?  Does he think he's Tsar Nicholas or something?

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 12:15:04 am
It's hilarious... Trump and many conservatives criticized Obama for going golfing too often. Trump goes golfing at his private club every weekend. Conservative reaction: *crickets*

Many conservatives criticized Obama for spending too much taxpayer money on his vacations. Obama's travel cost the US taxpayer on average $12 million per year-- just under $100 million during his 8 years as president.  Trump's trips to Mar-a-Lago have cost the US taxpayer $11 million over the past 3 WEEKS.  Conservative reaction: *crickets*

It's costing approximately $300,000 per DAY that Melania Trump and Barron Trump live in Trump Tower.  The security cost of having separate residences for Mr Trump and Mrs Trump will come to over $30 million by the time Barron's school year is up.  Conservative reaction: *crickets*

Republicans were all over this stuff when Obama was in charge. Now? They have nothing to say.  Hypocrites.  SAD! LOW ENERGY!  PATHETIC!

Also, what's with calling his golf club the "Winter White House"?  Does he think he's Tsar Nicholas or something?

 -k

It was actually deemed "the winter white house" by the heiress to the post cereal fortune who donated it to the government to fulfill what the title referred to. However it was given back to her and then put up for sale. Trump's first low bid offer was turned down but was later accepted because he was able to slither into the beach property in front of the place and threatened to put up condos to destroy the view. But his use of it will as you say cost a shitload on extra security. You'll probably see Putin at the table there before long.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 12:24:48 am
Anyway on a humorous note, let me tell ya a really really old pilot joke that might just be applicable to the current US government situation. Pardon me if you already know it.

So the captain comes on the intercom and says "ladies and gentlemen I have good news and bad news. The good news is we are making really good time today. The bad news is, we are lost"
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 12:36:05 am
Saturday Night Live is doing their best ratings in decades thanks to Trump. I'm sure the news media are taking note.

The Obama presidency was extremely beneficial to Fox News, and I fully expect the Trump presidency will be the same for CNN.  People don't want to watch news media shill for the president. They know that when Trump takes a shit, Fox News and Breitpravda are going to call it ice-cream. That's not what people watch the news for.  The press is a check on the power of government. They know that Fox and Breitpravda aren't going to provide that check.  CNN, the New York Times, and the Washington Post are doing gold star work.

 -k

I remember in 08 CNN wanted to brand themselves as no bias nO bull and that somehow disappeared.  I wouldn't say cnn's ratings will benefit as will msnbc's but only by so much as the mainstream media as a whole is dying a slow death due to multiple online sources like vox, daily wire, etc.

Fox News is still doing good shilling for trump.  The press is a check on government but they keep crying wolf which is making them look biased and feeding trumps narrative.

I'm wondering what the ratings would have been if McCain won due to Tina fay doing a good palin like Alec Baldwin does trump (which is hilarious)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 12:51:44 am
I remember in 08 CNN wanted to brand themselves as no bias nO bull and that somehow disappeared.  I wouldn't say cnn's ratings will benefit as will msnbc's but only by so much as the mainstream media as a whole is dying a slow death due to multiple online sources like vox, daily wire, etc.

Fox News is still doing good shilling for trump.  The press is a check on government but they keep crying wolf which is making them look biased and feeding trumps narrative.

I'm wondering what the ratings would have been if McCain won due to Tina fay doing a good palin like Alec Baldwin does trump (which is hilarious)

CNN is a news media, SNL is an entertainment/comedy media. They do tend to mesh and overlap, but you must keep them separate in your mind. Trump's foibles do tend to create a scenario where it sometimes is hard to keep them straight.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 19, 2017, 08:53:55 am
Trump's party is accountable every two years
You think Trump gives a shit about "his" party?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 10:10:26 am
You think Trump gives a shit about "his" party?

He will have to if he doesn't want to repeat the obama experience.  As we have seen executive orders don't have much staying power.  Bill Clinton was wise to get along with congress.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 02:18:11 pm
He will have to if he doesn't want to repeat the obama experience.  As we have seen executive orders don't have much staying power.  Bill Clinton was wise to get along with congress.

Executive orders must be legal and respective of the constitution if they are to have staying power. Do you think Trump wouldn't want to repeat Obama's success's.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 02:43:41 pm
Executive orders must be legal and respective of the constitution if they are to have staying power. Do you think Trump wouldn't want to repeat Obama's success's.

Trump is repealing obamas executive orders.  Not very successful when the next president can rip them up.  There's a reason I'll Clinton got along with congress and why obama suggested to get things done through congress.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 03:23:54 pm
I see Trump is now making up stories about terrorist attacks that didn't happen, apparently to bolster his immigration ban. The last terrorist attack in Sweden wasn't last Friday night, it was in 2010 when a local blew only himself up with his bomb. So for those who like to try and blame what they call "fake news" that hurts Trump, maybe he should stop making up actual fake news.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-sweden-terror-lie_us_58a8f397e4b045cd34c263d3
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 03:53:05 pm
I see Trump is now making up stories about terrorist attacks that didn't happen, apparently to bolster his immigration ban. The last terrorist attack in Sweden wasn't last Friday night, it was in 2010 when a local blew only himself up with his bomb. So for those who like to try and blame what they call "fake news" that hurts Trump, maybe he should stop making up actual fake news.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-sweden-terror-lie_us_58a8f397e4b045cd34c263d3

I have a secret:

He's trolling his opponents.  Shhh!!!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 19, 2017, 04:05:44 pm
You are right, he is a Troll. America elected a Troll for President. Well done. The media needs to stop feeding him and get on with news.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 04:15:40 pm
I have a secret:

He's trolling his opponents.  Shhh!!!

It's certainly no secret he just continues to make an ass of himself. It's pretty telling when he whinges incessantly about "fake news" and then tells an outright lie (one of many) in a televised campaign speech. even his supporters are probably smart enough to catch on to that. Shhhh!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 19, 2017, 04:34:47 pm
Trump is trolling the media and it is feeding him. They need to stop feeding him, ignore his shots and just stick with the facts. Dig up all the dirt they can but make sure they are factual. The opposite of Trump.

Or they can do what Ana Navarro, a Republican did when Trump's snowflake in law went whining to CNN brass about unfair treatment and her in particular. Make it short an brutal.

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/320044-ana-navarro-hits-kushner-for-complaining-about-cnn-oh-baby-boy
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 19, 2017, 05:16:11 pm
I have a secret:

He's trolling his opponents.  Shhh!!!

that would require some kind of thought, or coherent plan.  There's no evidence of that.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 06:51:59 pm
that would require some kind of thought, or coherent plan.  There's no evidence of that.

He has done this for 30 yrs.  he knows how to manipulate the media and is doing same.  The problem is that they are using the same tactics that they used on Romney, McCain, and bush jr. however they don't work on trump. 

They need to stick to reporting facts good and bad and stop their obsession with him.  There will be a time when trump messes up and they need their credibility to make it stick.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on February 19, 2017, 07:10:41 pm
Trump's supporters are dedicated, that's for sure.

Quote
Trump appeared in Florida Saturday where 9,000 followers gathered to hear him speak, including one man who said he salutes and prays to a six-foot cardboard cut-out of Pres. Trump every day.



http://www.rawstory.com/2017/02/trump-admits-false-last-night-in-sweden-claim-was-something-he-heard-broadcast-on-fox-news/
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 19, 2017, 07:46:28 pm



Trump's ego is like a tire with a slow leak, it needs to be pumped up regularly.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 08:32:24 pm
He has done this for 30 yrs.  he knows how to manipulate the media and is doing same.  The problem is that they are using the same tactics that they used on Romney, McCain, and bush jr. however they don't work on trump. 

They need to stick to reporting facts good and bad and stop their obsession with him.  There will be a time when trump messes up and they need their credibility to make it stick.

Not sure what you mean by "they don't work on Trump". They are simply reporting on Trump. What is working on Trump is his continuous outpouring of lies and stupidity. He should try sticking to his teleprompter because when he goes off script he just digs that hole a little deeper.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 09:20:16 pm
Trump is now trying to back peddle on his "fake news" statement about a terrorist attack in Sweden which didn't occur by saying he was referring to a Fox news story to do with immigrants. How can one man generate so much bullshit on a daily basis and expect anyone not to shake their heads? Of course he does have his supporters such as the likes of KellyAnne Conway who makes up her own stories about the "Bowling Green" massacre and then the Atlanta one of course. Where does it end I wonder?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 09:23:38 pm
Not sure what you mean by "they don't work on Trump". They are simply reporting on Trump. What is working on Trump is his continuous outpouring of lies and stupidity. He should try sticking to his teleprompter because when he goes off script he just digs that hole a little deeper.

Except that the American people believe trump more than the media.  The only ones digging holes are the media.  Trump wants the media flailing about trying to dig crap on them so he can show his supporters the fix is in on him.  All the media needs to do is bide their time, but they refuse to.  Barring a recession, if the media keeps doing what they are doing, trump will win again.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 09:38:44 pm
Except that the American people believe trump more than the media.  The only ones digging holes are the media.  Trump wants the media flailing about trying to dig crap on them so he can show his supporters the fix is in on him.  All the media needs to do is bide their time, but they refuse to.  Barring a recession, if the media keeps doing what they are doing, trump will win again.

You now speak for the American people do you? I don't think so. The media simply reports the blunders and lies Trump tries to flog. And it seems Trump supplies all that on a more or less daily basis. Or do you think there was a terrorist attack in Sweden Friday night, because Trump said so? American's are waking up and I doubt Trump will make it beyond the mid terms, if the courts don't nail him first with regard to his constitutional failings.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 09:48:38 pm
You now speak for the American people do you? I don't think so. The media simply reports the blunders and lies Trump tries to flog. And it seems Trump supplies all that on a more or less daily basis. Or do you think there was a terrorist attack in Sweden Friday night, because Trump said so? American's are waking up and I doubt Trump will make it beyond the mid terms, if the courts don't nail him first with regard to his constitutional failings.

Do you speak for the American people?

It's simple communication and gamesmanship.  You guys and the media took the bait hook line and sinker.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 19, 2017, 10:18:37 pm
Do you speak for the American people?

It's simple communication and gamesmanship.  You guys and the media took the bait hook line and sinker.

I'm sorry but if you buy Trump's garbage it's you who have the hook embedded. And do you actually believe there was a terrorist attack in Sweden Friday night? And would you prefer the press not report his, or Spicers, or Kellyannes, etc., etc., lise?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 19, 2017, 11:40:52 pm
I'm sorry but if you buy Trump's garbage it's you who have the hook embedded. And do you actually believe there was a terrorist attack in Sweden Friday night? And would you prefer the press not report his, or Spicers, or Kellyannes, etc., etc., lise?

I'm just an observer.  I don't believe half the stuff trump says, however I know that it puts the left into a tizzy which I find glorious. 

The thing is the only people who care about his Sweden remark is democrats and the press.  His supporters are not caring about his bombast and are looking at his results which are executive orders checking off campaign promises.  Keystone xl check, Dakota access check, offensive immigration ban check, process started on the wall check, confidence in stock markets check, working with companies to invest in USA check.

His supporters are seeing things are getting done in spite of the left freaking out over a Sweden comment.  You guys are getting trolled and it's poetic justice.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 20, 2017, 08:22:24 am
I'm just an observer.  I don't believe half the stuff trump says, however I know that it puts the left into a tizzy which I find glorious.
That you don't find the lies, coverups, and propaganda a problem says a lot about you. It's not a flaw of "the left" that they find Trump's behaviour abhorrent.

By the way, "the left" also includes notable Republicans like John McCain and Lindsay Graham....but whatever, right?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 20, 2017, 09:13:05 am
I have a secret:

He's trolling his opponents.  Shhh!!!

This isn't "trolling", this is propaganda. Pure and simple. They're making up lies to support this agenda of security and anti-Muslim prejudice. "The Bowling Green massacre!"  "The highest murder rate in 47 years!" "The incident in Sweden yesterday!"

This isn't "trolling", this is deliberate deceit.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 20, 2017, 09:25:49 am
I think what is important is the media doesn't let Trump make it about them, meaning stop complaining about being called fake news because they won't get a lot of sympathy.  Ignore it and just keep doing their job of reporting the real verifiable facts and calling Trump on his BS. This can't keep up forever, eventually he will be buried under his own pile of dung.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 20, 2017, 09:48:35 am
His supporters are seeing things are getting done in spite of the left freaking out over a Sweden comment.

If his supporters looked for real results, they would be sadly disappointed. Being told he is getting things done from the liar in chief is not evidence of any accomplishment, it is only evidence of the gullibility of his supporters - and that is not news.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 20, 2017, 09:50:12 am
This isn't "trolling", this is propaganda. Pure and simple. They're making up lies to support this agenda of security and anti-Muslim prejudice. "The Bowling Green massacre!"  "The highest murder rate in 47 years!" "The incident in Sweden yesterday!"

This isn't "trolling", this is deliberate deceit.

 -k

Which is why over 50% don't believe what trump says.  He's still trolling by trying to get a reaction out of the press to show his supporters the media bias.

This isn't the first time he's trolled the press with nonsense.  This is the guy who used to call the press in the 1980s with a fake name to make up stories about him to get his name out.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 20, 2017, 09:52:23 am
If his supporters looked for real results, they would be sadly disappointed. Being told he is getting things done from the liar in chief is not evidence of any accomplishment, it is only evidence of the gullibility of his supporters - and that is not news.

His supporters were looking for something quantifiable.  There's a reason there were those photo ops with him signing the executive orders which shows action being taken.  Typically stuff like that takes time to yield true results.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 20, 2017, 09:52:32 am
Except that the American people believe trump more than the media. 

incorrect. SOME Americans believe Trump more than the media. Most likely those with psychological issues, learning problems, no education and low IQs.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 20, 2017, 09:56:25 am
This is the guy who used to call the press in the 1980s with a fake name to make up stories about him to get his name out.

Kind of reminds me of Dave from Scarborough. The similarities between the two buffoons are uncanny.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 20, 2017, 09:58:12 am
incorrect. SOME Americans believe Trump more than the media. Most likely those with psychological issues, learning problems, no education and low IQs.

https://www.google.ca/amp/thehill.com/homenews/administration/320205-fox-poll-voters-split-on-whether-to-trust-trump-or-media%3Famp?client=safari

And

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2017-02-09/trump-administration-more-trusted-than-the-media-poll-finds%3Fcontext%3Damp?client=safari

This tells me Americans are typically skeptical about things being told to them and think critically
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 20, 2017, 10:08:31 am

This tells me Americans are typically skeptical about things being told to them and think critically

Funny. What this tells me is a lot of Americans are incapable of thinking critically.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 20, 2017, 10:15:59 am
Funny. What this tells me is a lot of Americans are incapable of thinking critically.

Neither of them have over 50% believability.  If they didn't think critical, one would have sky high believeable ratings
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 20, 2017, 10:51:52 am
https://www.google.ca/amp/thehill.com/homenews/administration/320205-fox-poll-voters-split-on-whether-to-trust-trump-or-media%3Famp?client=safari

And

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2017-02-09/trump-administration-more-trusted-than-the-media-poll-finds%3Fcontext%3Damp?client=safari

This tells me Americans are typically skeptical about things being told to them and think critically

Believing Trump's nonsense and BS is critical thinking? Please.

The media"s problem is "I was told" or "I've heard" or "People say" doesn't cut it for mainstream media credibility, nor should it, but coming from Trump, his supporters lap it up as gospel.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 20, 2017, 11:21:10 am
Trump is the President now. What's the problem with demanding the same standard of truthfulness from a president and his administration, as from the media? That would be critical thinking.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 20, 2017, 11:58:26 am

This isn't "trolling", this is deliberate deceit.

Never ascribe conspiracy to what you can explain through ignorance. Trump saw a story on FOX news about huge crime rates among migrants to Sweden from the Middle East and North Africa. That simply reinforced in his head how horrible it is to get overrun by migrants from the Middle East and North Africa, and he blurted that out.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on February 20, 2017, 11:58:57 am
Trump is the President now. What's the problem with demanding the same standard of truthfulness from a president and his administration, as from the media? That would be critical thinking.

The people who put him in office clearly didn't care about his dishonesty, and they don't care about it now either.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 20, 2017, 11:59:52 am
Believing Trump's nonsense and BS is critical thinking? Please.

The media"s problem is "I was told" or "I've heard" or "People say" doesn't cut it for mainstream media credibility, nor should it, but coming from Trump, his supporters lap it up as gospel.
These are also convenient weasel words so he can claim that he wasn't lying....he was just misinformed. Except he's not misinformed. He continues to spread bullshit even after he's been corrected.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 20, 2017, 12:11:36 pm
His supporters were looking for something quantifiable.  There's a reason there were those photo ops with him signing the executive orders which shows action being taken.  Typically stuff like that takes time to yield true results.

Looks like he will get even more photo ops if he has to keep re writing his EO's to get them past the courts.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 20, 2017, 12:29:40 pm
Trump is the President now. What's the problem with demanding the same standard of truthfulness from a president and his administration, as from the media? That would be critical thinking.

As would not believing any of them.  The media has a ratings problem and media these days has been discussed as "choose your own adventure" media
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 20, 2017, 12:49:13 pm
As would not believing any of them. 

No, that would be willful ignorance of everything, the opposite of critical thinking.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 20, 2017, 01:02:46 pm
As would not believing any of them.  The media has a ratings problem and media these days has been discussed as "choose your own adventure" media

Trump seems to be constantly outraged at snl for underscore his gaffes and outright lies and their ratings are sky high.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 20, 2017, 01:49:17 pm
Trump seems to be constantly outraged at snl for underscore his gaffes and outright lies and their ratings are sky high.

He is a godsend to every political satirist and late show host. They don't have to search for topics any more because he provides new material daily. When he is gone, writers will actually have to start working for a living again.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 20, 2017, 02:51:46 pm
Trump is now saying he based his Sweden terror remarks on a TV report, so I guess  we can now conclude that the Donald is getting his international intel. reports via Fox news, rather than those danged leaky intelligence agencies like CIA, NSA etc. And now apparently a lot of Trump supporters are convinced the terror attack actually did happen but the media is covering it up. It seems the slippery slope to conspiracy theories gets slipperier by the day.   
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on February 20, 2017, 03:12:24 pm
the Donald is getting his international intel. reports via Fox news, rather than those danged leaky intelligence agencies

Maybe there is more in depth reporting at Fox news. You know those intelligence agencies only give him a few bullet points on page, along with a graph or two.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 22, 2017, 07:35:31 pm
Trump owes $600M to the Bank of China (Chinese government)....  makes you go "hmmmm...."


Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 23, 2017, 09:50:07 am
Maybe there is more in depth reporting at Fox news. You know those intelligence agencies only give him a few bullet points on page, along with a graph or two.

Why waste all that time actually reading stuff when Trump knows that if anything serious happens, somebody will tell him. Ezra or Limbaugh or somebody. Don't worry.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 24, 2017, 10:07:23 am
Just watching Trump babble on at CPAC. Could anybody do a more effective job of making an asshole of themselves? I think I have heard him completely contradict himself at least 3 times now. What w jerk!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 24, 2017, 03:46:12 pm
Just watching Trump babble on at CPAC. Could anybody do a more effective job of making an asshole of themselves? I think I have heard him completely contradict himself at least 3 times now. What w jerk!

Obama did and his legacy is in tatters.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 24, 2017, 03:52:36 pm
Obama did and his legacy is in tatters.
Tatters? One of the best departing approval ratings of any two term president in the history of the US. Maybe do a little research before you post your bias feelings. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 24, 2017, 05:01:01 pm
Tatters? One of the best departing approval ratings of any two term president in the history of the US. Maybe do a little research before you post your bias feelings.

Approval ratings won't matter when the republicans take an axe to everything obama did.  It's why he suggested to trump to get things done through congress.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 24, 2017, 06:23:46 pm
Approval ratings won't matter when the republicans take an axe to everything obama did.  It's why he suggested to trump to get things done through congress.
Like Obama care which a majority of Americans approve of. We'll see how the ratings go for dufus.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 24, 2017, 09:29:09 pm
Like Obama care which a majority of Americans approve of. We'll see how the ratings go for dufus.

He doesn't care about ratings, only seats.  The midterms will be his report card
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 24, 2017, 11:05:14 pm
He doesn't care about ratings, only seats.  The midterms will be his report card


I still don't get how you see him caring about the Republican Party.  He has no interest in them.  He cares only for his own interests and ego.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 24, 2017, 11:13:40 pm
He doesn't care about ratings, only seats.  The midterms will be his report card
If he makes it that far before his own party dumps him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on February 25, 2017, 05:31:49 am
Approval ratings won't matter when the republicans take an axe to everything obama did.
I mentioned this before. It's bad faith governance. They take an axe to everything Obama did then the nxt time a Democrat gets into office they take an axe to everything the Republicans are doing. It's an unworkable and nihilistic approach to governing. It also ignores the fact that the executive is supposed to represent everyone, not just a narrow segment of the population.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 25, 2017, 10:45:50 am

I still don't get how you see him caring about the Republican Party.  He has no interest in them.  He cares only for his own interests and ego.

He has to care otherwise all he has are executive orders which are very easy to overturn
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 25, 2017, 10:51:30 am
I mentioned this before. It's bad faith governance. They take an axe to everything Obama did then the nxt time a Democrat gets into office they take an axe to everything the Republicans are doing. It's an unworkable and nihilistic approach to governing. It also ignores the fact that the executive is supposed to represent everyone, not just a narrow segment of the population.

Bill Clinton and the republicans worked together and the result was a very strong economy and a stable government.  Things started becoming incredibly divisive when Iraq was invaded and only got worse from there.  Obama was also starting to take an axe to things republicans were doing and he had to as he was elected on it.  The president has to work with congress to pass laws that don't get overturned.  The USA has been very divided for more than a decade and if there is a recession the republican experiment is over.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 25, 2017, 11:19:22 am
Quote
Obama was also starting to take an axe to things republicans were doing

Like what?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 25, 2017, 01:13:46 pm
Like what?

Iraq war, passing Dodd frank, passing obama care for starters.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 25, 2017, 01:15:14 pm
Iraq war,

Was winding down anyway.  Obama simply followed what Bush planned.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 25, 2017, 02:02:36 pm
Iraq war, passing Dodd frank, passing obama care for starters.

So you think wars should last  forever?

I would have said Guantanamo....  but removing a military prison that is ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court isn't exactly "taking an axe" to any Republican policies.

But on the other two things you said, what Republican policies did Obama take an axe to?  Passing legislation is not taking an axe to anything...   Your analogy is poor.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 25, 2017, 10:23:37 pm
So you think wars should last  forever?

I would have said Guantanamo....  but removing a military prison that is ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court isn't exactly "taking an axe" to any Republican policies.

But on the other two things you said, what Republican policies did Obama take an axe to?  Passing legislation is not taking an axe to anything...   Your analogy is poor.

They last till they are won.  Either win or don't start then.  Bushs legacy was supposed to be the war on terror.  Obama pulled a page out of the 1970s democrat playbook.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 25, 2017, 10:56:46 pm
They last till they are won.  Either win or don't start then.  Bushs legacy was supposed to be the war on terror.  Obama pulled a page out of the 1970s democrat playbook.

I don't recall you being worrie about Canada pulling out of Afghanistan before we won...   why the difference?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 26, 2017, 12:26:30 am
They last till they are won.  Either win or don't start then.  Bushs legacy was supposed to be the war on terror.  Obama pulled a page out of the 1970s democrat playbook.
[/quote
Do you have any VALID ideas as to why Bush went into either Iraq of Afghanistan? And I wonder how you would suggest either one of those could have been ...WON . Your response ought to be interesting.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 26, 2017, 05:05:31 am
I don't recall you being worrie about Canada pulling out of Afghanistan before we won...   why the difference?

Was Afghanistan won?  In my opinion the intentions of turning those countries into future Japan, Germany, and South Korea was a bit too naive.  A lesson the west is learning the hard way.  Those wars cost trillions of dollars and the way they were fought hadn't shown much of a return on investment in my opinion, however for someone else they may have as wars fought over there are better than being fought here.  Hard to say as none of us have a seat that close to power to know what's going on.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 26, 2017, 05:13:27 am
They last till they are won.  Either win or don't start then.  Bushs legacy was supposed to be the war on terror.  Obama pulled a page out of the 1970s democrat playbook.
[/quote
Do you have any VALID ideas as to why Bush went into either Iraq of Afghanistan? And I wonder how you would suggest either one of those could have been ...WON . Your response ought to be interesting.

Afghanistan was started over harbouring terrorists over 9/11 and bush had the political capital to start that one.  Iraq was said to have been started over chemical weapons, but I think was seen as an opportunity to pick off saddam and seen as the easiest opportunity to try and pop up a state like a Germany, Japan, or South Korea. 

The problem that the Americans had was I don't think they expected to see insurgency on an order of magnitude like it was.  Unfortunately to win a war in the Middle East which is one of the most fought over pieces of land in history one has to look at history of how it was taken over time and let's just say it was not pretty.  There isn't political will to fight a war there and winning by getting your hands dirty.  Expect future involvements over there to be precision drone strikes taking out leaders and further destabilizing the place as attempting to build a western style nation there has utterly failed.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on February 26, 2017, 04:26:03 pm
Was Afghanistan won?  In my opinion the intentions of turning those countries into future Japan, Germany, and South Korea was a bit too naive.  A lesson the west is learning the hard way.  Those wars cost trillions of dollars and the way they were fought hadn't shown much of a return on investment in my opinion, however for someone else they may have as wars fought over there are better than being fought here.  Hard to say as none of us have a seat that close to power to know what's going on.

You seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say Obama was wrong to leave...   why was Canada right to leave Afghanistan before we won the war?


Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 26, 2017, 08:03:19 pm
You seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say Obama was wrong to leave...   why was Canada right to leave Afghanistan before we won the war?

Based on the parameters of how the war was going to be fought, they shouldn't have used ground troops in the first place.  The problem with using ground troops and then immediately retreating when some losses happen is that it takes the perception of strength away and emboldens enemies such as what happened in Somalia. 

The problem with nation building in that part of the world is that they weren't as far along as Germany South Korea and Japan.  There's fighting a war to sack the government and quickly getting out which is what should have been done and then there is waiting around doing the nation building which puts soldiers not on initiative and leaves them liable to insurgency.  Had the goal have been just sacking the government in Iraq and Afghanistan and saying if we get messed with the next government gets sacked - that would have been far better than trying to install a puppet government.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on February 26, 2017, 08:41:21 pm
Based on the parameters of how the war was going to be fought, they shouldn't have used ground troops in the first place.  The problem with using ground troops and then immediately retreating when some losses happen is that it takes the perception of strength away and emboldens enemies such as what happened in Somalia. 

The problem with nation building in that part of the world is that they weren't as far along as Germany South Korea and Japan.  There's fighting a war to sack the government and quickly getting out which is what should have been done and then there is waiting around doing the nation building which puts soldiers not on initiative and leaves them liable to insurgency.  Had the goal have been just sacking the government in Iraq and Afghanistan and saying if we get messed with the next government gets sacked - that would have been far better than trying to install a puppet government.
Could you repeat all that in English?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 26, 2017, 09:11:10 pm
Obama was also starting to take an axe to things republicans were doing

Like what?

Iraq war, passing Dodd frank, passing obama care for starters.

I don't get how passing Dodd Frank or ObamaCare were "taking an axe to things Republicans were doing".

Dodd Frank and ObamaCare were both responses to things that Republicans weren't doing.

Regarding ObamaCare, the Republicans steadfastly refused any sort of changes to the healthcare system. They knew that many people wanted it, but didn't care. They only cared when they realized the issue had a lot of traction with voters. They decided that promising to take everyone back to "law of the jungle" insurance policies wasn't a winning election platform, so in 2012 Mitt Romney promised a plan that would somehow keep parts of Obamacare that people liked, without the parts people didn't like, like the "individual mandate" which is vital in funding the whole thing.  In 2016 Trump campaigned promising a "beautiful" plan that would be "so much better" than Obamacare and "much less expensive".  And the Republicans clearly don't actually have a plan, and the plan is apparently to return to the law of the jungle, which was probably the plan all along. Somewhere around 20 million people are going to lose their insurance, and that's going to come home to roost.

Regarding Dodd Frank,  Dodd Frank was actually a response to Wall Street deregulation, which was actually a bipartisan effort, with the Glass-Stegall act being near the end of Bill Clinton's second term.  Clinton, under the advice of Alan Greenspan, also steadfastly opposed placing any regulation on "derivatives", which was one of the main causes of the financial collapse of 2007-8.

The Glass-Stegall act was enacted in response to the stock market collapse of 1929, and when it was repealed in 1999, it was just 8 years before the biggest financial collapse since 1929. Coincidence? Maybe? Who can say?  The consensus among economists seem to be that the repeal of Glass Stegall was a minor contributor while the lack of regulation on derivatives was the major factor.


Republicans seem to believe that financial institutions can be trusted to regulate themselves, but clearly they can't.


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 26, 2017, 11:10:16 pm
Like what?


Iraq war, passing Dodd frank, passing obama care for starters.


I don't get how passing Dodd Frank or ObamaCare were "taking an axe to things Republicans were doing".

Dodd Frank and ObamaCare were both responses to things that Republicans weren't doing.

Regarding ObamaCare, the Republicans steadfastly refused any sort of changes to the healthcare system. They knew that many people wanted it, but didn't care. They only cared when they realized the issue had a lot of traction with voters. They decided that promising to take everyone back to "law of the jungle" insurance policies wasn't a winning election platform, so in 2012 Mitt Romney promised a plan that would somehow keep parts of Obamacare that people liked, without the parts people didn't like, like the "individual mandate" which is vital in funding the whole thing.  In 2016 Trump campaigned promising a "beautiful" plan that would be "so much better" than Obamacare and "much less expensive".  And the Republicans clearly don't actually have a plan, and the plan is apparently to return to the law of the jungle, which was probably the plan all along. Somewhere around 20 million people are going to lose their insurance, and that's going to come home to roost.

Regarding Dodd Frank,  Dodd Frank was actually a response to Wall Street deregulation, which was actually a bipartisan effort, with the Glass-Stegall act being near the end of Bill Clinton's second term.  Clinton, under the advice of Alan Greenspan, also steadfastly opposed placing any regulation on "derivatives", which was one of the main causes of the financial collapse of 2007-8.

The Glass-Stegall act was enacted in response to the stock market collapse of 1929, and when it was repealed in 1999, it was just 8 years before the biggest financial collapse since 1929. Coincidence? Maybe? Who can say?  The consensus among economists seem to be that the repeal of Glass Stegall was a minor contributor while the lack of regulation on derivatives was the major factor.


Republicans seem to believe that financial institutions can be trusted to regulate themselves, but clearly they can't.


 -k

For obamacare, I think yes Cruz articulated what was the issue, which was business owners having a gun to their heads to provide insurance when they hit 50 employees.  They hold at 49 and stop growing.  Sometimes profit margins are too small to afford it.  Speaking of affording it, premiums have shot up.  The problem is that since healthcare is so heavily regulated it makes it expensive vs laser eye surgery which keeps coming down yet has more doctors entering that field among other cosmetic surgery.  The USA is slowly running out of money to fund entitlements which includes healthcare.  And then government funded healthcare isn't much better as taxes increase and rationing occurs.  Pick your poison.  Perhaps people will need to start becoming more and more healthy.

As for Dodd frank, a knee jerk reaction which has yielded the USA not achieving 3% growth for more than 8 yrs.  how has Dodd frank helped, it just let a lot of people sit on a lot of bailout money as the corporate community is going to sit on their money when the government unpredictably passes regulations that stifle growth.  Another example of government over regulating which means they will bailout companies for making bad decisions when said companies should fail.  Fear checks greed and if government is trying to keep fear in check, greed runs rampant.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 26, 2017, 11:18:36 pm
For obamacare, I think yes Cruz articulated what was the issue, which was business owners having a gun to their heads to provide insurance when they hit 50 employees.  They hold at 49 and stop growing.

Now back that up with actual facts.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Blueblood on February 26, 2017, 11:44:50 pm
Now back that up with actual facts.

https://www.irs.gov/affordable-care-act/individuals-and-families/find-out-how-aca-affects-employers-with-fewer-than-fifty-employees

For some companies that would be a big expense and decisions have o be made on expansion.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on February 27, 2017, 12:31:27 am
For obamacare, I think yes Cruz articulated what was the issue, which was business owners having a gun to their heads to provide insurance when they hit 50 employees.  They hold at 49 and stop growing.  Sometimes profit margins are too small to afford it.  Speaking of affording it, premiums have shot up.  The problem is that since healthcare is so heavily regulated it makes it expensive vs laser eye surgery which keeps coming down yet has more doctors entering that field among other cosmetic surgery.  The USA is slowly running out of money to fund entitlements which includes healthcare.  And then government funded healthcare isn't much better as taxes increase and rationing occurs.  Pick your poison.  Perhaps people will need to start becoming more and more healthy.

Why is the richest nation on earth having such trouble funding healthcare for so many of its citizens when other western nations seem able to handle the issue without leaving millions without healthcare?


As for Dodd frank, a knee jerk reaction which has yielded the USA not achieving 3% growth for more than 8 yrs.  how has Dodd frank helped, it just let a lot of people sit on a lot of bailout money as the corporate community is going to sit on their money when the government unpredictably passes regulations that stifle growth.  Another example of government over regulating which means they will bailout companies for making bad decisions when said companies should fail.  Fear checks greed and if government is trying to keep fear in check, greed runs rampant.

Alan Greenspan's theory was that danger of financial losses would keep financial institutions from taking excessive risks.

Dick Fuld pocketed in the neighborhood of $400 million in salary and bonuses in the years leading up to the collapse of Lehman Brothers, the 150 year old investment bank he was CEO of.  Do you think he gives a shit that he ran Lehman Brothers into the ground? Why would he? He made $400 million in salary and bonuses by putting Lehman Brothers on the risky path that sent it slamming face-first into the ground. He didn't have to give that money back.   Did Dick Fuld act the way he did based on the belief that the government would bail out Lehman Brothers? No. Dick Fuld acted the way he did based on the belief that Dick Fuld would walk away with $400 million in his bank account.

The insurance writers at American International Group didn't get paid based on the long-term health of AIG. They got paid based on how many policies they sold.  Did the policy writers at AIG issue so many insurance policies for credit default swaps and other shady "derivative"  products based on the belief that the government would bail out AIG if the insurance payouts killed the company?  No. They wrote all those risky insurance policies based on the premised that they would pocket a bunch of money.

Angelo Mozilo made Countrywide the most aggressive issuer of subprime mortgages in America. Do you think Angelo feels bad that Countrywide corkscrewed into the ground just as hard as Lehman brothers? Angelo Mozilo made $470 million dollars by slamming Countrywide into the ground. Do you think he cares whether the government bailed them out afterward?

These guys invented a system-- derivatives, credit default swaps, mortgage-based securities-- that let them issue as many bogus mortgages as possible (google the phrase "anybody who can fog a mirror" for details) and pass the risk along to suckers.  Simple process.:
 1) Issue mortgages to literally anybody who applies.
 2) Bundle shitty mortgages into securities called "mortgage based securities".
 3) Strong-arm bond rating agencies like Standard & Poors and Moody's into giving A+ ratings to your shitty MBSs.
 4) Sell MBSs to suckers, so that when the mortgages tank, somebody else is on the hook.
Easy.

So they had invented a machine that turns straw into gold, and they needed a whole lot of straw to feed the machine. So they knowingly issued mortgages to people they knew full well were deadbeats, put them in pools, bundled them into securities that they could sell, and sold them to suckers.

(Suckers-- anybody who bought mortgage-based securities as an investment-- suckers like me and probably you as well, who had RRSPs that included mortgage-based securities as a component.) 

The system worked great... up until 2007 when investment fund managers started noticing that mortgage-based securities were tanking (which is what happens when you issue mortgages to "anybody who can fog a mirror".)  Suddenly people weren't buying Mortgage Based Securities anymore. Suddenly companies like Countrywide and Lehman Brothers had a problem.  Mortgage originators (like Countrywide) had all these mortgages they couldn't sell to mortgage securitizers (like Lehman Brothers.) Mortgage securitizers (like Lehman Brothers) had all these mortgage-based securities that they couldn't sell to suckers anymore.  Countrywide and Lehman Brothers and all the other companies in the industry had spent all this money buying straw to turn into gold, and then found themselves in serious trouble when the machine wouldn't turn straw into gold anymore.


You say that fear is supposed to keep greed in check.  Ok.  But what caused these financial institutions to lose their fear and let greed run while wasn't the idea that the government would bail them out if they messed up.  What caused them to lose their fear was their belief that they had invented a scheme that let them gamble as much as possible and pass the risk along to suckers. And that should never have been allowed to happen.  That's why there needs to be regulation.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on February 27, 2017, 12:51:12 am
https://www.irs.gov/affordable-care-act/individuals-and-families/find-out-how-aca-affects-employers-with-fewer-than-fifty-employees

For some companies that would be a big expense and decisions have o be made on expansion.

Right, so I'm asking for proof that companies that could have expanded beyond 50 employees didn't because of the ACA.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: TimG on February 27, 2017, 03:00:44 am
You say that fear is supposed to keep greed in check.  Ok.  But what caused these financial institutions to lose their fear and let greed run while wasn't the idea that the government would bail them out if they messed up.  What caused them to lose their fear was their belief that they had invented a scheme that let them gamble as much as possible and pass the risk along to suckers. And that should never have been allowed to happen.  That's why there needs to be regulation.
The trouble with regulation is you can have dumb regulation which can be more harmful than the problem that you are trying to prevent.

A part of the meltdown story which never gets reported because it illustrates how bad regulation was really the problem - not NO regulation.

Under the the international Basel capital requirements, banks had an incentive to buy mortgage  backed securities because mortgage  backed securities allowed them to reduce the amount of reserve capital they needed to maintain. When these securities went bad the banks lost their *reserve capital* which is why we had an international banking crisis on our hands. There would have been no crisis if the stupid regulation allowing mortgage backed securities to be used as bank reserves did not exist.

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-banks-bought-so-many-toxic-mortgage-bonds-2009-8

You should also note that that the Basel regulations are NOT solely under the control of the US government so you can't simply blame the republicans for these short comings. Nor does a removal of the Frank Dodd necessarily mean a repeat since the updated Basel regulations are still in effect.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Peter F on February 27, 2017, 06:50:08 am
Quote
Under the the international Basel capital requirements, banks had an incentive to buy mortgage  backed securities because mortgage  backed securities allowed them to reduce the amount of reserve capital they needed to maintain. When these securities went bad the banks lost their *reserve capital* which is why we had an international banking crisis on our hands. There would have been no crisis if the stupid regulation allowing mortgage backed securities to be used as bank reserves did not exist.

Mortgage backed securities are fine ... unless the ratings don't reflect the actual make-up of the MBS. When those banks subject to Basel capital requirements don't even bother to do any homework for the sole reason that if they did then they wouldn't be able to lend as much and it turns out that the MBS's were really shit and they go broke, well the Basel Capital requirements don't really mean much for regulation.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on February 27, 2017, 08:47:59 am
Mortgage backed securities are junk if the only requirement to get a mortgage is a pulse.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on March 01, 2017, 09:54:49 pm
The real problem with the government bail-outs, aside from the cost to taxpayers, is that most of the institutions which engaged in risky and even illegal activities should have been pushed into bankruptcy and their owners, including shareholders, where they were public institutions, should have lost everything. This would have incentivized the shareholders of other companies to make damned sure that the people running the companies followed rules meant to protect the company, and didn't simply go for maximum short term profit to maximize their bonsuses.

The second problem, of course, was that those guys who made millions or even hundreds of millions walked away Scot free. They should have been shot, or at the very least forfeited every last dime they owned. That didn't happen. There was no punishment at all. There is therefore no reason why executives of the major US banks won't engage in precisely the same sorts of activities if the financial regulations are withdrawn. As Kimmy said, why shouldn't they? And as we've seen recently from Wells Fargo, the bonus systems still in place incentivize people at those banks to do whatever makes their numbers look good.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on March 04, 2017, 10:25:05 am
3 days ago Trump was getting accolades for being able to read a speech.

Now he is tweeting about Obama putting the wiretaps on him.

Either:

1) Obama, or someone else, broke the law or

2) An agency had a warrant to tap Trump for a good reason (good enough to convince a judge for the tap).

I think #2 is more likely but #1 is possible.



Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 04, 2017, 10:30:33 am
I see no evidence for it, but I honestly wouldn't be surprised. You've got to remember that it was already established that his campaign was involved with Russia and that Russia hacked the DNC. If Obama did wiretap Trump Tower, it was almost certainly under the advice of the intelligence community for the security of the state and the safety of the American people. Donald Trump and his entire team are enemies of the state and frankly should be up on treason charges.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 04, 2017, 01:21:14 pm
Trump should either put up or shut up. He has so far failed to produce a shred of evidence for what is a very serious charge. Personally, I hope he shuts to F up because I am getting tired of his BS, although it is a tad entertaining.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on March 04, 2017, 08:00:13 pm
Trump should either put up or shut up. He has so far failed to produce a shred of evidence for what is a very serious charge. Personally, I hope he shuts to F up because I am getting tired of his BS, although it is a tad entertaining.

The Trump MO, he gets to say anything he wants and you have to prove him wrong. He doesn't have to provide evidence for anything.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 04, 2017, 08:59:29 pm
The Trump MO, he gets to say anything he wants and you have to prove him wrong. He doesn't have to provide evidence for anything.
That certainly seems to be how it's going. I have to scratch my head wondering how such a dufus gets such a free ride.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 05, 2017, 08:54:59 am
I'm not sure which is nuttier - the American President or the French election.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 05, 2017, 09:00:16 am
Or Edrogen - he could be just as nutty too.

Angela Merkel is a Nazi.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 05, 2017, 12:54:03 pm
Trump advisor Roger Stone was up late last night doing a drunk Twitter rampage (perhaps he learned it from Donald!) in which he seems to indicate collaborating with WikiLeaks regarding "the goods" on #CrookedHillary.

https://web.archive.org/web/20170305042412/https:/twitter.com/RogerJStoneJr/status/838239138834853888

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 05, 2017, 01:13:32 pm
One name I had heard mentioned a while back in regard to Trump's Russia connections was Carter Page.  I heard the name Carter Page connected with a conspiracy theory, which holds that a large Russian oil company-- Rosneft-- gave a big stake in the company to an unknown recipient in December.  The catch is, Rosneft has been struggling mightily since the US imposed sanctions on Russia in regard to the annexation of Crimea. The new owner of that stake in Rosneft will find themselves extremely wealthy if the sanctions against Russia get lifted.  That's the conspiracy theory, anyway... along with the innuendo that the new owner of that stake in Rosneft might happen to be "some individual" who happens to have the power to lift US sanctions against Russia.

I didn't put much stock in it at the time, but Carter Page has been in the news in the last couple of days.  So perhaps the names "Carter Page" and "Rosneft" are worth keeping in mind as this Russia business moves forward.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: TimG on March 05, 2017, 01:22:06 pm
That certainly seems to be how it's going. I have to scratch my head wondering how such a dufus gets such a free ride.
Simple: the left/media has spent the last 20+ years vilifying anyone that did not dutifully parrot the progressive view as morally defective, if not evil. This has created an environment where many people who do not share the progressive political opinions simply don't care what the media says anymore.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on March 05, 2017, 02:07:49 pm
Seems like Trump is taking the wiretap allegations very seriously.

He is not leaving any stone, sand trap, water hazard, rough, fairway, or putting green unturned this weekend.    ;D
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 05, 2017, 02:11:20 pm
He's the president. He has access to all of the executive files from his government and every government before him. He wants Congress to investigate, when he has all the files himself already. Every day he looks dumber.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 05, 2017, 02:21:27 pm
These are words he actually spoke.

Quote
Look, having nuclear—my uncle was a great professor and scientist and engineer, Dr. John Trump at MIT; good genes, very good genes, OK, very smart, the Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart—you know, if you’re a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, OK, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I'm one of the smartest people anywhere in the world—it’s true!—but when you're a conservative Republican they try—oh, do they do a number—that’s why I always start off: Went to Wharton, was a good student, went there, went there, did this, built a fortune—you know I have to give my like credentials all the time, because we’re a little disadvantaged—but you look at the nuclear deal, the thing that really bothers me—it would have been so easy, and it’s not as important as these lives are (nuclear is powerful; my uncle explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; he would explain the power of what's going to happen and he was right—who would have thought?), but when you look at what's going on with the four prisoners—now it used to be three, now it’s four—but when it was three and even now, I would have said it's all in the messenger; fellas, and it is fellas because, you know, they don't, they haven’t figured that the women are smarter right now than the men, so, you know, it’s gonna take them about another 150 years—but the Persians are great negotiators, the Iranians are great negotiators, so, and they, they just killed, they just killed us.

Video clip here (http://www.slate.com/blogs/lexicon_valley/2015/07/31/donald_trump_this_run_on_sentence_from_a_speech_in_sun_city_south_carolina.html), if you don't believe me. The guy is an imbecile.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 05, 2017, 03:26:30 pm
Simple: the left/media has spent the last 20+ years vilifying anyone that did not dutifully parrot the progressive view as morally defective, if not evil. This has created an environment where many people who do not share the progressive political opinions simply don't care what the media says anymore.
So you are happy then with Trump's rapid advancement of the fake news system. Sorry, I'll stick with the old style fact checked style thanks.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 05, 2017, 03:28:21 pm
I read that in his voice cyber, so I don't need to see it.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on March 05, 2017, 04:36:16 pm
Trump should either put up or shut up. He has so far failed to produce a shred of evidence for what is a very serious charge. Personally, I hope he shuts to F up because I am getting tired of his BS, although it is a tad entertaining.

What, only NOW are you getting tired of his BS?!

He'll produce his evidence soon, I'm sure. He's keeping it with the evidence of those millions of illegal voters and his tax returns.

Where it'll be safe.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 05, 2017, 06:29:36 pm
Seems like Trump is taking the wiretap allegations very seriously.

He is not leaving any stone, sand trap, water hazard, rough, fairway, or putting green unturned this weekend.    ;D

It sounds more like OJ's quest to find the real killers every day. 

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 05, 2017, 09:37:27 pm
What, only NOW are you getting tired of his BS?!

He'll produce his evidence soon, I'm sure. He's keeping it with the evidence of those millions of illegal voters and his tax returns.

Where it'll be safe.
Nah, I think most of us got tired of his BS long ago. But yeah let's see this evidence.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 06, 2017, 10:08:52 am
It sounds more like OJ's quest to find the real killers every day. 

 -k
Hah! That's a good comparison and all I'll be able to imagine every time he opens his mouth now.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on March 06, 2017, 10:30:38 am
FBI says nope, so is Donald saying they were running a Watergate plumbers operation? That would be a crime. So would withholding evidence of a crime. So Donald has given his evidence to the FBI. Right?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: TimG on March 06, 2017, 10:36:41 am
So you are happy then with Trump's rapid advancement of the fake news system. Sorry, I'll stick with the old style fact checked style thanks.
Hell no. I just happen to have some perspective on why Trump won. The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates who do not happen to agree with many of the progressive policy positions. This created an environment where a Trump could win because the left had cried wolf too many times and no one was listening any more. The way back from this mess starts with the left acknowledging that they cannot reasonably expect everyone to agree with their progressive policies and to start engaging with moderates instead of screaming racists/fascist/denier whenever they hear an opinion they don't like.
 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: ?Impact on March 06, 2017, 11:10:58 am
The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates

Tea party moderates?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 06, 2017, 11:51:51 am
Hell no. I just happen to have some perspective on why Trump won. The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates who do not happen to agree with many of the progressive policy positions. This created an environment where a Trump could win because the left had cried wolf too many times and no one was listening any more. The way back from this mess starts with the left acknowledging that they cannot reasonably expect everyone to agree with their progressive policies and to start engaging with moderates instead of screaming racists/fascist/denier whenever they hear an opinion they don't like.
Your "perspective" seems to be simply a fairly flimsy swipe at people who think differently than you. My perspective is more based on facts. Trump picked up his EC votes im largely "rust belt" states after he promised to deliver jobs so they held their noses and voted for him. If he fails to provide those jobs he'll be sent kicking horse turds down the road in 2020, if he isn't impeached first.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on March 06, 2017, 07:47:36 pm
Hell no. I just happen to have some perspective on why Trump won. The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates who do not happen to agree with many of the progressive policy positions. This created an environment where a Trump could win because the left had cried wolf too many times and no one was listening any more. The way back from this mess starts with the left acknowledging that they cannot reasonably expect everyone to agree with their progressive policies and to start engaging with moderates instead of screaming racists/fascist/denier whenever they hear an opinion they don't like.

Of *course* it's the left's fault, eh?   Some day I'm going to run across a post or blog or something from a conservative which says "We screwed up".   Heck,even saying "yeah, "the left" did ______, but we conservatives also ____".   I won't hold my breath, though.   

I've recently asked two conservatives to condemn the right-wing nutjobs who sent death threats and other threats to Khalid; neither would.   Will you?  Or will you continue to pretend that only 'the left' screams abuse?
 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 06, 2017, 10:21:40 pm
I read that James Comey is like 6'9.  If Trump keeps calling him a liar, maybe he'll reach down and squish Trump's orange head like an over-ripe peach.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on March 07, 2017, 11:27:51 pm
Nigeria is advising its citizens to avoid non-essential travel to the US.

I wonder: why doesn't Trump want to make tourism great again?


Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 08, 2017, 02:14:34 am
Nigeria is advising its citizens to avoid non-essential travel to the US.

I wonder: why doesn't Trump want to make tourism great again?

For the sake of argument, I have a hunch that Nigerian tourism isn't exactly a huge contributor to the US economy to start with.


However, I've heard that Trump has already had a significant negative effect on US tourism.  (except to Mar-A-Lago, of course.)  I have a hunch there's also an up-tick in visits to New York by Muscovites.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on March 08, 2017, 08:20:39 am
It doesn't stop at Nigeria though.

Brown skinned Canadian born citizens are allegedly being harrassed at the border: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/canadian-denied-entry-us-immigrant-visa-1.4011202

I was reading a tourist publication somewhere indicating that flights to the US were up 3% in January and then were flat in February. 

Could be seasonal variation or could be the start of a reactionary trend to find alternative destinations. The coming months will show one way or the other.

The one country that did not see any decline in people to the US in February was Germany: cue the nazi jokes, I guess. 

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on March 17, 2017, 09:47:45 am
Remember two months ago and all the "embarrassment" about a Churchill bust being returned to England?

Yeah, that looks quaint now, no?


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/17/us-makes-formal-apology-britain-white-house-accuses-gchq-wiretapping/

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on March 17, 2017, 06:29:41 pm
Hell no. I just happen to have some perspective on why Trump won. The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates who do not happen to agree with many of the progressive policy positions. This created an environment where a Trump could win because the left had cried wolf too many times and no one was listening any more. The way back from this mess starts with the left acknowledging that they cannot reasonably expect everyone to agree with their progressive policies and to start engaging with moderates instead of screaming racists/fascist/denier whenever they hear an opinion they don't like.

I'm just so sick and tired of being called a racist by the left that gosh darn it, I'm gonna vote for the most racist candidate there ever was just to show them how unracist I am!

 ::)

Is that what you're saying?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: waldo on March 17, 2017, 06:36:50 pm
Hell no. I just happen to have some perspective on why Trump won. The left has spent too many years demonizing moderates who do not happen to agree with many of the progressive policy positions.

snowflake... might you be a demonized moderate?  ;D
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 22, 2017, 07:17:12 pm
On top of Monday's bombshells:

https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/844702108125401088

This is grounds for impeachment, IMO. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 22, 2017, 08:19:06 pm
On top of Monday's bombshells:

https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/844702108125401088

This is grounds for impeachment, IMO.

And not just in your opinion.
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/324948-dem-lawmaker-get-ready-for-impeachment
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on March 22, 2017, 08:42:22 pm
If the evidence is found but don't expect things to happen in a hurry if it is.  Watergate took one night, impeaching Nixon took another two years.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on March 23, 2017, 06:12:25 pm
I'm just so sick and tired of being called a racist by the left that gosh darn it, I'm gonna vote for the most racist candidate there ever was just to show them how unracist I am!

 ::)

Is that what you're saying?

I think what's he's saying is that the mainstream media has kind of lessened their credibility with a big chunk of the population through repeated politicizing of their news coverage which makes their progressive agenda all too obvious. Their expressed cultural values are often condescending when not being contemptuous towards the values of a broad section of the population. Which, as you might expect, tends to turn people off. So when the same media tells them Trump is such a bad guy because he doesn't share their values, well, a lot of people are prepared to say "GOOD! Then he's my boy!"

And btw, I'm one of those people who hates Trump and rolls his eyes when people say you can't trust the "MSM".
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 29, 2017, 10:16:25 pm
So Trump's travel ban gets shut down yet again by the courts. Can this orange haired cretin who now sits in the WH not comprehend what the Constitution he is duty bound to uphold actually says?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 30, 2017, 07:33:06 am
I'm pretty sure Donald Trump doesn't even understand the purpose of the Constitution.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 30, 2017, 11:30:43 am
Donald Trump is musing on Twitter about changing libel laws to hold the failing New York Times accountable for their two years of false attacks on him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 30, 2017, 11:57:32 am
It seems he simply will not take the good advice from others to lay off the Twitter account I guess if you're nothing but a twit it's what you do.   
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on March 30, 2017, 01:59:15 pm
Bombshell (again)

https://twitter.com/KevinNewmanCTV/status/847520970374086657
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 31, 2017, 07:41:07 am
I'm surprised no one has brought up the fact that Michael Flynn is asking for immunity now.

My thoughts on the matter is that there's too much heat on the administration now and they're going to try to pull an Oliver North.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 31, 2017, 09:23:46 am
Adam Schiff says we should learn why Flynn wants immunity when Sally Yates testifies.  The White House has been trying to prevent Yates from testifying by claiming that things she is going to speak about are protected under "Presidential privilege". This sounds interesting.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on March 31, 2017, 09:25:32 am
"Where there's smoke, there's fire!!!"   -Trump supporters on Hillary Clinton.

"Where there's smoke--   WHO INSTALLED ALL THESE FUCKING SMOKE DETECTORS?!"  -Trump supporters on Russia probe.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on March 31, 2017, 04:48:23 pm
Don't think Flynn will ever get immunity whilst he is under an FBI criminal investigation. Talk about government departments working at odds with each other!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on March 31, 2017, 05:47:41 pm
And the Senate Intelligence Committee has already rejected his request for immunity.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 01, 2017, 12:08:11 am
Apparently according to Trump and Flynn when you seek immunity you must be guilty. There are a bunch of fucking idiots in the WH. Not even worth discussing beyond that realization I reckon.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 01, 2017, 09:21:57 am
I am finding the gaining and use of political capital interesting.

Trump effectively has none and seems incable of even knowing how to gain any other than in the short run. All reactionary tactics and no strategy.

Trudeau still has lots, knows how to use it, and knows how to gain some.

It is an interesting contrast between a "successful" business man bringing "business experience" and a large ego to the job vs someone who doesn't bring any of that baggage.

Of course, I would also trust Trudeau to look after the interests of Canada, or even the US, before Russia so there's that too.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 01, 2017, 09:32:10 am
Today, Justin Trudeau was playing April Fool's jokes.

Donald Trump was lashing out at journalists....
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 01, 2017, 12:48:38 pm
It's still early days but the future isn't looking good for The Donald. So far all he has been able to do is sign executive actions. Unless he can actually get some legislation of his own through a Congress that has shown no inclination to do anything but destroy existing legislation, his reputation as a deal maker will be shot. Business will know it can just ignore him and his threats.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 01, 2017, 01:58:39 pm
Oh but he may well get a few dozen coal miners back down underground and on their way to full time employment, at least until black lung kills them.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on April 01, 2017, 04:07:20 pm
Today, Justin Trudeau was playing April Fool's jokes.

Donald Trump was lashing out at journalists....

Maybe he was just kidding...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 01, 2017, 06:45:04 pm
Maybe....
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 01, 2017, 09:07:00 pm
Oh but he may well get a few dozen coal miners back down underground and on their way to full time employment, at least until black lung kills them.

Next he will bring back Blockbuster and all those video store rental jobs!

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 01, 2017, 09:47:06 pm
Good, so folks like you can get off welfare and go back to work.
I'm sure you are looking forward to it. You'll need to educate yourself a bit about movies. I'm sure you'll be fine.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 01, 2017, 10:55:18 pm
I'm sure you've never had a real job, and spend your days in mommas basement.
I only wish I could have stayed in the basement. Instead of all those many long hours flying all over the world. But the practical education I received along the way seems to be something you wish you had had.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 02, 2017, 09:38:57 am
It's poor form for a new member (there are 27, btw - this forum is only 2 months old) to to have 2 of their first five posts be personal attacks.  Those posts are gone. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 02, 2017, 10:45:22 am
Trump's polling after only two-ish months: 

https://mobile.twitter.com/PollsAndVotes/status/848345576722898945/photo/1

Sad!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on April 02, 2017, 11:57:55 am
It's poor form for a new member (there are 27, btw - this forum is only 2 months old) to to have 2 of their first five posts be personal attacks.  Those posts are gone.

I can still say Fuck, though, right?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 02, 2017, 04:35:11 pm
I can still say Fuck, though, right?

You most certainly can - a little fuck never hurt anyone.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 02, 2017, 04:36:23 pm
I see... but it's fine for others though. Enjoy your echo chamber.

I'm sorry you feel that way.  Contributions are valued here, as (as you pointed out) there aren't that many regular contributors.  That's mostly because this forum exists as a relief valve for another.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 03, 2017, 10:10:06 pm
No point dwelling on generation snowflake so lets move on...

Came across the story of Max Planck and his chauffeur tonight:

Quote
I frequently tell the apocryphal story about how Max Planck, after he won the Nobel Prize, went around Germany giving the same standard lecture on the new quantum mechanics.

Over time, his chauffeur memorized the lecture and said, “Would you mind, Professor Planck, because it's so boring to stay in our routine, if I gave the lecture in Munich and you just sat in front wearing my chauffeur's hat?” Planck said, “Why not?” And the chauffeur got up and gave this long lecture on quantum mechanics. After which a physics professor stood up and asked a perfectly ghastly question. The speaker said, “Well I'm surprised that in an advanced city like Munich I get such an elementary question. I'm going to ask my chauffeur to reply.”

The point of the story is to distinguish between real knowledge and facile knowledge. 

As explained in the link, politicians, con men, and the like (i.e. Donald Trump) have chauffeur knowledge rather than true knowledge.

Donald Trump, being a con man politican, is perhaps the greatest current example of this.

What I find amazing is how people fall for this?

Link:  https://www.farnamstreetblog.com/2015/09/two-types-of-knowledge/
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 06, 2017, 02:34:33 pm
Well Trump now says he is going to do "something" about Assad. Only a few days ago he was saying there was no reason to do anything about him. Tillerson made a comment that whether Assad should stay or go must be left up to the Syrian people. Ha ha ha. Now after seeing some of the horrible pics from the latest attack he has had some of his "lines crossed". I guess the stupid twit wasn't aware that this war has been going on for 6 or so years. The question is what will he actually do that won't upset his overseer Putin?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 06, 2017, 03:15:40 pm
However, I've heard that Trump has already had a significant negative effect on US tourism.  (except to Mar-A-Lago, of course.)
Actually, the area around Mar-A-Lago is suffering as well.... Trump's frequent visits there have disrupted several of the businesses in the area.

From: https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2017/02/17/trump-florida-visits-put-small-airport-tailspin/NnGgAPQa4wd2Ecpy4wspbO/story.html
President Donald Trump wants small businesses to thrive, but his frequent Mar-a-Lago visits have flight schools and other companies at a nearby airport in a financial nosedive. The Secret Service closed Lantana Airport on Friday for the third straight weekend because of the president’s return to his Palm Beach resort, meaning its maintenance companies, a banner-flying business and another two dozen businesses are also shuttered, costing them thousands of dollars at the year’s busiest time..
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 06, 2017, 03:25:25 pm
Well Trump now says he is going to do "something" about Assad. Only a few days ago he was saying there was no reason to do anything about him. Tillerson made a comment that whether Assad should stay or go must be left up to the Syrian people. Ha ha ha. Now after seeing some of the horrible pics from the latest attack he has had some of his "lines crossed". I guess the stupid twit wasn't aware that this war has been going on for 6 or so years. The question is what will he actually do that won't upset his overseer Putin?
Yup, Trump certainly stuck is foot in it.

Syria is a mess.. a real dumpster fire with no easy answers. Everyone who wasn't a Trump supporter knew he had no idea what he was talking about during the election when he said he had plans to fix the problem. And Trump's praise of Russia and Putin will come back to haunt him; despite both the U.S. and Russia fighting ISIS, they are not allies, with Russia trying to prop up Assad, while the U.S. (at least under Obama) favored various non-ISIS rebel groups.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 06, 2017, 04:21:14 pm
Yup, Trump certainly stuck is foot in it.

Syria is a mess.. a real dumpster fire with no easy answers. Everyone who wasn't a Trump supporter knew he had no idea what he was talking about during the election when he said he had plans to fix the problem. And Trump's praise of Russia and Putin will come back to haunt him; despite both the U.S. and Russia fighting ISIS, they are not allies, with Russia trying to prop up Assad, while the U.S. (at least under Obama) favored various non-ISIS rebel groups.

I was not the biggest fan of Hillary Clinton's (although I certainly preferred her to Trump) and at least on this issue she had a plan that she spelled out that included various things including establishing a no-fly zone over Syria to prevent the types of attacks we just saw. Trump simply made another hollow comment something along the lines of "Oh yeah, we have a plan, but of course no details. Whether Hillary would have been successful with her plan I guess we'll never know. Now Trump is actually meeting with his military adviser so as to actually come up with a plan. What I have heard so far is there is speculation he may be planning to bomb some of the airfields that launched the aircraft the latest attack came from. Of course Assad will laugh at that, he can simply launch the next one with rockets. I got to travel through Syria years ago and found for instance that Damascus was a lovely city with very friendly people. I can't imagine what kind of horror show it's been turned into now.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 06, 2017, 05:43:48 pm
Trump simply made another hollow comment something along the lines of "Oh yeah, we have a plan, but of course no details.
But Trump did have a plan.. first he said he'd fire all then generals. Then he'd ask all the generals to sit down and write up a plan to defeat ISIS. Then he said it didn't matter because he was smarter than the Generals.

For better or worse, I think ISIS will be defeated (at least militarily in Syria/Iraq), and probably during Trump's tenure. Not that I think he'll be responsible (although he may claim credit)... but ISIS was going to run into problems anyways. (They're running out of stuff to sell or steal in order to pay their troops, and opposition in the area is better organized.)

Quote
Now Trump is actually meeting with his military adviser so as to actually come up with a plan. What I have heard so far is there is speculation he may be planning to bomb some of the airfields that launched the aircraft the latest attack came from. Of course Assad will laugh at that, he can simply launch the next one with rockets.
Of course, any plan runs the risk of being opposed by Donald's friends, the Russians.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on April 07, 2017, 10:33:14 pm
I can't escape the feeling the Syria bombing was a ploy to hide the puppet strings. It seems very House of Cards, but the fact that they warned Russia means Putin warned Assad, which makes one wonder what the point of it was. If they have time to get everyone important out of the way and then just leave a few sacrificial Syrian civilians to make Donald look like a war President, they have all to gain and nothing to lose.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 07, 2017, 11:17:18 pm
Knocking out 20 or so aircraft is like a "fly in an elephants ass" when you consider just how quickly the Russians could and will replace them many times over. You might think if you wanted to F up an airbase you might just blow a hole or two in the runway. Reports say planes have already continued operations. I suspect Trump knew/knows very well he has legal problems with any kind of further escalation of attacks on Syria, so he will simply try and tell everyone how he acted "bigly" (while enjoying dinner at his gold course), and that's all for now folks. And then Russia's boy toy will continue murdering his people.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 07, 2017, 11:58:32 pm
I think he did the right thing with the symbolic slap on the wrist.  I think that it's the first time I've actually agreed with anything he did.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 08, 2017, 02:48:22 pm
So Trump gives us all, as one reporter put it, whiplash with his about face on Syria, launches an attack which at the end of the day will only help ISIL, then he pisses away another $3 million to run down to Mara Laga for yet another round of golf, and when he's between holes he's tweeting about the latest missile attack. And of course he says the pictures of chemically burned children moved him to do so while at the same time he has locked the door to them from escaping those attacks by coming to the States. How the hell could anyone take this twit seriously!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on April 08, 2017, 08:24:57 pm
And if Russia was aware an hour in advance and they're now really upset with Trump for doing this, why did they not even attempt to shoot the missiles down?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 08, 2017, 10:59:04 pm
Someone on Twitter said it best - you can tell Russia doesn't care because they sent out Medvedev to say that they care.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on April 09, 2017, 04:55:55 pm
And if Russia was aware an hour in advance and they're now really upset with Trump for doing this, why did they not even attempt to shoot the missiles down?

Maybe because Russia has no real ability to shoot down 60 cruise missiles.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 09, 2017, 05:30:59 pm
Well they do actually but the S 300/400 systems are only in place at the Russian airbases, and they have a limited range. I suspect they didn't want to waste resources fighting off a pre programmed attack. Much easier to just lay low for a few hours and then continue operations the next day.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 09, 2017, 06:45:58 pm
Russia is actually a lot weaker than they seem/many think.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 09, 2017, 06:55:57 pm
Russia is actually a lot weaker than they seem/many think.

Yes indeed, their economy is currently the size of Italy's. And then they spend so much of it on military hardware. But of course they do have nukes so we ought not push them too far.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 09, 2017, 10:50:26 pm
Well they do actually but the S 300/400 systems are only in place at the Russian airbases, and they have a limited range.

Yes very limited  ;D :

https://youtu.be/FoM5a6v6410
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 09, 2017, 11:05:33 pm
Yes very limited  ;D :

https://youtu.be/FoM5a6v6410

Somebody forget to fill up the gas tank? Off to the Gulag!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on April 09, 2017, 11:44:45 pm
Saw on twitter tonight:

Trump could have done more damage to that airfield if he bought it and ran it as a business. 

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 10, 2017, 12:39:41 am
Saw on twitter tonight:

Trump could have done more damage to that airfield if he bought it and ran it as a business.
Problem is, these days, the only way Trump can afford to buy a business is to take out a loan from a Russian bank.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on April 10, 2017, 11:41:49 am
Yes indeed, their economy is currently the size of Italy's. And then they spend so much of it on military hardware. But of course they do have nukes so we ought not push them too far.

They have four times our population but a smaller GDP than Canada. Think about what spending enough of our GDP on the military to have a Russian sized military would do to us. On to of that, of course, is the extreme corruption whereby so much of what the country does have is stolen by a small cadre of oligarchs around Putin.

Most Russians live in what Canadians would consider to be extreme poverty.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 10, 2017, 10:29:42 pm
So Trump disparaged Obama for his golf games and he's going to "stay at the WH and work my ass off". Boy did that turn out to be yet another lie. So far he has been to Mara Laga 17 times and pissed more money away riding fruitlessly around in Air Force One than Obama did in eight years. He's a joke to us Canucks I guess but if I was an American I'd be looking for a way impeach the asshole toute suite.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on April 11, 2017, 04:11:52 pm
So Trump disparaged Obama for his golf games and he's going to "stay at the WH and work my ass off". Boy did that turn out to be yet another lie. So far he has been to Mara Laga 17 times and pissed more money away riding fruitlessly around in Air Force One than Obama did in eight years. He's a joke to us Canucks I guess but if I was an American I'd be looking for a way impeach the asshole toute suite.

The problem with posting something like that HERE is that you're not going to find anyone to argue with you.  ;D
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 11, 2017, 04:15:41 pm
The problem with posting something like that HERE is that you're not going to find anyone to argue with you.  ;D

Not sure why you would see that as a problem. It's good to have people agree with you.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 11, 2017, 05:13:49 pm
I guess since Putin is not even planning to visit with Tillerson during his latest visit, the likelihood of another Order of Friendship Award is rather slim.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on April 12, 2017, 08:39:08 am
It's pretty bad when the official White House spokesperson is so dense that Alex Jones even thinks he's an idiot. Sean Spicer said the Nazis didn't use chemical weapons then went on to try to explain what he meant five different ways and it's still no less stupid than when he first said it. These people aren't qualified to pack bags at a grocery story, let alone run a country.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 12, 2017, 04:27:51 pm
According to Trump not so long ago, NATO was "obsolete", today it's a great institution. Does Trump ever say the same thing two days in a row? The media that are forced to follow him are getting whiplash from the constant flip flops.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 12, 2017, 07:44:37 pm
He just figured out he needs NATO as much as it needs him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 13, 2017, 11:15:00 am
According to Trump not so long ago, NATO was "obsolete", today it's a great institution. Does Trump ever say the same thing two days in a row? The media that are forced to follow him are getting whiplash from the constant flip flops.
Yes, its amazing how much Trump has "learned", that should have been obvious to someone with even a thimbleful of intelligence/political insight...

Such as:

"Nobody Knew health care could be so complicated".
- Donald Drumph.
(See: http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/27/politics/trump-health-care-complicated/)

Well, Donald, most people actually did know that.

Or how about Trump, North Korea and China:
"After listening for 10 minutes, I realized it’s not so easy."
- Donald Drumph
http://www.vox.com/2017/4/12/15279654/trump-north-korea-xi-10-minutes

The U.S. could have voted for a candidate like Hillary, an imperfect candidate but at least one who actually had political experience and a set of realistic policies. Instead, they elected a racist orangutan with no political experience who's campaign mostly involved spouting half-baked (and often contradictory) ideas.  So instead of getting a president who knows what they're doing right from day 1, they get a president who needs training wheels.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 16, 2017, 01:00:15 am
The so called Cuban Missile Crisis was a scary time as I've learned, but at least we had two leaders at the helms who had some brains, and avoided WWIII. Today we have Kim and "The Hair". Is anybody else a little edgy on this current edition? Maybe Trump has a fortified bunker under Mar A Laga so he stays close.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on April 16, 2017, 03:14:00 am
The problem with posting something like that HERE is that you're not going to find anyone to argue with you.  ;D

On that subject, you can't get Trump supporters at the other place to argue with you either. They won't even acknowledge the point.   "yeah well benghazi or something."

Trump decides to go all interventionist in the middle east after campaigning against exactly that?  "yeah well Obama wiretaps or something."

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 16, 2017, 09:02:50 am
The so called Cuban Missile Crisis was a scary time as I've learned, but at least we had two leaders at the helms who had some brains, and avoided WWIII. Today we have Kim and "The Hair". Is anybody else a little edgy on this current edition? Maybe Trump has a fortified bunker under Mar A Laga so he stays close.

Under Mar a Lago he would probably need a submarine.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 19, 2017, 11:06:05 am
So it seems the Commander in Chief can't keep track of what his navy is up to. That is "reassuring".

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/18/uss-carl-vinson-wasnt-headed-for-north-korea-when-defense-officials-said-it-was.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 20, 2017, 11:19:18 am
On that subject, you can't get Trump supporters at the other place to argue with you either. They won't even acknowledge the point.   "yeah well benghazi or something."
Its a problem when discussing American politics right now...

If everyone agrees, there's not much to discuss and things get boring. But Trump is so indefensible that nobody can really build any arguments in support of him without resorting to such petty tactics.

Quote
Trump decides to go all interventionist in the middle east after campaigning against exactly that?
Well, that's not exactly fair to trump.. after all, he was actually all for bombing Libya and invading Iraq at one point.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 20, 2017, 04:33:12 pm
So Trumps" AG doesn't seem to think Hawaiians are valid Americans, including their judges. Maybe that's why even after Obama proved he was born there Trump still saw him as unqualified to be POTUS. Not hard to see how Jeff Sessions became part of the Trump "team".

  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/04/20/jeff-sessions-doesnt-think-a-judge-in-hawaii-a-k-a-an-island-in-the-pacific-should-overrule-trump/?utm_term=.c4cdd0dda98c
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 20, 2017, 08:53:07 pm
Posted this on the dark side as well.  Does anyone think Team Trump or the RNC knew or cared about this?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/19/venezuela-donation-donald-trump-inauguration (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/19/venezuela-donation-donald-trump-inauguration)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 20, 2017, 11:49:39 pm
So Donald Trump got "hired", and now Bill O'Reilly got fired and yet they both seem to be equally guilty of sexual assault. How do Trump supporters square that circle I wonder?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 26, 2017, 02:35:04 pm
So Trump has now laid out his new tax plan where he has readjusted tax rates. So now, for instance a fire fighter who is married will pay 24%, and Trump will pay 15%. His corporate rate reduction will amount to $4 trillion. He better hope against hope that Mexico changes their mind about paying for that wall.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 26, 2017, 03:29:58 pm
Crank up the presses, Papa needs another 4 trillion.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 26, 2017, 04:44:02 pm
He also wants to remove estate tax so the kids will get Trump Towers tax free. "Thanks daddy"
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on April 27, 2017, 10:02:09 am
He also wants to remove estate tax so the kids will get Trump Towers tax free. "Thanks daddy"
But how could Trump have known that? After all, he put all his holdings in a blind trust!

http://www.newsweek.com/2016/09/30/donald-trump-blind-trust-foreign-business-deals-500398.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 27, 2017, 12:10:12 pm
But how could Trump have known that? After all, he put all his holdings in a blind trust!

http://www.newsweek.com/2016/09/30/donald-trump-blind-trust-foreign-business-deals-500398.html

That was about keeping everyone else blind.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 27, 2017, 02:31:08 pm
Seems like Trudeau has more pull than people give him credit for:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trump-trudeau-nafta-renegotiation-1.4088545
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on April 28, 2017, 12:43:24 am
Do you really think Trudeau could change Trump's mind on anything? 

I think Trump was just posturing with the whole ripping up NAFTA rhetoric.  He's a business man, he was starting at his end game and negotiating down.  Threaten to rip it all up, slap on a tariff and once we see where things could be headed, he has all the leverage for a favourable negotiation.

Now he looks like he threw us a bone when he played us like a chump. 

I don't buy it for a sec that Trudeau would change Trump's mind if Trump was actually serious about pulling out of NAFTA.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on April 28, 2017, 08:32:19 am
That's just it - Trump isn't serious about anything.  He's simply most greatly influenced by the latest/most popular person to talk to him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 28, 2017, 11:24:41 am
Do you really think Trudeau could change Trump's mind on anything? 

I think Trump was just posturing with the whole ripping up NAFTA rhetoric.  He's a business man, he was starting at his end game and negotiating down.  Threaten to rip it all up, slap on a tariff and once we see where things could be headed, he has all the leverage for a favourable negotiation.

Now he looks like he threw us a bone when he played us like a chump. 

I don't buy it for a sec that Trudeau would change Trump's mind if Trump was actually serious about pulling out of NAFTA.

I think you give Trump too much credit. He just postures for his base. Trudeau was probably partly responsible and I think he is doing the right thing by sticking to the facts and not descending to Trump's level. Trump also probably had a talk from the thirty odd state governors who's states depend on Canadian trade. This isn't a real estate deal or stiffing your creditors and contractors.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on April 28, 2017, 04:37:58 pm
Wilber, aren't you contradicting yourself if you think Trump was posturing for his base AND you think Trudeau influenced him? 

Do you or do you not believe that Trump had no intention of ripping up NAFTA?  If you think he was just posturing for his base, that means he had no intention.

Hence, Trudeau made no difference.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 28, 2017, 07:17:13 pm
Wilber, aren't you contradicting yourself if you think Trump was posturing for his base AND you think Trudeau influenced him? 

Do you or do you not believe that Trump had no intention of ripping up NAFTA?  If you think he was just posturing for his base, that means he had no intention.

Hence, Trudeau made no difference.

I believe Trump has said a lot of things to his base that he intended to do but can't. Why? He is always in campaign mode because he doesn't know what he is doing. He has to be told so after he has shot is mouth off and then make out like it was his idea all the time. It works great with his base but falls apart under serious scrutiny.

Just look at his travel ban and sanctuary city decrees. All it took to get them both shot down was to show the court his own tweets.

The reason most of the world is afraid of Trump is because it believes he is incompetent. Making him POTUS is like handing a six year old a running chainsaw.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 28, 2017, 09:17:49 pm


The reason most of the world is afraid of Trump is because it believes he is incompetent. Making him POTUS is like handing a six year old a running chainsaw.

And even worse, a running chainsaw can't vaporize people on the other side of the globe. Such as what might happen in a "major, major conflict".
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on April 30, 2017, 11:39:48 am
Do you really think Trudeau could change Trump's mind on anything? 

I think Trump was just posturing with the whole ripping up NAFTA rhetoric.  He's a business man, he was starting at his end game and negotiating down.  Threaten to rip it all up, slap on a tariff and once we see where things could be headed, he has all the leverage for a favourable negotiation.

Now he looks like he threw us a bone when he played us like a chump. 

I don't buy it for a sec that Trudeau would change Trump's mind if Trump was actually serious about pulling out of NAFTA.

This is exactly it. These are his SMRT negotiating tactics. He is the deal guy. He is the art of the deal. He makes bigly bigly deals. He is a SMRT negotiator, the best negotiator. High energy negotiations. He is the greatest negotiator, probably the greatest of all time, nobody does bigly bigly deals like Donald, believe me folks.

No doubt when the negotiators meet, the American negotator is going to be "good cop" to Donald's "bad cop".  He will say stuff like "guys, you gotta give me something here that I can take back to Donald. Donny's crazy, he's ready to blow this whole thing up. If you can move on the dairy issue, I might be able to go back to Donald and convince him this is a good deal. You have to give me something I can take back to Donald or he's going to blow the whole thing up."

This was just more crap from his handbook of alpha-male gamesmanship. Like his handshake trick, or when he went on Larry King and told King he had terrible bad breath. "That's how you get the edge," King realizes.  Years later, King had Trump on the show again, and they talked about that incident, and Trump said this:

Quote
TRUMP: [...] but I took such heat because you were saying, "How do you put people off guard? What do you do to put people off guard?" And I said, "Well, Larry, your breath is absolutely terrible." And you even were offended by it, and you forgot the first part of your question.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCnTGhZD4ds

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 30, 2017, 02:36:57 pm
After having skipped out of the White House Correspondents dinner, but after having had a chance to listen to the jokes, Trump is thinking about taking a look at the 1st amendment. Could there be a coincidence?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on April 30, 2017, 05:35:42 pm
After having skipped out of the White House Correspondents dinner, but after having had a chance to listen to the jokes, Trump is thinking about taking a look at the 1st amendment. Could there be a coincidence?

I absolutely think he should take a look at the 1st Amendment. Then he might understand it.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on April 30, 2017, 05:57:08 pm
I absolutely think he should take a look at the 1st Amendment. Then he might understand it.

That's a pretty lengthy bit of reading for a guy like Trump, but maybe if he took a weekend from golf and let the 747 cool down a bit, he could at least get a start at it. Of course that would make the damn job even harder: "so forget it, Mara Laga here I come"
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 01, 2017, 12:02:11 pm
Quote
After having skipped out of the White House Correspondents dinner, but after having had a chance to listen to the jokes, Trump is thinking about taking a look at the 1st amendment. Could there be a coincidence?
I absolutely think he should take a look at the 1st Amendment. Then he might understand it.
I absolutely hope he actually changes it to make it easier to sue people for libel.

Why? Because the one that will get sued the most is probably Trump himself. Imagine Trump getting dragged through the courts every time he tweets something foolish, or makes some sort of unsubstantiated claim at one of his rallies.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 01, 2017, 02:13:24 pm
Yes I guess I don't know enough about US law but I recall being a bit stunned while suffering through the US Presidential debates at how Trump could slink around scoffing at Hillary and calling her a liar, liar, liar, and all that lock her up stuff and not get sued for defamation or something.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 01, 2017, 04:14:06 pm
I absolutely think he should take a look at the 1st Amendment. Then he might understand it.
Hey wait a second... there's actually a first amendment? I thought the U.S. bill of rights started with the 2nd amendment. And stopped there.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 09, 2017, 09:44:33 am
Latest Trump news...  He may have actually just committed a felony.

Right before Sally Yates was to testify, Trump wrote a tweet: Ask Sally Yates, under oath, if she knows how classified information got into the newspapers soon after she explained it to W.H. Counsel. Some are taking that to be a veiled threat (as in "we are going to pin security leaks on you"). The problem is, it is against the law to threaten someone with the goal of changing their testimony:

“Whoever knowingly uses intimidation, threatens, or corruptly persuades another person, or attempts to do so, or engages in misleading conduct toward another person, with intent to influence, delay, or prevent the testimony of any person in an official proceeding … shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both.”

http://www.salon.com/2017/05/09/did-donald-trump-try-to-threaten-sally-yates-on-twitter-if-so-he-committed-a-felony/

Meanwhile, during Yates' testimony, 2 main things stood out:

- Yates confirmed that she warned the white house about Flynn long before Flynn was fired, yet the white house continued to keep him in cabinet

- Republicans in congress seem to be very.... apathetic to investigating the Russian-Trump connections. In fact, Ted Cruz actually tried to use Yates' testimony to bring up Hillary's emails.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2017/05/09/gop-shoots-messenger-sally-yates-testimony/7pFlDZKB6SRct2xiJWYMSN/story.html

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on May 09, 2017, 06:16:13 pm
- Republicans in congress seem to be very.... apathetic to investigating the Russian-Trump connections. In fact, Ted Cruz actually tried to use Yates' testimony to bring up Hillary's emails.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2017/05/09/gop-shoots-messenger-sally-yates-testimony/7pFlDZKB6SRct2xiJWYMSN/story.html

There have been so many conflicts of interest with his businesses and nobody seems to care, I have little faith that anything will come of the Russian connection even if they find a smoking gun.  Exactly as you say, Republicans don't seem to care and they control Congress and the Senate.

As Trump said himself during the primaries, he could go out on the street and shoot someone and his supporters wouldn't care.  Sad but true.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on May 09, 2017, 10:01:47 pm
FBI: Fired By Idiot
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 11, 2017, 02:17:10 pm
FBI: Fired By Idiot
Yes, Comey has been fired by Trump.

Democrats are calling it suspicious (based largely on the timing). Trump supporters are trying to label the Democrats as "hypocrites" since they were calling for Comey to be fired a long time ago. (Trump supporters are ignoring the fact that most people aren't concerned about him being fired, but that he was fired now, after being praised repeatedly by Trump both before and after the election, and at a time when possible ties between Russia and the Trump campaign are being investigated.

I think the big winner in all this: The President Nixon presidential library, which used Twitter to publish: "FUN FACT: President Nixon never fired the Director of the FBI."

Think about it... when comparing Nixon to Trump, Nixon may end up being the less corrupt one.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on May 12, 2017, 01:01:44 pm
Not only was Comey fired by Trump, but he's now saying he would have fired him with or without the recommendation from the Justice Department. To make matters worse for Trump, he also threatened Comey this morning, saying "I hope there's no tape of our conversations."
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 12, 2017, 01:38:56 pm
Not only was Comey fired by Trump, but he's now saying he would have fired him with or without the recommendation from the Justice Department. To make matters worse for Trump, he also threatened Comey this morning, saying "I hope there's no tape of our conversations."
And even worser (or since that's not a word, how about "Huugely worse" in trump speak):

- Deputy A.G. Rod Rosenstein (who wrote a memo pointing to some of the flaws with Comey but didn't recommend actually firing him) is actually upset that he has been linked to the firing, to the point where he was thinking of resigning

- The other person Trump supposedly got Trump to fire Comey was Sessions; yet Sessions had previously recused himself from the Russia/Trump investigation.

http://www.businessinsider.com/rod-rosenstein-james-comey-firing-2017-5

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 12, 2017, 03:38:04 pm
Poor old Sean Spicer of course got hammered again today at the briefing, and on his first day back from a break as well. If anyone is suffering from whiplash due to Trump's endless  conflicting stories it has to be him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 15, 2017, 11:48:41 am
Poor old Sean Spicer of course got hammered again today at the briefing, and on his first day back from a break as well. If anyone is suffering from whiplash due to Trump's endless  conflicting stories it has to be him.
Given the fact that he took the job voluntarily, and knew before hand that Trump was more than a little... unbalanced, its hard for me to find sympathy for someone who supported (and continues to support) the racist-orangutan-in-chief.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 15, 2017, 06:05:31 pm
Given the fact that he took the job voluntarily, and knew before hand that Trump was more than a little... unbalanced, its hard for me to find sympathy for someone who supported (and continues to support) the racist-orangutan-in-chief.

Oh I totally agree with you, he made his bed he so he has to (lie/lye) in it. It's just you can almost see his blood pressure rising as he has to try and cover yet another Trump contradiction. It is rumored he may be on the way out of that post. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on May 15, 2017, 07:46:55 pm
I think he has probably done as well as most people could in his position. I don't see Huckabee Sanders being an improvement.

Might as go whole hog and give it to Kellyanne.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 15, 2017, 08:39:21 pm
I think he has probably done as well as most people could in his position. I don't see Huckabee Sanders being an improvement.

Might as go whole hog and give it to Kellyanne.

Boy if they do that, I'm sure as hell tuning out. Listening to her makes my BP go up. Remember those Xmas gifts little girls used to get were they pulled a string and the doll talked?.....Hmmm, I think just  got a marketing idea. Arkansas here I go.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on May 16, 2017, 12:29:34 pm
Boy if they do that, I'm sure as hell tuning out. Listening to her makes my BP go up. Remember those Xmas gifts little girls used to get were they pulled a string and the doll talked?.....Hmmm, I think just  got a marketing idea. Arkansas here I go.

I'm wondering how many reporters wouldn't show up. If they did, i would be for entertainment, not information.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 16, 2017, 12:45:28 pm
So now, Trump may have given away classified information (regarding ISIS terrorist activities) to the Russians.

First a few half-hearted denials from Trump surrogates that "it didn't happen", then statements (from Drumph himself) that he had a "right" to do so and that it was good thing because "Russia is fighting ISIS too".

So many problems:
- It is true... the president has the right to declassify documents, but generally that is only done after careful consideration and consultation with staff.. Trump just (more or less) blurted it out.

- Even if Trump had the legal authority to declassify information, that information came from a 3rd party, that trusted the U.S. to keep it safe. Now that they've found that they can't trust Trump, they may be less forthcoming with information that may help the U.S.  (Yet Trump supporters somehow think Trump will be effective against the terrorsts.)

- Despite what Trump might think/claim, Russia is not our ally. They are more likely to bomb civilians in Syria than they are ISIS.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/05/15/report_president_trump_leaked_highly_classified_information_to_russian_officials.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 17, 2017, 12:37:04 pm
Even better is Trump's pretty much definitive obstruction of justice.  This can't last too much longer.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 17, 2017, 02:08:52 pm
Even better is Trump's pretty much definitive obstruction of justice.
Are you referring to the memo that Comey wrote, saying that Trump asked him to stop the investigation into Flynn?

Or are you referring to Trump's statement about "releasing tapes" (that some see as a veiled threat to Comey)?
Quote
This can't last too much longer.
Actually yes it can.

While the occasional republican have made the occasional "Bad Trump" comment, overall the republicans have shown an almost complete lack of morality as of late, and are only interested in maintaining power. (Just look at Devin Nunes, who is supposedly someone responsible for investigating Trump wrong-doing, but seemed to be more interested in providing political interference, and investigating the bogus wiretap claim.) So while you may get a few republican congressmen complaining about some of Trump's actions, they won't make any effort to actually stop him (through impeachment or other means), because, well, he's a fellow Republican who can help ensure tax cuts to the wealthy.

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 17, 2017, 02:51:43 pm
Are you referring to the memo that Comey wrote, saying that Trump asked him to stop the investigation into Flynn?

Or are you referring to Trump's statement about "releasing tapes" (that some see as a veiled threat to Comey)?

Take your pick.  I hadn't even thought of the second case. 

Quote
Actually yes it can.

I was actually thinking that we could yet see him facing some kind of criminal charges.  I'll change what I said from this can't go on much longer to this has gone on long enough.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 17, 2017, 07:41:13 pm

I was actually thinking that we could yet see him facing some kind of criminal charges. 

We could but only after he is impeached.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 17, 2017, 08:05:40 pm
We could but only after he is impeached.

Yeah, it's really stupid that the President is basically above the law in all matters.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 17, 2017, 09:04:17 pm
Yeah, it's really stupid that the President is basically above the law in all matters.

It must be difficult to be an American currently, whether you voted for Trump or not, to see your government essentially come to a halt due to nothing more than obvious incompetence.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 18, 2017, 09:37:24 am
Comey to testify in public!

Special prosecutor appointed!

Shit has gotten real.

It is getting to the point where Republicans in the senate and house of reps are going to have to decide whether continuing to support El Trumpo will kill their own careers.  Some-- those outside the Deep South, at least-- may decide to jump off the Trumptanic before it hits the iceberg.


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on May 18, 2017, 07:00:55 pm
It was also revealed today that the investigation has turned into a criminal investigation.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 18, 2017, 10:09:20 pm
And also that Michael Flynn does not intend to honor the subpoenas issued to him.

I can only imagine that we're going to see a white Ford Bronco low-speed chase on the DC Beltway before long.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 19, 2017, 02:36:09 pm
Apparently, the investigation has now turned to a very close current aide to Donald Trump.  it's also reported that Trump told the Russians that getting rid of the nut job FBI director eased a great pressure.  The White House does not dispute this account.  Things are moving very quickly.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on May 19, 2017, 05:19:25 pm
Does.the States have extradition agreement with Saudi Arabia?   

Just kidding, I don't think he can be arrested can he?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 23, 2017, 11:16:30 am
Apparently, the investigation has now turned to a very close current aide to Donald Trump. 
I think the 'person of interest' is Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner.

Kushner, who seems to be given every job possible in the white house (including redesigning government, arranging visits by foreign leaders, bringing peace to the middle east), despite the fact that:
- His education is suspect (he was a poor high school student and might have only gotten into Harvard thanks to bribes from his parents)
- His business qualifications may be just as bad as Trump's, with him paying millions more for a property on Fifth Ave. New York than it was worth. (Possibly resulting in Kushner talking to Russian banks to help keep the business afloat.)

However, he does make good Subway sandwiches. (Or is that the other Jared?)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/jared-kushner-russia-investigation-trump-song-in-law-probe-person-interest-a7745916.html

Quote
it's also reported that Trump told the Russians that getting rid of the nut job FBI director eased a great pressure.  The White House does not dispute this account.
He also asked other people in the intelligence committee to help end the investigation into the Trump-Russian ties.

http://www.npr.org/2017/05/22/529586885/report-trump-asked-intel-heads-to-push-back-on-fbi-russia-probe
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 23, 2017, 06:34:30 pm
But he visited the wall - that's something, right?  Right?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 23, 2017, 07:59:06 pm
But he visited the wall - that's something, right?  Right?

He did, and I have to wonder as to the contents of his prayer there. "Please don't let Comey agree to testify, especially in open court, please don't let Flynn take the fifth, and Puhlease don't let Brennan tell on me". I reckon that's all he had time for.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 24, 2017, 10:36:55 am
He did, and I have to wonder as to the contents of his prayer there. "Please don't let Comey agree to testify, especially in open court, please don't let Flynn take the fifth, and Puhlease don't let Brennan tell on me". I reckon that's all he had time for.
Flynn taking the fifth is an embarrassing (given previous comments by Trump about how "pleading the fifth means you're guilty"), but I think it would probably be worse for Trump if Flynn actually did talk. "Yeah, I colluded with the Russians. And told Trump about it. He said 'good work'."

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 24, 2017, 09:24:34 pm
It appears that Trump supporters honestly don't give a shit about anything their big orange hero does, and will say anything to make excuses for him, even if it directly contradicts the stuff he said during the campaign.

Hillary was a giant hypocrite for claiming to be a feminist while accepting charitable contributions from countries where women are treated like slaves. But now that Ivanka is accepting charitable contributions from countries where women are treated like slaves, she's a big hero who women should applaud.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 25, 2017, 08:23:38 am
The UK has stopped sharing police intelligence about the Manchester bombing with the US after leaks.  I'm not sure whose fault it is, but as they say, it stops at the top.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 25, 2017, 08:36:36 am
I don't see how you can blame that one on Trump...

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on May 25, 2017, 10:45:47 am
I don't see how you can blame that one on Trump...
"I love Wikileaks"
- Donald Trump

But, Trump has definitely run a very loose ship.... His own security breaches don't set a very good example for others in the government, and he has been very foolish in 1) firing many in the government who didn't need to be fired, 2) leaving many positions vacant, or filling them with people who are not competent, and 3) insulting many in the law enforcement/intelligence community. When you do those sorts of things, the chance of problems like this happening probably increases.

OK, its possible that the leak had nothing to do with Trump. Its possible that it might have happened even if Hillary had become president. However, if that is true, I certainly have some feelings of schadenfreude (a german word meaning "pleasure in the misfortune of others"). After years of Trump, other republicans and their supporters pinning anything and everything on Obama or Hillary (regardless of how untrue the accusations were), seeing Trump get blamed for things that may not be his fault seems like rather fair turnabout.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 25, 2017, 09:57:34 pm
I don't see how you can blame that one on Trump...

 -k

How about today, when he pushed the leader of NATOs newest country out of the way so he could be in the front row for the family photo?  Can I blame him for that?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 26, 2017, 09:21:03 am
Well, ok. I'll give you that one.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on May 26, 2017, 10:40:07 am
How about today, when he pushed the leader of NATOs newest country out of the way so he could be in the front row for the family photo?  Can I blame him for that?

Having been pushed around by a couple of school yard bully's in my day, the image you speak of made me shudder, and so completely confirmed my hunch about his true character. Recall his "candid" conversation about what you can do to women when you're "a star"? Pardon me while I go and spit!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on May 26, 2017, 01:54:05 pm
I was so mad when I saw that clip.  The way he stood there arrogantly fixing his coat after and pouting.  Grrr, he's so classless.

Did anyone catch the Macron swerve today?  He's walking toward Trump and near the end Trump puts both palms out to greet him and Macron swerves away toward Merkel and hugs her and shook a bunch of other hands before acknowledging Trump.  Then they got into hand shake wrestle number two.

I'm loving Macron's style.  He's the one who tweeted the video too, haha.  Loved it.

If Trudeau wasn't so scared of Trump, I bet he'd be similar.   

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on May 26, 2017, 08:38:59 pm
He is a little, graceless man.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on May 27, 2017, 10:27:20 am
I think it's hilarious that his supporters seem convinced that he's an "alpha".

An alpha man wouldn't need to try to impress Billy Bush by talking about what a big star he is.
An alpha man wouldn't need to try to impress Howard Stern by talking about how being the boss of the beauty pageant means he can walk in on the girls while he's changing.
An alpha man wouldn't need to try to impress Russian officials by showing them what cool intel he gets now that he's president.
An alpha man wouldn't need to try to tell Marco Rubio that his penis is very large.
An alpha man wouldn't worry himself with the claim that his hands are tiny.
An alpha man wouldn't explode with rage that people pointed out the size of his inauguration crowd.
 ...etc.

He's not an alpha man.  He's an insecure child.  He was never good enough for daddy, and has spent his whole life trying to make up for it. He craves adulation and respect and validation.  An alpha man wouldn't be so dependent on the opinion of others for validation.

My thoughts on the subject are expressed concisely by Tywin Lannister:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sJY7BTIuPY


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on May 27, 2017, 08:41:15 pm
If Trudeau wasn't so scared of Trump, I bet he'd be similar.

It's not fear, it's Trudeau's style.  He knows he has to work with him, so he's going to.  It's why he's managed to tame him in a way that none of the others in the group can (with the possible exception of Abe - Merkel doesn't have to tame him, so she doesn't even try).
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on May 28, 2017, 05:29:59 pm
It's not fear, it's Trudeau's style.  He knows he has to work with him, so he's going to.  It's why he's managed to tame him in a way that none of the others in the group can (with the possible exception of Abe - Merkel doesn't have to tame him, so she doesn't even try).

"He knows he has to work" with him indeed, but with a trade deficit and Trump and his threats of ripping up NAFTA, the ball in in Trump's court and fear does play a role in the Trudeau's knowledge that he has to work with Trump.

In any case, I wasn't criticizing Trudeau.  All I meant, is that I wish he were in a better position to troll Trump the way Macron did (he is PET's son, after all).

But he can't.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on June 01, 2017, 01:26:23 pm
You know, maybe we've been too hard on Trump. We keep saying how incompetent he is and how he isn't getting anything done. But in reality, there are ways he is far exceeding the record of Obama...

From: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/white-house-staff-waivers-ethics_us_592f9f45e4b0540ffc8473c6?utm_campaign=hp_fb_pages&utm_source=main_fb&utm_medium=facebook&ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000063
President Donald Trump has granted ethics waivers to at least 17 of his top White House aides...The 17 senior White House appointees were all granted waivers in the past four months. His predecessor, Barack Obama, granted that same number of waivers to his top staff over the course of his eight years in office.

See? Trump really is better than Obama!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on June 01, 2017, 02:25:27 pm
But shouldn't the measuring stick really be what Republicans (and their little helpers who stupidly thought Clinton was morally equivalent because, emails! or Bill is a rapist!) think Hillary would have done by now?

Surely she would have had even more ethics waivers and more emails! and more private servers! And Bill would have had more "sexual conquests" as First Man!

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on June 01, 2017, 07:22:11 pm
The irony is that Trump was going to assign a "special prosecutor" to look into Hillary. Reality is that the first special prosecutor under his administration is looking into him.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on June 07, 2017, 03:37:15 pm
And today's Trump teaching is: How to piss off 2 allies at the same time.

So, several Gulf countries (lead by Saudi Arabia) have moved to isolate Qatar, under accusations that it has supported terrorist organizations. Trump later jumped into the fray and took credit for the move. (Lets ignore for a moment the strangeness of siding with Saudi Arabia, a country where until recently women couldn't drive, in a fight against Qatar over extremism.)

So what's wrong with that?

- It pisses off the Saudis, since now they look like puppets of the U.S.

- It pisses off Qatar, a country that is currently hosting a very important air base (useful in dealing with conflicts in Syria/Iraq and Afghanistan.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jun/06/donald-trump-qatar-tweets-us-diplomatic-damage
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on June 08, 2017, 02:00:26 pm
All eyes on Comey. 

I'm so pessimistic that Republicans will do the right thing I'm not very hopeful.  Paul Ryan's excuses today were a perfect example of how I think the rest of the Republicans will treat the matter.

Maybe but I'm just bitter but the fact that 34% of Americans even support Trump in spite of the shenanigans doesn't bode well with me.  Anyone here think anything will come of Comey's testimony?

I say tomorrow it'll be another crazy tweet and America's ADD will shift to something new.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on June 09, 2017, 12:24:17 pm
I want royalties for Comey re-iterating my thread title from months ago on MLW: "Trump is a lying liar who lies."
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on June 17, 2017, 12:05:05 pm
So last week Trump met with Republican senators who are working on the Trumpcare bill.  According to sources, he told the senators that the version of the bill passed by Congress is "mean, mean, mean", "cold hearted", and "a son of a bitch."  He encouraged them to make a bill that's "generous, kind, with heart".

...ummm... I feel kind of uncomfortable saying this, but yay Trump?

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/06/trump-throws-his-own-health-care-plan-under-the-bus

The Republicans in congress are not terribly happy.  They've taken a lot of heat over the bill that passed in the House of Representatives.  They did their best to sell it to their constituents.  And they feel like they've been stabbed in the back to have the President come out and excoriate their bill.

http://www.businessinsider.com/house-gop-trump-ahca-mean-health-care-2017-6

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on June 19, 2017, 12:23:04 pm
So last week Trump met with Republican senators who are working on the Trumpcare bill.  According to sources, he told the senators that the version of the bill passed by Congress is "mean, mean, mean", "cold hearted", and "a son of a bitch."  He encouraged them to make a bill that's "generous, kind, with heart".

...ummm... I feel kind of uncomfortable saying this, but yay Trump?
I'm actually kind of disappointed.

What I want is for Trump and the republicans to follow through on each and every one of their campaign promises, including repealing and replacing Obamacare. Why? Because so many of their supporters bought into a load of bunk about Trump "fixing" health care (when in reality he had no idea what he was doing). And statistically Trump supporters are more reliant on Obamacare than Democrat supporters. Like the ex-coal miners who voted for Trump because he "promised to bring coal mining jobs back" (hint: he won't) but rely on Obamacare for insurance.

I want Trump supporters to hurt, and hurt bad. I want to see the coal miners with black-lung who can only get treatment thanks to Obamacare to see their insurance premiums spike, or get cancelled altogether as the republicans "fix" health care.

Maybe then, it will get through to them: Voting in a racist orangutan who lies constantly and makes promises that have no chance of being fulfilled is a bad idea.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/12/27/these-coal-country-voters-backed-trump-now-theyre-worried-about-losing-obamacare/?utm_term=.bcc651313b0f
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: msj on June 27, 2017, 07:37:05 pm
So the guy who cries "Fake News!" has been found out: 

Fake Time magazine covers hanging at his golf courses:  https://t.co/GbabQP5hXQ

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on June 29, 2017, 12:07:59 pm
I'm actually kind of disappointed.

What I want is for Trump and the republicans to follow through on each and every one of their campaign promises, including repealing and replacing Obamacare. Why? Because so many of their supporters bought into a load of bunk about Trump "fixing" health care (when in reality he had no idea what he was doing).

Whatever happened to HIS plan for health care? He claimed he had one, and that it would somehow warp space and time by providing better health care coverage for less money. Still waiting for HIS plan to defeat ISIS, too, since he said he knew more than the generals.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on June 29, 2017, 01:19:54 pm
Whatever happened to HIS plan for health care? He claimed he had one, and that it would somehow warp space and time by providing better health care coverage for less money.
"Nobody knew health care could be so complicated"
- Donald Drumph, President of the U.S. and racist orangutan-in-chief

Quote
Still waiting for HIS plan to defeat ISIS, too, since he said he knew more than the generals.
He had a plan... fire all the generals, and ask them to come up with a plan to defeat ISIS within a month of his inauguration.

Or was that ask them for a plan, then fire them? I can never remember.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/trumpometer/promise/1375/develop-plan-defeat-isis-30-days/
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/donald-trump-plan-isis_us_57d0b462e4b06a74c9f28ecd
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on June 29, 2017, 01:33:37 pm
Every day I grow more disgusted with this man child, and feel more contemptuous of his ignorance, his pettiness and lack of class. His election and continued support from a large segment of the population makes me call into question the value of democracy itself. Maybe we need to restrict it through IQ tests, information quizzes that have to be passed, elementary knowledge of basic government structure, perhaps. Although, come to think of it these are all tests Trump would fail. So maybe we should make the candidates pass the tests instead of the voters. Would be cheaper to administer them.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on June 29, 2017, 02:17:39 pm
It's so true isn't it.  This morning's tweets about Mika Brzezinski was so immature and perfect example of how a bully behaves.

As much as I dislike George Bush, he didn't disrespect the office of the POTUS like Trump is doing.  I just shake my head in disbelief day after day.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Bubbermiley on June 29, 2017, 02:29:57 pm
Also with Bush, you could debate his policies with reasonably intelligent people. I can't bother to debate with Trump supporters because it's like shooting fish in a barrel and they're too stupid to realize they're getting shot.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on June 30, 2017, 10:10:13 pm
If Mitt Romney, or Paul Ryan, or Mike Pence were President right now, you could have reasonable discussions based on their policies and their ideologies.

With Trump, the Trumptards will defend his idiocy regardless of what pholosophical or ideological underpinnings it has. it's no longer a matter of political discourse, it's just a matter of team sports. TRUMP NAY-SHAWWWWN--- ya-yah-YAAAAAHH!!!

Trump is the idol of idiot-worshippers.   By their fruits you shall know them."  Matthew 7:16

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 01, 2017, 06:39:22 pm
Trump is the idol of idiot-worshippers.   By their fruits you shall know them."  Matthew 7:16

 -k

The irony is you've just come up with one more bible quote than Trump could manage, and I doubt you're a particularly observant Christian.
Bill Maher said that if the election proved one thing it proved the complete hypocrisy of the evangelical Christian movement in the US, and the so-called Christian right. They had no problem enthusiastically supporting a man who has lived in his life in opposition to everything Jesus Christ allegedly stands for, a serial adulterer who curses like a sailor in public, an avowed hedonist who knows nothing about the bible and doesn't belong to a church, and whose public behavior was and remains the antithesis of Christian.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on July 06, 2017, 10:30:13 am
Every day I grow more disgusted with this man child, and feel more contemptuous of his ignorance, his pettiness and lack of class. His election and continued support from a large segment of the population makes me call into question the value of democracy itself. Maybe we need to restrict it through IQ tests, information quizzes that have to be passed, elementary knowledge of basic government structure, perhaps. Although, come to think of it these are all tests Trump would fail. So maybe we should make the candidates pass the tests instead of the voters. Would be cheaper to administer them.
You would never have a conservative government again. Universities, after all, are just liberal training centres, aren't they? Judges, professors, teachers, college graduates of all sorts. Filthy communists.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 07, 2017, 04:52:23 pm
You would never have a conservative government again. Universities, after all, are just liberal training centres, aren't they? Judges, professors, teachers, college graduates of all sorts. Filthy communists.

People who pay taxes tend to like conservative governments which pay for what needs to be paid for, not everything under the sun, and try to keep the budget in check. Conservatives like dull, basic government which keeps the lights on and the roads cleared and the costs low. They're not so fond of liberal governments which believe any problem is a problem the government needs to address, and that anyone who is poor for whatever reason should be compensated by taking money from those who are not.

Why is it that anyone who is mildly to the right of centre is considered immoral but anyone far, far to the left, including Communists, is fine?

Note: Trump is not a conservative of any sort, nor are most of those in the Republican party leadership.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 07, 2017, 10:11:28 pm
I don't think conservatism is inherently anti-intellectual, it's just that current "conservative" parties seem to have adopted anti-intellectualism as a platform.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 08, 2017, 05:47:46 am
I don't think conservatism is inherently anti-intellectual, it's just that current "conservative" parties seem to have adopted anti-intellectualism as a platform.
 

Not in Canada, though.  They have flirted with it, and Harper and Leech patronize the brainless "I hate brown people" types as much as Trudeau patronizes the "I love brow people" types.

Our parties seem to compromise, or alternately steal from each other, more than the American ones.  Balanced budgets are a thing that Liberals try for and even the NDP was touting it last federal election, ie. lowered spending.

In the US, you have these ridiculous purity tests that are driven by media outlets who try to out-nutbar each other.  This used to happen on the far-left too, but I don't have any examples.

There is a golden path ahead to any party that figures out how to restructure the machine of democracy and government to lower overhead and pass the savings onto its citizens in the form of greater benefits for the poor, and lower taxes for middle and upper income earners.  This was ostensibly what Trump was supposed to do, but he has too many blockers to success.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 08, 2017, 10:41:20 am
I don't think conservatism is inherently anti-intellectual, it's just that current "conservative" parties seem to have adopted anti-intellectualism as a platform.

 -k

Well, exclude the Republicans since they're not conservative. I don't think the Canadian Conservatives support anti-intellectualism. But remember, much of today's university environment is profoundly tilted towards the Left and far Left. Left wing ideology infests academia. It's no small wonder so many conservatives roll their eyes towards the ranting of ivory tower academics with their unworkable theories which ignore human realities and motivations.

The belief the Tories under Harper were anti-intellectual largely came from them ignoring or suppressing activist scientists who were agitating for climate change resolutions. I understood their motivation in ignoring the climate-science types because, to my mind, no reasonable solutions had been proposed to the stated issue. And the Harper Conservatives were not exactly the types to go in for large, costly, complicated and uncertain programs, especially if they were controversial - which is why they never did much of anything about health care, among other topics.

And I don't think the Liberals actions on climate change is in any way a regard or respect for science so much as embracing whatever is fashionably on the Left and an absolute disinterest in how much it will all cost.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 08, 2017, 10:45:35 am
They have flirted with it, and Harper and Leech patronize the brainless "I hate brown people" types as much as Trudeau patronizes the "I love brow people" types.

I'm curious about the parsing of this sentence. If the "I hate brown people" are brainless why aren't the "I love brown people" also brainless?

I also, of course, disagree that either Harper or Leech ever patronized the "I hate brown people" types. It is entirely acceptable to believe in Canadian values and culture and be wary of flooding it with masses of people who embrace none of it (see the Khadrs as poster children) just as it is entirely acceptable to not care a whit about Canadian values and culture and revel in masses of newcomers with wildly different beliefs. Neither has a moral component, despite how much the Left tries to attach one.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 09, 2017, 02:27:00 pm
I'm curious about the parsing of this sentence. If the "I hate brown people" are brainless why aren't the "I love brown people" also brainless?

Why do you think they're not ?

The point is that it's reactionary and brainless politics, yes on both sides.
 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on July 10, 2017, 08:50:36 am
Trump's son, Trump's son-in-law, and Trump's campaign manager met with a Russian lawyer in Trump Tower to talk about Trump's campaign...but Trump knew nothing about it? Riiiight.

The meeting (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/09/us/politics/trump-russia-kushner-manafort.html)

The denial (http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-russia-trump-whitehouse-idUSKBN19U0YU)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on July 10, 2017, 01:43:23 pm
I don't think the Canadian Conservatives support anti-intellectualism. But remember, much of today's university environment is profoundly tilted towards the Left and far Left. Left wing ideology infests academia. It's no small wonder so many conservatives roll their eyes towards the ranting of ivory tower academics with their unworkable theories which ignore human realities and motivations.


Got it. So Canadian Conservatives aren't anti-intellectualism, they just roll their eyes at anything academia has to say because the theories are rubbish. 

If that's not being anti-intellectual, I'm very curious what you think is.  Maybe you set the boundaries at burning books and throwing professors in jail?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on July 10, 2017, 07:28:29 pm
The trump campaign attempted to collude with Russia to win the election.   A serious no-no. 

Quote
Richard Painter, a former ethics lawyer for President George W. Bush and a frequent Trump critic, said doing so "borders on treason."
. http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/10/why-donald-trump-jr-s-meeting-with-a-russian-lawyer-matters.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 11, 2017, 03:00:01 pm
Got it. So Canadian Conservatives aren't anti-intellectualism, they just roll their eyes at anything academia has to say because the theories are rubbish. 

If that's not being anti-intellectual, I'm very curious what you think is.  Maybe you set the boundaries at burning books and throwing professors in jail?

You presume the people in academia are intellectuals. I don't. I've been there, met them, spoken to them. A lot of them are banal bureaucrats who got through classes by rote memorization and stay in university because they could never succeed in the outside world and because they can't be fired. You're also ignoring how ideological many are, and their own willingness to ignore logic, evidence and information in pursuit of their noble ideals. You think the Conservative leadership - all of whom are university graduates, btw, should bow before a bunch of tenured left wing professors and meekly accept their pronouncements?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 11, 2017, 03:01:22 pm
The trump campaign attempted to collude with Russia to win the election.   A serious no-no. 
. http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/10/why-donald-trump-jr-s-meeting-with-a-russian-lawyer-matters.html

You realize that even if there is incontrovertible evidence, freely admitted by Donald Trump himself, that he and his entire campaign colluded with the Russians, arranged for the hacking, took money from them, and promised Russia things if they got elected, 95% of Trump supporters would just shrug it off without a second thought, right?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 11, 2017, 03:16:02 pm
You presume the people in academia are intellectuals.

You seem to presume intellectual = intelligent.  I don't.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 11, 2017, 03:17:08 pm
  95% of Trump supporters would just shrug it off without a second thought, right?

At some point, the brutal refrain of negative news will chip away at their psyches, I firmly believe.  Especially, this will happen if the impact of the whole clown show makes it impossible to achieve his promises, which are impossible anyway. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 12, 2017, 11:17:17 am
At some point, the brutal refrain of negative news will chip away at their psyches, I firmly believe.  Especially, this will happen if the impact of the whole clown show makes it impossible to achieve his promises, which are impossible anyway.
Actually if anything his inability to achieve is promises are actually HELPING him.

Trump for example promised to replace Obamacare. But many Trump supporters depend on its coverage. So the longer he goes without replacing Obamacare the better off he'll be.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 15, 2017, 09:07:28 pm
Sigh

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4027315/donald-trump-begs-theresa-may-to-fix-a-warm-welcome-for-his-state-visit-and-says-he-wont-fix-a-date-for-it-until-he-knows-hes-going-to-get-a-better-reception/
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on July 19, 2017, 07:43:29 pm
Trump is suddenly a fan of NAFTA:

http://globalnews.ca/news/3605878/trump-asked-canada-to-drop-duties-on-internet-imports-under-nafta-canadians-should-cheer-say-experts/?utm_source=Article&utm_medium=MostPopular&utm_campaign=2014
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 21, 2017, 09:19:57 am
Trump is suddenly a fan of NAFTA:

Well of course. He was never going to tear it up. All along this has been just a negotiating tactic. It's from Business For Dummies. "I'm gonna tear it up. It's a bad bad deal. I'm tearing it up. We got schlonged real bad on this deal. We gotta get rid of this. Such a bad deal. You wouldn't believe it, it's so bad.  ....   well, I might not tear it up, but we need changes or I'm tearing it up."


As for the contents of the link, though, I wholeheartedly agree.  The Canadian government thinks free trade is great for Canadian companies, but not for Canadian citizens.  The $20 "de minimis" threshold is the chintziest in the entire world.  This has been pointed out numerous times to the government, and the government has no interest in changing it, either because they like collecting taxes or because they're trying to protect Canadian brick-and-mortar retailers.


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 21, 2017, 09:23:01 am
Meanwhile, as Robert Mueller requests information from Deutsche Bank, Trump is asking people about his powers of pardon. Can he pardon his family? Can he pardon himself? This is allegedly what he's asking.

Deutsche Bank is notorious for laundering money from Russia, coincidentally.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 21, 2017, 09:40:41 am
Don't like to comment so much on these clowns but the NYT interview seems to have been unplanned, and now another lead lawyer has quit.

I read that he described the WH as 'unbelievable' in how they run things.  I doubt whatever they did is as bad as the response, ie. Obstruction of Justice
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on July 21, 2017, 10:32:27 pm
Jeff Sessions has been found to have lied under oath about meeting with Russians....

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2017/07/21/mueller-expands-inquiry-into-trump-business-transactions/RunU3sCKgzkElhE7kL6iUP/story.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: BC_cheque on July 22, 2017, 12:51:12 am
At this point, I think even Trump is surprised he's not impeached.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on July 22, 2017, 10:53:05 am
Trump announced today that he has absolute power to pardon anyone incriminated in Mueller's investigation, including himself.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on July 22, 2017, 03:36:53 pm
Trump announced today that he has absolute power to pardon anyone incriminated in Mueller's investigation, including himself.

Will the Republicans in Congress bend over and take a dictatorship, or will they do something about it?

Quote
But frankly, the history isn’t the point. The basic problem with self-pardon is that it would make a mockery of the very idea that the U.S. operates under the rule of law. A president who could self-pardon could violate literally any federal law with impunity, knowing that the only risk was removal from office by impeachment.

We have a name for an elected leader who is outside the law: dictator. And dictatorship is fundamentally inconsistent with the republic established by the Constitution. In fact, it’s a little difficult to think of any single idea that would more grossly violate the rule of law than a president free to break any and every law and then wave a get-out-of-jail-free card.

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-07-21/trump-s-pardoning-himself-would-trash-constitution

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 22, 2017, 05:58:03 pm
Reading World Order by Kissenger now and it's making me think that Trump came around just in time for us to prevent another one later.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 23, 2017, 11:05:35 am
Will the Republicans in Congress bend over and take a dictatorship, or will they do something about it?

I tend to agree with the commentator on MSNBC the other night. Republican leaders have strapped themselves to the mast of the SS Trump, and they won't be doing anything until the water is over their heads. The vast majority of their base still worships him, so principles be damned. They are going wherever he takes the ship.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 23, 2017, 11:10:33 am
If firing Muller doesn't turn them then they are in trouble.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 24, 2017, 07:44:41 pm
Reading World Order by Kissenger now and it's making me think that Trump came around just in time for us to prevent another one later.

Prevent another what later?  Another "world order"?  Another covfefe?

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 24, 2017, 08:17:39 pm
Another covfefe
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 24, 2017, 08:25:24 pm
Make mine a double.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 26, 2017, 12:28:37 am
So the Boy Scouts of America invited the POTUS to speak at their once-per-four-years jamboree, as is their tradition.

And Trump showed up and turned it into a Trump Youth rally. 

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 26, 2017, 06:47:15 am
Last night's speech was also horrifying.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 26, 2017, 10:42:42 am
And now they've actually managed to get enough votes to open up debate on health care in the senate (although it required a return by John McCain post-cancer surgery and a tie-breaking vote by Pence in order to squeak through.) However, things are a mess for the republicans (as certain votes require a 60 vote majority to proceed, and its doubtful that they can muster that.)

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/senate-sets-sights-skinny-repeal-obamacare-tuesday-s-voting-n786296

A few notes:

- this really illustrates how hypocritical the republicans many republicans are... some will complain about the way Trump and the republicans are acting (such as how the way the bill was crafted in secret), but when called upon, most will ignore their claimed principles and follow directions.

- Trump has really been pushing for this, even making threats to republican senators who might have voted against the bill

I really hope the republicans manage to actually repeal Obamacare. Yes, it will be horrible. Yes, millions will be left uninsured (and some may die). But, so many Republican supporters are sticking by Trump because they can't imagine him doing anything bad... having their health insurance disappear might just be a wake up call that "voting has consequences".

Oh, and speaking of insurance, there are hints that Trump doesn't even understand the difference between health insurance and life insurance, as he was making claims that young people could get insured for $12/year.

http://fortune.com/2017/07/20/donald-trump-health-insurance-comments/


Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 26, 2017, 11:31:26 am
So the Boy Scouts of America invited the POTUS to speak at their once-per-four-years jamboree, as is their tradition.

And Trump showed up and turned it into a Trump Youth rally. 

 -k

The lack of judgement, maturity and class of this individual continues to surprise me, though nothing he does should surprise me. I can't imagine George Bush making anything like this sort of speech to boy scouts, and I thought he was an idiot!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 26, 2017, 11:34:04 am
Last night's speech was also horrifying.

What's scarier is the rumor he wants to replace Sessions with that lick-spittle sycophant Rudy Giuliani, so he can then fire Rosenstein and then Mueller.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on July 26, 2017, 12:19:09 pm
So the Boy Scouts of America invited the POTUS to speak at their once-per-four-years jamboree, as is their tradition.

And Trump showed up and turned it into a Trump Youth rally. 

 -k
I'm surprised he hasn't come up with a salute that people are supposed to give to him at these rallies yet.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 27, 2017, 01:37:38 pm
Jeff Sessions has been found to have lied under oath about meeting with Russians....
Ironically, Trump has been attacking Sessions for recusing himself from the Russian investigation, and for not prosecuting Hillary Clinton (which, should it be noted, Trump said after the election he had no interest in seeing her jailed.)

There are so many reasons why Sessions should not be attorney general... his past history of racism, his desire to crack down harder on drug laws, etc. Yet he was one of Trump's earliest big-name supporters. And now Trump is attacking him. Just goes to show how much loyalty is worth.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/26/politics/trump-sessions-tweet/index.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 27, 2017, 09:21:46 pm
and for not prosecuting Hillary Clinton (which, should it be noted, Trump said after the election he had no interest in seeing her jailed.)

you didn't have to be The Amazing Kreskin to anticipate that Trump would start ranting about Hillary again when he needed to distract people from his own troubles.  And the way things are headed, Trump's troubles are just getting worse.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 27, 2017, 09:33:02 pm
And then they hired this guy from Futurama as comms director:
 (https://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/en.futurama/images/8/8b/ThatGuy.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20090909220403)
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 27, 2017, 09:33:38 pm
I did a quick google on Ken Starr regarding another thread, and saw that Starr penned a blistering op-ed about Trump's treatment of Jeff Sessions.  I assume this came about because Starr heard his name mentioned as a potential replacement for Sessions, and wanted to nip that shit in the bud.

Quote
The attorney general is not — and cannot be — the president’s “hockey goalie,” as new White House Communications Director Anthony Scaramucci described Sessions’s job. In fact, the president isn’t even his client. To the contrary, the attorney general’s client is ultimately “We the People,” and his fidelity has to be not to the president but to the Constitution and other laws of the United States. Indeed, the attorney general’s job, at times, is to tell the president “no” because of the supervening demands of the law. When it comes to dealing with the nation’s top legal officer, you will do well to check your Twitter weapons at the Oval Office door.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/kenneth-starr-mr-president-please-cut-it-out/2017/07/26/b9af0c78-723e-11e7-8f39-eeb7d3a2d304_story.html?utm_term=.3f7d04f79af1


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 27, 2017, 09:44:10 pm
No, this shit show is the worst.  The Senators now have to stay up all night debating a pack of stupidity so they can safe face about their devotion to a lie that breaks Trump's "better healthcare" promise.

This kind of thing leads to coups in other countries.  Merely dysfunctional would be an improvement.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 07:52:48 am
Ok, skinny repeal has died now.  It seems that the Republican healthcare plans are now all dead and they are moving forward on tax reform.

Trump will not own this, of course, and it seems to me that McCain must have been somewhat happy to stick it to him, on some level.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 28, 2017, 09:35:57 am
"Who knew healthcare was so complicated?"


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 28, 2017, 09:37:09 am
Ok, skinny repeal has died now.  It seems that the Republican healthcare plans are now all dead and they are moving forward on tax reform.
But... but... during the election trump said he had a great health care plan! It must be true because Trump would never lie!

Maybe Trump is keeping it secret and will spring it on us later.
Quote
Trump will not own this, of course, and it seems to me that McCain must have been somewhat happy to stick it to him, on some level.
Well, as I said before... it is probably beneficial for Trump, since even many of his supporters rely on Obamacare.

And have to say, McCain came through. Question is whether he voted down the bill because it was a bad bill or just to stick it to Trump.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 28, 2017, 09:40:51 am
Trump marketed himself as the Big Deal guy. The guy who makes deals. Bigly bigly deals. Yuge deals. High energy deals. He's the guy who makes deals! He says "deal" ten times every interview. Deals. Deals. He's all about deals. He (or his ghost writer, at least) wrote "The Art Of The Deal".  He's Mr Deal.

But once again he couldn't seal the deal.

SAD!

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 28, 2017, 09:41:37 am
I did a quick google on Ken Starr regarding another thread, and saw that Starr penned a blistering op-ed about Trump's treatment of Jeff Sessions.  I assume this came about because Starr heard his name mentioned as a potential replacement for Sessions, and wanted to nip that **** in the bud.
I can't understand why Starr wouldn't just jump at the chance to work for the Trump admin. Imagine how exciting it would be, working for a president that demands complete loyalty but will throw you under a bus when it suits him! Imagine the thrill of finding out that the president has made major policy decisions via twitter without consulting you!

It would be like riding a giant roller coaster, but instead of a nice gentle stop at the end you get thrown into a pile of cow dung!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 09:42:52 am
Hard to say.  By the end, the bill they had would have had to go back to Congress anyway.

They bonked the process up so badly it's hard to believe that these are experiences legislators.

The Republicans are now a party torn up from within.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 28, 2017, 09:44:19 am
Trump marketed himself as the Big Deal guy. The guy who makes deals. Bigly bigly deals. Yuge deals. High energy deals. He's the guy who makes deals! He says "deal" ten times every interview. Deals. Deals. He's all about deals. He (or his ghost writer, at least) wrote "The Art Of The Deal".  He's Mr Deal.

But once again he couldn't seal the deal.
I guess its a little different making a deal when you don't have a team of lawyers who can effectively beat up other, less wealthy people.

Quote
SAD!
This is to inform you that the term 'sad' has been trademarked by Donald J. Drumph industries, and you now owe royalties.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 09:46:24 am
My post was in response to the question on McCain's motivation.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 28, 2017, 09:49:38 am
Hard to say.  By the end, the bill they had would have had to go back to Congress anyway.

They bonked the process up so badly it's hard to believe that these are experiences legislators.

The Republicans are now a party torn up from within.
Well, for the better part of the past 8 years, the only thing that the republicans had to run on was "Oppose Obama!". When you build your politics around obstructionism its hard to bring anything useful to the table. And now that Obama (their sole focus) is gone, the have nothing left to do but wander aimlessly.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 10:29:06 am
538 has approval pegged at 38.5% which is down .5%

Doesn't sound like much, but it was at 39.5% for a little while, so this may signal erosion of base support.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on July 28, 2017, 11:30:01 am
538 has approval pegged at 38.5% which is down .5%
At least he's still popular in Russia. You know, the people who helped get him elected.

http://www.pewglobal.org/2017/06/26/u-s-image-suffers-as-publics-around-world-question-trumps-leadership/
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on July 28, 2017, 12:11:54 pm
538 has approval pegged at 38.5% which is down .5%

Doesn't sound like much, but it was at 39.5% for a little while, so this may signal erosion of base support.

That's within the margin of error...  so no change.  Don't get excited over a single percent, unless it's a clear trend over time.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on July 28, 2017, 02:08:37 pm
That's within the margin of error...  so no change.  Don't get excited over a single percent, unless it's a clear trend over time.

It's an agregator, so it doesn't really work the same way.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on July 28, 2017, 02:22:36 pm
Hard to say.  By the end, the bill they had would have had to go back to Congress anyway.

They bonked the process up so badly it's hard to believe that these are experiences legislators.

First, they were trying to do the impossible; live up to Trump's idiotic promise for way better health care at a fraction of the price. Second, the advent of the Tea Party put pressure on all Republicans to be as uncompromising as possible with the enemy (Democrats). Any senator/congressman who seemed likely to be congenial or moderate wound up facing well-funded primary challenges from the far right. Further, since most Republican congressmen are in gerrymandered districts a primary challenge is really their only fear of losing their seats. So they all began to embrace the 'hard line' attitude to protect themselves from the Tea party. Now everyone is afraid to compromise. Working with the Democrats is virtually unthinkable. It wouldn't be hard to craft a better national health care plan than Obamacare, but that would require compromise with the Democrats to fix some of the problems. That's now anathema to the Republicans. With such a small majority that means they have to have virtual unanimity on anything to get it through, and that's much harder to achieve in the senate since there isn't any gerrymandering to allow senators to ignore the will of the people with impunity.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 02:44:24 pm
That's within the margin of error...  so no change.  Don't get excited over a single percent, unless it's a clear trend over time.

Two points:

It was only 1/2 of one percent.

I think that it's the third poll showing a drop.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 28, 2017, 04:07:27 pm
Priebus fired.  Shit show goes on.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: the_squid on July 28, 2017, 06:12:08 pm
It's an agregator, so it doesn't really work the same way.

I realize that...   but its within the margin of error of any poll....  so seeing such a small change is, essentially, meaningless. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 31, 2017, 11:33:25 am
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo

Rasmussen now has trump under 40% so we're hitting Gerald Ford territory.  The full impact of last week's episode - the healthcare failure, firing Preibus, hiring The Mooch, the Trans ban - will only start to be felt now.

Paradoxically, the only Trump fans in my newsfeed seem to be most pissed off at the Trans ban. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on July 31, 2017, 02:06:51 pm
https://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/339751/after-10-days-the-mooch-is-out-at-white-house-comms-director/

And now.... The Mooch is gone...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on July 31, 2017, 06:58:54 pm


"I gotta be honest, I didn't know him that well when I hired him, I just had a gut feeling, you know? I mean, he wears nice suits, very nice suits. Good haircut, he has those dark aviator sunglasses, I like those a lot.  Fit, good looking, high-energy guy. I like guys like that. High energy, I worked with guys like that in the '80s, we got a lot done in the '80s, we did a lot of deals. Good looking wife, looks a bit like Ivanka, very attractive.  So I figured he'd be a good fit. Then he comes in and takes charge. Gets rid of Spicer, gets rid of Rince, I like that, very take charge, very high energy, lots of action.  And he did the interview with the New Yorker, talked about a lot of things, very candid, very good words, lots of good words. Very good interview. And he divorced his wife and missed the birth of his baby so that he could come be with me in Washington. That's the kind of dedication I need. That's my kind of guy.  But then I heard he gave an interview where he told people I sink 3 foot putts.  And I said what?  What is going on? And I called him up, and I said Tony! What is going on? And he said 3 foot putts. And I said No No No No No. 3 foot putts? Are you freaking kidding me, Tony? Anybody can sink 3 foot putts, Tony. You make it sound like I'm some average schmoe at the mini-golf course. I can't have you going around saying stuff like that about me. I can't have that. Tony... you're fired."

 -Trump comments on the firing of The Mooch. As I imagine it, at least. That's how it played out in my head.  I'm sure the official version is a little different, but I'm sure the truth is closer to what I wrote.




 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 01, 2017, 11:17:14 am
Well, for the better part of the past 8 years, the only thing that the republicans had to run on was "Oppose Obama!". When you build your politics around obstructionism its hard to bring anything useful to the table. And now that Obama (their sole focus) is gone, the have nothing left to do but wander aimlessly.
It looks like one republican senator might agree with me...


Jeff Flake (from: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/31/my-party-is-in-denial-about-donald-trump-215442)
...we conservatives mocked Barack Obama’s failure to deliver on his pledge to change the tone in Washington even as we worked to assist with that failure. It was we conservatives who, upon Obama’s election, stated that our No. 1 priority was not advancing a conservative policy agenda but making Obama a one-term president...It was we conservatives who were largely silent when the most egregious and sustained attacks on Obama’s legitimacy were leveled by marginal figures who would later be embraced and legitimized by far too many of us. It was we conservatives who rightly and robustly asserted our constitutional prerogatives as a co-equal branch of government when a Democrat was in the White House but who, despite solemn vows to do the same in the event of a Trump presidency, have maintained an unnerving silence as instability has ensued. To carry on in the spring of 2017 as if what was happening was anything approaching normalcy required a determined suspension of critical faculties.

It should be pointed out... right now, Flake's words just seem be be empty rhetoric. He is paying lip service when he criticizes Republican's obstructionism, but it should be pointed out that he has made little attempt to actually take action. He seemed to have no problem having Gorsuch confirmed as supreme court nominee (even though his nomination came about as a result of the republican tactics that he is condemning.) And more recently he voted for the Republican health care plan. (Had he truly been troubled by Republican tactics, he should have stood with McCain and voted it down, giving a message to Republican leadership "I cannot support partisan backroom deals".)

Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on August 02, 2017, 01:32:52 pm
I realize that...   but its within the margin of error of any poll....  so seeing such a small change is, essentially, meaningless.
That's not the way statistics work. If you have repeated independent samples from several pollsters showing the same thing, it's far more likely that's correct. Margin of error only pertains to any given poll by itself, not between polls in aggregate.

Essentially by aggregating the polls, you're putting together multiple independent samples to create a larger sample. The MoE for the aggregate would be on a much larger sample size and therefore be a lot smaller.

In other words, if a bunch of polls show the same thing, they're probably right.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on August 02, 2017, 01:34:04 pm
From my Uni days, there is an issue with averaging polls too.  But I think it's ok here.  538 weights them.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on August 03, 2017, 06:47:46 am
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo

The 538 has Trump at 37% approval now, with the latest poll showing 35%.

My theory is that his rockbed supporters only listen to each other, and that as some of them defect they will convince others.  My target approval for rock bottom is 26%, which is the percentage of Americans who believe the sun orbits the earth.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 03, 2017, 09:06:23 am
Susan Huckabee-Sanders admitted that it was totally untrue that Trump received phone calls from the Boy Scouts president congratulating him on his speech or from the president of Mexico congratulating him for security of the border.

But she insists he wasn't lying.  I am not sure how she can square that circle, but she's Mike Huckabee's little girl so she has no doubt been raised from infancy to accept contradictions without complaint.

Yep.

Also, her eyes don't point the same direction. One eye points this way, the other one points that way.



Oh by the way it's also been confirmed by Huckabee that Trump did indeed dictate Trump Jr's statement regarding the discussions with the Russians.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 03, 2017, 12:34:03 pm
Just a reminder - Trump is not your boy or mine.  I'll let the boy scout President slide, because, well, it's technically correct.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 03, 2017, 02:28:37 pm
Susan Huckabee-Sanders admitted that it was totally untrue that Trump received phone calls from the Boy Scouts president congratulating him on his speech or from the president of Mexico congratulating him for security of the border.
Speaking of the border...

Another leaked phone conversation between Trump and the Mexican president features Trump begging the mexican president not to say "Mexico won't pay for the wall".

From: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-mexican-president-stop-pay-wall/story?id=49009884
Pena Nieto said. “My position has been and will continue to be very firm saying that Mexico cannot pay for that wall." Trump responded,  “But you cannot say that to the press. The press is going to go with that and I cannot live with that. You cannot say that to the press because I cannot negotiate under those circumstances.” He went on, “But the fact is we are both in a little bit of a political bind because I have to have Mexico pay for the wall – I have to.” He suggested that both he and Pena Nieto publicly say they're still determining who will pay for the wall. He then threatened, "If you are going to say that Mexico is not going to pay for the wall, then I do not want to meet with you guys anymore because I cannot live with that."

Trump, master deal negotiator.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on August 03, 2017, 03:32:54 pm
Just a reminder - Trump is not your boy or mine.  I'll let the boy scout President slide, because, well, it's technically correct.

I have no idea what this is about or means...
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 03, 2017, 03:49:23 pm
I have no idea what this is about or means...

I already edited the post in question.  No harm, no foul - just a friendly warning.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on August 04, 2017, 05:48:27 pm
Susan Huckabee-Sanders
 -k
Sarah Huckabee-Sanders
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 04, 2017, 06:56:14 pm
Sarah Huckabee-Sanders

Susan, Sarah, whatever. Doesn't matter. In a few months she'll be polishing up her resume.  Perhaps she can go work for the "local milk people" that Trump was talking about.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 04, 2017, 09:17:51 pm
One of my few rules - don't insult the public figures by changing their names. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 04, 2017, 09:23:00 pm
Pena Nieto said. “My position has been and will continue to be very firm saying that Mexico cannot pay for that wall." Trump responded,  “But you cannot say that to the press. The press is going to go with that and I cannot live with that. You cannot say that to the press because I cannot negotiate under those circumstances.” He went on, “But the fact is we are both in a little bit of a political bind because I have to have Mexico pay for the wall – I have to.” He suggested that both he and Pena Nieto publicly say they're still determining who will pay for the wall. He then threatened, "If you are going to say that Mexico is not going to pay for the wall, then I do not want to meet with you guys anymore because I cannot live with that."

Translation: "Listen, Pedro, I said a lot of very stupid things during the campaign, but play along with me so that I don't look dumb."

The idea that Mr Pena-Nieto owes Trump any favors after all the crap Trump said about Mexicans during the past 2 years is laughable. So Trump-like.

Trump, master deal negotiator.


"I'm gonna tear up NAFTA! ...   ...  well, maybe I won't tear it up if you guys make bigly bigly concessions."

The Trumpcare negotiations were especially masterful. I liked the part where he said he'd punish Alaska if Lisa Murkowski voted against the bill in the senate.  Murkowski just won reelection for 6 more years.  The election before, the Tea Party Republicans "primaried" Murkowski and she still won the senate seat... as a write-in candidate. That's crazy!  Trump will be in jail before Murkowski has to run for election again. I doubt she's scared of him.  Trump mocked Obama for not being able to "make bigly bigly deals" to get bills through the House of Representatives and the Senate.  Trump has a majority in both and he can't get bigly bigly deals done either.  At least Obama got his healthcare bill through the House and the Senate when the Democrats had both.

And now these new transcripts... hanging up on the PM of Australia, pleading with the President of Mexico to play along... threatening to stop taking his calls if he doesn't play along... it's SAD and PATHETIC. And also hilarious.

I assume he also has other tremendous high-energy negotiating tools in his arsenal, like threatening to block people on Twitter or Unfriend them on Facebook.

The one negotiating tool he has that we know works is to threaten to declare bankruptcy to strong-arm contractors into accepting partial payment for work they did on his shitty projects. Except everybody knows the US isn't going to declare bankruptcy to welsh on its debts so that's not going to be a super-strong tactic in the international arena.

But the real comedy from the leaked transcripts was his comments to Malcolm Turnbull that the refugees are bad people and they're in prison and that they're not going to get jobs and work for the "local milk people".  Senile.

This guy is such a joke. 


 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on August 05, 2017, 05:23:10 pm
I already edited the post in question.  No harm, no foul - just a friendly warning.

How can I be warned when I have no idea what you edited or what you didn't like?
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: SirJohn on August 05, 2017, 05:25:44 pm
One of my few rules - don't insult the public figures by changing their names.

Why? I ask this because I believe that that other site started to go wrong when the moderation focused not so much on how members treated each other, but to a fanatical degree, how members referred to extraneous people like politicians, heads of the RCMP, tribal leaders, union leaders, Quebec, natives, foreigners, etc.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 05, 2017, 09:15:40 pm
How can I be warned when I have no idea what you edited or what you didn't like?

Warning is the wrong - word.  I should have said reminder.

There are 3 rules:

use proper names
don't insult eachother
don't do anything illegal. 

I wasn't meaning to bring down the hammer - I just want to keep it civil.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on August 08, 2017, 11:03:47 am
One of my few rules - don't insult the public figures by changing their names.
You have rules?

This is bullshit.  ;D
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 08, 2017, 12:52:02 pm
You have rules?

This is bullshit.  ;D

Sorry
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 08, 2017, 01:42:56 pm
One of my few rules - don't insult the public figures by changing their names.
Does that include using the president's historical name Drumph? After all, he himself said people should be proud of their heritage.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 08, 2017, 01:52:22 pm
Does that include using the president's historical name Drumph? After all, he himself said people should be proud of their heritage.

I'd prefer not, only because he doesn't call himself that.  Though, you are right, it is a historical family name. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on August 08, 2017, 02:02:24 pm
I already edited the post in question.  No harm, no foul - just a friendly warning.

I think this was me, but because the post is gone I have no idea what I said that was moderated.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 08, 2017, 04:45:39 pm
I think this was me, but because the post is gone I have no idea what I said that was moderated.

I didn't delete any posts from this thread - so I don't think it was you.  There were a few choice words replaced with the appropriate name of the person.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 09, 2017, 01:13:43 pm
Quote
Does that include using the president's historical name Drumph? After all, he himself said people should be proud of their heritage.
I'd prefer not, only because he doesn't call himself that.  Though, you are right, it is a historical family name.
Yeah but its not just that its a historical family name... its that Donald himself has actually attacked people for changing their names.

If Trump is criticizing people for not using their historical names, then isn't it morally right to expect some consistency and refer to Trump by his family's historical name?

If Jon Stewart is so above it all & legit, why did he change his name from Jonathan Leibowitz? He should be proud of his heritage!
- Donald J Trump, aka Drumph

http://www.thedailybeast.com/revisiting-donald-trumps-anti-semitic-attacks-against-jon-stewart
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 09, 2017, 01:39:55 pm
It's definitely a grey area.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 10, 2017, 03:22:10 pm
I kinda don't like the way Trump keeps playing tit for tat with Kim. It seems like he is simply falling into the nut bar blender like children in a sand box, although with much more dangerous tools in hand.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 10, 2017, 10:55:18 pm
I'd prefer not, only because he doesn't call himself that.  Though, you are right, it is a historical family name.
Yeah but its not just that its a historical family name... its that Donald himself has actually attacked people for changing their names.

If Trump is criticizing people for not using their historical names, then isn't it morally right to expect some consistency and refer to Trump by his family's historical name?

If Jon Stewart is so above it all & legit, why did he change his name from Jonathan Leibowitz? He should be proud of his heritage!
- Donald J Trump, aka Drumph

http://www.thedailybeast.com/revisiting-donald-trumps-anti-semitic-attacks-against-jon-stewart

This one always annoyed me. Trump was never named Drumpf, nor was his father or grandfather or great-grandfather... in fact the "Drumpf" surname was allegedly dropped sometime in the 1600s.  Suggesting that the guy ought to go by a surname his family dropped hundreds of years ago is asinine. Quite different from the show-biz practice of using a stage-name, as Jonathan Stuart Leibowitz (and many others) do.

The reason it annoys me is that many of us from non-English backgrounds have different surnames from what our ancestors did. Dad's Swedish grandparents adopted an Anglicized spelling of their name when they arrived in the New World. Mom's family name is 6 letters shorter than what her her Eastern European ancestors went by. I feel like if you're mocking Trump because his ancestors changed the family name in the 1600s, you're also mocking a lot of people whose families changed their names a lot more recently.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 10, 2017, 10:56:24 pm
One of my few rules - don't insult the public figures by changing their names.

In my defense, I honestly thought her name was Susan.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 10, 2017, 11:00:17 pm
Once upon a time Trump predicted that Obama would start dropping bombs in the Middle East to distract from falling poll numbers.

That's projection. That's Trump telling everybody how he thinks. He thought Obama would do that because that's what Trump would do.

And so it shouldn't be surprising that Trump has climbed into the sandbox to squabble with fellow fat-kid snowflake Kim Jong Un.

The senile motherfucker is going to start a nuclear war to distract everybody from the Russia probe.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 11, 2017, 12:11:46 am
This one always annoyed me. Trump was never named Drumpf, nor was his father or grandfather or great-grandfather... in fact the "Drumpf" surname was allegedly dropped sometime in the 1600s.  Suggesting that the guy ought to go by a surname his family dropped hundreds of years ago is asinine. Quite different from the show-biz practice of using a stage-name, as Jonathan Stuart Leibowitz (and many others) do.
First of all, while there are some reports that the Drumpf name was changed in the 1600s, there is fairly strong evidence that the change was much more recent... by his Grandfather, so while Trump may not have used the name 'Drumph', the name 'Trump' may not be that old.

http://www.snopes.com/donald-drumpf/

Secondly, the name 'Stewart' isn't just a stage name; Jon Stewart legally changed it, and while it may have benefited his career, it appears the main reason was due to a poor relationship with his father.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Stewart#Early_life

So, there are legal and moral reasons to refer to Jon as 'Stewart'. Yet Trump thought it was fair game to attempt to refer to him by a name that Stewart isn't known by legally, and who doesn't want to be referred to for personal reasons..
Quote
The reason it annoys me is that many of us from non-English backgrounds have different surnames from what our ancestors did. Dad's Swedish grandparents adopted an Anglicized spelling of their name when they arrived in the New World. Mom's family name is 6 letters shorter than what her her Eastern European ancestors went by. I feel like if you're mocking Trump because his ancestors changed the family name in the 1600s, you're also mocking a lot of people whose families changed their names a lot more recently.
No, I'm mocking Trump for being a hypocrite. If he had actually said "It made sense for Jon Stewart to change his name", I probably wouldn't be be talking about Drumph. Heck, even if he had remained silent about Stewart's name change I would have had less to criticize him for. Its the fact that he attacked others for changing their name (for reasons that were just as valid as his ancestors changing their name from Drumph to Trump) that I am criticizing him.
 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: cybercoma on August 11, 2017, 01:13:27 pm
I think this was me, but because the post is gone I have no idea what I said that was moderated.
It was me for sure. I used a different word for Huckabee.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: jmt18325 on August 11, 2017, 02:57:18 pm
Several people did things.  No harm no foul.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 13, 2017, 08:50:11 pm
Now we have a similar group of right wing knucklehead Trump supporters raoming the streets of Seattle creating a similar environment as they did in VA. I guess it's "Alt the Governments Men"
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: MH on August 14, 2017, 05:58:33 am
 Other stupidity from last week:

Exacerbating the NK nuclear threat
Military option for Venezuela
Fighting with the Senate Majority leader of his own party
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 14, 2017, 03:45:57 pm
Someone at the White House must have held Trump's feet to the fire to convince him to finally make a proper statement as to what occurred in Chancellorsville. Trump tried to redeem himself today by finally giving a statement where he did actually condemn racists, white supremacists, neo-nazis, and the like. Of course the statement fell flat, partly because he prefixed such an important issue with a ridiculous statement about the economy, but mostly because he took so long to address the real issues. A question in my mind is Trump really that ignorant and arrogant with regard to his original statement, or was there a method to his madness? I suspect the latter. He knows the people he finally identified and condemned today are a big chunk of his supporters. By not singling them out at the outset, he can deliver this totally scripted teleprompter chatter today with a "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" to them. Who the hell would need a teleprompter to deliver such statement if they were in any way sincere? I hope this disgrace drives his polls further into the ditch where they belong.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: wilber on August 14, 2017, 09:27:54 pm
He needed a teleprompter for it to be coherent English. Today's speech might actually save him more votes than he stands to keep by defending these morons.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 14, 2017, 11:51:52 pm
It seems to me there are a lot of moroms who voted for him who need to look up the word autocray. Or perhaps they already have and don't give a f**k because it suits their racist agenda. Maybe we should be thinking about a wall.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 15, 2017, 12:02:07 pm
Someone at the White House must have held Trump's feet to the fire to convince him to finally make a proper statement as to what occurred in Chancellorsville. Trump tried to redeem himself today by finally giving a statement where he did actually condemn racists, white supremacists, neo-nazis, and the like. Of course the statement fell flat, partly because he prefixed such an important issue with a ridiculous statement about the economy, but mostly because he took so long to address the real issues.
It should also be pointed out that, while Trump waited days before getting around to say "Nazis are bad, m'kay?"...

- When one of the members of his Manufacturing council resigned in protest of Trump's inaction, he launched a twitter attack within hours

- After his apology, he went on Twitter (again, after only a very short amount of time) to attack the media, calling them "truly bad people" because they criticized his handling of the events (i.e. he gave more condemnation of the media than he initially did over Nazis and KKK members.)

- Retweeted a post from a well-known alt-right racist (Jack Posobiec). Way to let the world know that you're opposed to Racism... by showing how you support people in the alt-right movement.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/346554-trump-attacks-fake-news-media-following-remarks-on-charlottesville
https://www.mediaite.com/online/twitter-goes-nuts-after-trump-retweets-pizzagate-conspiracist-jack-posobiec/

And I thought Kelly was supposed to get a handle on Trump's excesses.

Quote
A question in my mind is Trump really that ignorant and arrogant with regard to his original statement, or was there a method to his madness? I suspect the latter. He knows the people he finally identified and condemned today are a big chunk of his supporters. By not singling them out at the outset, he can deliver this totally scripted teleprompter chatter today with a "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" to them. Who the hell would need a teleprompter to deliver such statement if they were in any way sincere? I hope this disgrace drives his polls further into the ditch where they belong.
I'm sure he recognizes that the neo-nazis and racists are among his strongest supporters (and will probably be the only ones left by the time the next election comes around.) But, its also possible that Trump's inability to condemn racism is because he himself is racist and doesn't see anything wrong with it.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 15, 2017, 12:05:11 pm
Military option for Venezuela
Yup. After years of a corrupt Venezuelan government trying to blame problems on the evil United States, Trump gives them exactly what they need... real concrete proof that the U.S. wants to interfere.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 15, 2017, 03:28:36 pm
Trump just issued a statement introducing a proposed infrastructure bill and then took questions from the press. Of course there were next to no questions on the bill, mostly on Charlottesville, and he of course once again succeeded to make a complete and utter ass of himself. He went right back to reiterating his initial remarks of "all sides" which he was so roundly criticized for. He continues to indicate that he is a supporter of White Supremacy, the alt. right, and the neo-nazis. I guess America deserves the idiot they elected.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 15, 2017, 04:01:19 pm
Trump just issued a statement introducing a proposed infrastructure bill and then took questions from the press. Of course there were next to no questions on the bill, mostly on Charlottesville, and he of course once again succeeded to make a complete and utter ass of himself. He went right back to reiterating his initial remarks of "all sides" which he was so roundly criticized for. He continues to indicate that he is a supporter of White Supremacy, the alt. right, and the neo-nazis. I guess America deserves the idiot they elected.
He's gone further than that... he has also made references comparing Robert E. Lee with George Washington.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-charlottesville-george-washington-a7895401.html
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 15, 2017, 04:51:42 pm
Yes he did and he also confirmed his support for Bannon, (who of course shares his bigotry which he displayed endlessly at Breitbart) and to top it off he re-tweeted an image of a train with his name on it running over a CNN reporter. How sleazy and unpresidential would that be at any time, but especially in the wake of Charottesville!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 15, 2017, 09:49:42 pm
He's gone further than that... he has also made references comparing Robert E. Lee with George Washington.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-charlottesville-george-washington-a7895401.html

He was comparing them because they both owned slaves.  He's saying if Lee statues are taken down now, will Washington & Jefferson statues be taken down in the future because they owned slaves?  Trump is a complete racist idiot but rarely have I seen such BS media spin as this story.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 15, 2017, 10:03:57 pm
Trump just issued a statement introducing a proposed infrastructure bill and then took questions from the press. Of course there were next to no questions on the bill, mostly on Charlottesville, and he of course once again succeeded to make a complete and utter ass of himself. He went right back to reiterating his initial remarks of "all sides" which he was so roundly criticized for.

It's disturbing that Trump's default at the last press conference was to defend some of the non-violent right-wingers at the protest while going after the violent lefties...BUT his facts are correct:  there were many people among both sides that initiated violence in Charlottesville, so both sides are to blame.  That doesn't make antifa as bad as neo-nazis and KKK as a whole obviously, and antifa didn't kill anyone with a car, but violence based on hate was started by both sides, footage is all over Youtube.  Hatred of racist nazi supporters doesn't give other regular citizens like you and I the right to physically attack them.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 15, 2017, 10:25:15 pm
It's disturbing that Trump's default at the last press conference was to defend some of the non-violent right-wingers at the protest while going after the violent lefties...BUT his facts are correct:  there were many people among both sides that initiated violence in Charlottesville, so both sides are to blame.  That doesn't make antifa as bad as neo-nazis and KKK as a whole obviously, and antifa didn't kill anyone with a car, but violence based on hate was started by both sides, footage is all over Youtube.  Hatred of racist nazi supporters doesn't give other regular citizens like you and I the right to physically attack them.

Oh FFS, it's hard to believe there are those so blind/ignorant as to try and defend what Trump tries to flog when of course the videos clearly show the neo nazi assholes showing up with tiki torches in one hand and AR 15's in the other and then trying to suggest "there was trouble from both sides" Al the knuckledraggers are showing up it seems. Heil Trump!
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 15, 2017, 10:46:04 pm
Trump has no values or principles of his own.   Even the white nationalists have values and principles they stand for, as wrong as they might be.  Not Trump.  Trump's only value or principle is doing what benefits Trump.  And as far as his short-sighted thinking is concerned, standing up for these Trump Voters is what he thinks suits his interests the best.

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 15, 2017, 11:07:21 pm
Oh FFS, it's hard to believe there are those so blind/ignorant as to try and defend what Trump tries to flog when of course the videos clearly show the neo nazi assholes showing up with tiki torches in one hand and AR 15's in the other and then trying to suggest "there was trouble from both sides" Al the knuckledraggers are showing up it seems. Heil Trump!

Are you going to insult me in your self-righteousness, or are you going to actually debate me?  Insults are the same childish tactic Trump uses, so are you no better?

I'm not saying violent members of ANTIFA etc. were as bad as the violent KKK/nazis, I'm saying there were members of both sides that showed up with weapons prepared for or even looking for a fight.  The protest footage on youtube proves my point.  But please be just like Trump even more and don't let facts ruin a good narrative.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 15, 2017, 11:10:34 pm
Trump has no values or principles of his own.   Even the white nationalists have values and principles they stand for, as wrong as they might be.  Not Trump.  Trump's only value or principle is doing what benefits Trump.  And as far as his short-sighted thinking is concerned, standing up for these Trump Voters is what he thinks suits his interests the best.

I think that's giving him too much credit, I think he's standing up for the alt-right Trump voters because he feels they're right to protest the statue coming down.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: kimmy on August 15, 2017, 11:23:16 pm
I do think there's an argument that the AntiFa people went there looking for a fight.

On the other hand, I also think that there's an argument that maybe if you go around with torches and white power flags and chant Nazi slogans, you should be expecting a fight.

There's an established legal precedent in the United States, that certain speech in and of itself constitutes a breach of the peace, under the general heading "Fighting Words".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighting_words

In layman's terms: Talk Shit, Get Hit.

(http://i.imgur.com/TqIEnYB.gif)

 -k
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Omni on August 15, 2017, 11:42:59 pm
Are you going to insult me in your self-righteousness,

Standing up against racism and bigotry is hardly what anyone would/should call "self-righteousness". And no, your videos do not support your claim. Carrying nazi flags and screaming racist slogans and insults is what is mostly what is seen in those videos. And most of those people travelled in from out of state to be there to raise shit. And btw, the Lee statue wasn't about to be destroyed, it was about to be moved from a park to a museum.   
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 16, 2017, 09:15:55 am
Standing up against racism and bigotry is hardly what anyone would/should call "self-righteousness". And no, your videos do not support your claim. Carrying nazi flags and screaming racist slogans and insults is what is mostly what is seen in those videos. And most of those people travelled in from out of state to be there to raise shit. And btw, the Lee statue wasn't about to be destroyed, it was about to be moved from a park to a museum.

I condemn every single act/utterance of racism and bigotry by those rightwing protestors as well.  But I also condemn every single act of people there who initiated violence, which was mostly done by the racists it seems but also done by certain leftwing protestors.  Violence in self-defense of physical violence being imminently committed against you or possibly in response to a violent threat against you can be justified, and I'm sure there was plenty of that happening here, but there was more than that happening here.  Everything else should be handled by the police in a civil society, & the cops seemed to fail to act to stop much of the violence so they're to blame too.  We've seen in the US what happens when the law is taken into the hands of citizens, it's created a situation where everyone feels they need to own a gun to protect themselves & gun violence rates are sky high.

Here's video of a leftwing protestor attacking and macing an Alex Jones reporter simply for being associated with dumb Alex Jones.  Police do nothing: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=FLPq6Ggv7fU3S1RVffe6p64Q

Oh and defending one thing Trump said doesn't mean I defend other things he says or support him general, because I don't, he's a terrible person.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: Moonlight Graham on August 16, 2017, 09:26:58 am
There's an established legal precedent in the United States, that certain speech in and of itself constitutes a breach of the peace, under the general heading "Fighting Words".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighting_words

In layman's terms: Talk Shit, Get Hit.

If you threaten violence against someone then yeah I can see a self-defense claim on that (which as I said, I'm sure happened at the riots by the KKK/nazis).  But you shouldn't be allowed to attack someone because what they said makes you angry or offended.  Stooping to their level is just going to cause a further breakdown of civility & law and help fuel the riots we saw this week.  Martin Luther King didn't tell his supporters to start punching people.  MLK is possibly the greatest American ever, he should be the model here I think.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: dia on August 16, 2017, 10:03:22 am
I agree with MG.  White Supremacists, Nazis etc and their supporters are scum, but if an anti-fa hit first at any individual, that is on them. Non-violent confrontation is more effective at getting one's point across, imo.  Unfortunately people seem to be inherently violent, regardless of their political leanings.

Trump is still wrong for not coming down unequivocally on the alt-right.  If he had ever indicated a balanced viewpoint, then blame on both sides might possibly fly,  but his record reveals his actual intent in this instance. 
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 16, 2017, 10:36:12 am
Quote
He's gone further than that... he has also made references comparing Robert E. Lee with George Washington.
He was comparing them because they both owned slaves.  He's saying if Lee statues are taken down now, will Washington & Jefferson statues be taken down in the future because they owned slaves?  Trump is a complete racist idiot but rarely have I seen such BS media spin as this story.
That is a flawed argument.

It is true... Washington was not perfect (especially by today's moral standards). The difference is, Washington acted to improve freedom (even if not everyone benefitted equally). Robert E Lee fought for the confederacy, a group that wanted to continue the enslavement of millions.

The monuments to Washingon were not built to honor his actions regarding slavery, but to honor his actions in establishing the U.S. Monuments to confederate solders were built to honor their actions in a war to continue slavery.

Trump should have understood the difference, instead of invoking some sort of 'slippery slope' argument.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 16, 2017, 10:53:56 am
It's disturbing that Trump's default at the last press conference was to defend some of the non-violent right-wingers at the protest while going after the violent lefties...BUT his facts are correct:  there were many people among both sides that initiated violence in Charlottesville, so both sides are to blame.
The problem with that argument...

If the racists/neo-nazis did not exist, then the antifa would not exist.
If the antifa people did not exist, the racists/neo-nazis would have continued doing what they were doing.

It may not necessarily be wrong to question the activities of some of the left-wing protestors. But because of the reasons that both groups exist (one side expressing hate, the other saying hate is wrong), then ALL of the blame should go to the racists.
Title: Re: The Donald Trump Thread
Post by: segnosaur on August 16, 2017, 10:55:26 am
Which I would have come up with it, but still a funny quote:

Good to see Trump is finally acting presidential, in a Jefferson Davis sort of way.