Author Topic: Canada to Increase Defence Spending  (Read 175 times)

Offline poochy

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2017, 11:04:20 pm »
Harper committed us to it and did nothing.   


Nope, he didn't do as much as he should have even though in all likelihood if he had done a lot more you would be here complaining about that.  Did also you come to this forum with the intention of lying about everything?

Anyway, here's the information you likely already know and can't be honest about, feel free, or don't

http://www.journal.forces.gc.ca/vol16/no2/page75-eng.asp

There's also those new jets we would be getting if the opposition didn't cynically play all of the angles resulting in a weak political decision by the cons. In any case if you take a serious look at military procurement in this country it has invariably been the liberals that have made the biggest cuts and it's always more difficult to recover from cuts or disregard than it is to maintain, conservatives did slightly more than maintain, during a difficult time, should have done more.

Offline jmt18325

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2017, 12:17:36 am »

Nope, he didn't do as much as he should have even though in all likelihood if he had done a lot more you would be here complaining about that.  Did also you come to this forum with the intention of lying about everything?

Harper did a lot for the military - pre 2009 recession.  Then, he saw the political writing on the wall and abandoned them.  Canada now spends the same as it did (adjusted for inflation) as when Paul Martin was in power.

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There's also those new jets we would be getting if

If what?  The Conservatives had a majority.  There was no reason for them not to have ordered them if they actually wanted to.

Offline wilber

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2017, 02:21:51 pm »
Not to point fingers, successive governments let the military approach rust out and this was exposed by Afghanistan and such things as having to dispatch a frigate to the Middle East without a serviceable helicopter. Afghanistan forced the government to improve resources for the army and air transport at least but now that we are out of Afghanistan, we have lapsed into our old ways. 

We can't seem to continually update our military a piece at a time in order to avoid these crisis.

Offline Blueblood

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2017, 02:46:35 pm »
Not to point fingers, successive governments let the military approach rust out and this was exposed by Afghanistan and such things as having to dispatch a frigate to the Middle East without a serviceable helicopter. Afghanistan forced the government to improve resources for the army and air transport at least but now that we are out of Afghanistan, we have lapsed into our old ways. 

We can't seem to continually update our military a piece at a time in order to avoid these crisis.

As was pointed out before, Canadians don't put much thought into military unless crap hits the fan.  I agree we should properly fund the military to avoid these crises, but unfortunately things like the CBC, child tax credit, and other government spending waste are things most Canadians want over the military at our current taxation and spending levels.

Offline wilber

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2017, 02:55:48 pm »
As was pointed out before, Canadians don't put much thought into military unless crap hits the fan.  I agree we should properly fund the military to avoid these crises, but unfortunately things like the CBC, child tax credit, and other government spending waste are things most Canadians want over the military at our current taxation and spending levels.

True, but it is actually cheaper and easier to properly maintain your military instead of going from one crisis and buying panic to another. It also keeps people from getting killed and injured because they aren't properly equipped for the situations we put them in.

Offline ?Impact

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2017, 03:06:20 pm »
things like the CBC

Sad as our state of funding the military is, the funding of the CBC has been cut significantly since 2002-03. If it received the same funding increases as the military has, it would be over $2 billion today.

Offline Blueblood

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2017, 03:47:28 pm »
True, but it is actually cheaper and easier to properly maintain your military instead of going from one crisis and buying panic to another. It also keeps people from getting killed and injured because they aren't properly equipped for the situations we put them in.

Try telling that to people that want their CBC

Offline Blueblood

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2017, 03:51:14 pm »
Sad as our state of funding the military is, the funding of the CBC has been cut significantly since 2002-03. If it received the same funding increases as the military has, it would be over $2 billion today.

The CBC costs about a billion a year.  That's preposterous.  There are two alternate Canadian channels, why does CBC get funding when either tax cuts can take place or the military can be funded or the debt can be reduced.  The CBC is a luxury we can't afford.

Offline the_squid

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2017, 04:19:39 pm »
We don't need increased defence spending, but a government competent enough to spend properly.  Chrétien' and Harper's governments were awful.

Offline jmt18325

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2017, 05:21:45 pm »
We need to spend about $3 B per year more on equipment, training and readiness.  That's coincidentally, about what the Conservatives cut.  That's the problem with all of this.  They increased the size of the CF and created a plan.  They funded that plan for 3 years.  They then cut spending to Paul Martin levels.  His plan was fine too, but, the Conservatives wanted to do more.  They needed to spend more.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2017, 09:47:02 am »
We need to spend about $3 B per year more on equipment, training and readiness.  That's coincidentally, about what the Conservatives cut.  That's the problem with all of this.  They increased the size of the CF and created a plan. 

My understanding is they SAID they were going to increase the size of the CF but didn't. As far as a 'plan' went their only plan was to cut spending across the board so they could claim they had balanced the budget in time for the election. They figured that would be all it would take to get re-elected.

Offline jmt18325

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2017, 09:49:07 am »
My understanding is they SAID they were going to increase the size of the CF but didn't.

They increased the authorized strength of the forces by ~3000 people, and increased the type and amount of equipment we have.  That was great.  Then they cut the budget to exactly what it was before they did all that.  Not so great.

Offline SirJohn

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2017, 09:55:13 am »
They increased the authorized strength of the forces by ~3000 people, and increased the type and amount of equipment we have.  That was great.  Then they cut the budget to exactly what it was before they did all that.  Not so great.

Perhaps, but given the efficiency of the armed forces recruitment system it would likely have taken at least twenty or thirty years to actually achieve a significant increase in the size of the military, so I doubt that played a major part in their funding problems.

Offline jmt18325

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #28 on: February 20, 2017, 02:29:12 pm »
It's not only the people.  We didn't have heavy lift planes or helicopters before Harper.  I'm certainly not opposed to having those things.  I am opposed to buying them and then cutting funding needed to operate them.

Offline Moonlight Graham

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Re: Canada to Increase Defence Spending
« Reply #29 on: February 21, 2017, 10:43:16 pm »
I have a crazy idea.  Leave NATO, defend our borders, don't get drawn into foreign conflicts.  If we're attacked, I can guarantee the US will help defend our borders anyways, it's in their interests.  All any country has to do is defend its own borders, simple concept, and not that difficult to do compared to foreign expeditions.
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